Barbarians at the gate (barbarian build thread)


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Silver Crusade

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Gimme your best barbarian build. Not another class that acts like a barbarian, but an actual barbarian.

I'm a PFS player, so let's use those build rules:
-20 pt buy
-2 traits from 2 different trait categories
-no Rich Parents traits
-no campaign traits except the the "of the Society" from Shattered Star
-let's do this at level 12 since that's where PFS builds cap out pretty much

This is just for comparison's sake to see how different people build their barbarians. Don't worry, if barbarians aren't your thing, I'll be posting a thread for each class with a witty title like the one I used here.


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STR: 17 DEX: 12 CON: 14 INT: 10 WIS: 12 CHA: 8

You could max out strength to 18, but would then need to cut back on Int to 8 and wisdom to 10. This is more well rounded, and gives you some more skills for perception, survival, acrobatics, and whatever else you want.

Trait: Reactionary, xxxx
human: favored class bounds: 1/3 level superstition bonus
DR 6/-

1 power attack- feat , Race feat: raging vitality
2 superstition- power
3 improved sunder- feat
4 witch hunter- power
5  ERP: reckless abandon-feat
6 spell sunder-power
7 erp: beast lesser
8 beast totem
9 combat reflexes
10 greater beast totem
11 Dazing assault
12 come and get me

Use a nodachi, or a falchion if you can't. Get furious, courageous, dueling-fg, keen on it and make it +5

Normal gear: +6 enhancement bonus items for your main stats ( str>con>dex= wis)
Cloak of resistance +5
Boots of speed/ boots of striding and springing
Headband of havoc- amazing barbarian item
Cord of stubborn resolve- free rage cycling
Ring of protection
Necklace of natural armor

Since this is for PFS, the ruling-fg weapon property should be allowable, considering it came from a PFS book. It will allow your enhancement bonus from your weapon to double up ( so a +5 weapon, now gets a +10 bonus that is a luck bonus to your original enhancement...making it a +15 to certain combat manuevers, sunder being one of them, even if not listed due to writing errors).

Spell sunder is a very powerful ability, so use it wisely and with the dueling-fg enchant on your weapon, your CMB to sunder, or spell sunder will be very high, making you miss on nothing but a 1 typically.

Silver Crusade

I like that build. When I was perusing the rage powers, the beast totem powers looked pretty cool, but then I wondered how useful they would really be with how little damage the claws did. I wasn't thinking of taking the lesser totem just to get access to the others. Although now that I look again, they both get 100% of your Str modifier on damage, so they probably do more damage on average than a nodachi.

Superstition was the other rage power that was definitely on my list to take, probably at level 2.

Edit: The claws will only do more average damage than a manufactured weapon until level 5. Once you get an iterative attack the weapon surpasses the claws.


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so uh this:

Spoiler:

(NOTE: Stats other than offense breakdown are under the effects of Controlled Greater Rage)
Jarl Long-Eye
Male Human (Ulfen) Barbarian (Invulnerable Rager, Urban Barbarian) 12
NG Medium Humanoid (human)
Init +10; Senses Perception +16
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Defense
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AC 31, touch 29, flat-footed 23 (+9 armor, +8 Dex, +2 natural, +2 deflection)
hp 113 (12d12+24)
Fort +11, Ref +13, Will +6; +9 morale bonus vs. spells, supernatural abilities, and spell-like abilities but must resist all spells, even allies'
DR 12/lethal, 6/—; Resist cold 3, extreme endurance (cold)
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Offense
--------------------
Speed 30 ft.
Melee +1 Greataxe +19/+14/+9 (1d12+7/x3)
Ranged +3 Adaptive Seeking Composite longbow
+23/+18/+13 (1D8+7/x3)
+26/+21/+16 (1D8+7/x3) - Controlled Rage +6 Dex
+21 (2D8+32) +21/+16/+11 (1D8+16/x3) - Controlled Rage, Rapid Shot, Manyshot, Point Blank Shot, Deadly Aim
Special Attacks rage (25 rounds/day), rage powers (disruptive, ghost rager, quick reflexes, reckless abandon [+/-4], superstition +9, witch hunter [+4])
--------------------
Statistics
--------------------
Str 16, Dex 26, Con 14, Int 10, Wis 12, Cha 10
Base Atk +12; CMB +13; CMD 35
Feats Deadly Aim -4/+8, Disruptive, Manyshot, Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Rapid Shot, Snap Shot, Weapon Focus (Longbow)
Traits Reactionary, Uskwood Hunter (Nidal)
Skills Acrobatics +17, Climb +9, Craft (bows) -2, Diplomacy +8, Escape Artist +6, Fly +6, Intimidate +8, Knowledge (local) +7, Knowledge (nobility) +7, Linguistics +5, Perception +16, Ride +11, Stealth +18, Swim +9
Languages Common, Dwarven, Elven, Skald
SQ controlled rage, controlled rage: constitution, controlled rage: dexterity, crowd control +6, seeking
Combat Gear Potion of bull's strength, Alchemist's fire, Barbarian chew, Caltrops, Smelling salts; Other Gear Celestial armor, +1 Greataxe, +3 Adaptive, Seeking Composite longbow (Str +0), Arrows (60), Blunt arrows (40), Amulet of natural armor +2, Belt of incredible dexterity +2, Bracers of archery, greater, Cloak of resistance +1, Efficient quiver (61 @ 9.5 lbs), Handy haversack (57 @ 35 lbs), Ring of protection +2, Blanket, Chalk, Crowbar, Flint and steel, Grappling arrow, Grappling hook, Mug/tankard, Silk rope, Trail rations (5), Waterskin, 132 GP, 9 SP, 8 CP
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Special Abilities
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Controlled Rage (Ex) May gain lesser bonus split as desired, but without normal drawbacks.
Crowd Control +6 (Ex) If 2+ foes adjacent, +1 to hit & AC. Unslowed by crowds & bonus to intimidate.
Damage Reduction (12/lethal) You have Damage Reduction against non-lethal damage
Damage Reduction (6/-) You have Damage Reduction against all attacks.
Damage Resistance, Cold (3) You have the specified Damage Resistance against Cold attacks.
Deadly Aim -4/+8 Trade a penalty to ranged attacks for a bonus to ranged damage.
Disruptive Gain the Disruptive feat while raging.
Disruptive +4 DC to cast defensively for those you threaten.
Extreme Endurance (Cold) (Ex) At 3rd level, the invulnerable rager is inured to either hot or cold climate effects (choose one) as if using endure elements. In addition, the barbarian gains 1 point of fire or cold resistance for every three levels beyond 3rd. This ability
Ghost Rager (Su) While raging, the barbarian deals normal damage to incorporeal creatures even when using nonmagical weapons. She also gains a morale bonus to touch AC equal to her saving throw bonus from her superstition rage power.
Manyshot You can shoot two arrows as the first attack of a full attack action.
Point Blank Shot +1 to attack and damage rolls with ranged weapons at up to 30 feet.
Precise Shot You don't get -4 to hit when shooting or throwing into melee.
Quick Reflexes (Ex) While raging, you may make one additional attack of opportunity per round.
Rage (25 rounds/day) (Ex) +0 Str, +0 Con, +3 to Will saves, -2 to AC when enraged.
Rapid Shot You get an extra attack with ranged weapons. Each attack is at -2.
Reckless Abandon (+/-4) (Ex) Trade AC penalty for to hit bonus while raging.
Seeking Ignores miss chances, but must be aimed at the correct square.
Snap Shot Threaten squares within 5 feet of you when wielding a ranged weapon
Superstition +9 (Ex) While raging, gain bonus to save vs magic, but must resist all spells, even allies'.
Uskwood Hunter (Nidal) +1 trait bonus on Stealth checks, and Stealth is always a class skill for you.
Witch Hunter (+4) (Ex) Bonus to damage spellcasters while raging.


Your not taking the beast totem for the claws, your taking it for the level 10 rage power to pounce. You can now full attack at the end of a charge, using your falchion/ nodachi. The claws are weak for how this build is made, just use your weapon, which is better.

Silver Crusade

Grizzly the Archer wrote:
Your not taking the beast totem for the claws, your taking it for the level 10 rage power to pounce. You can now full attack at the end of a charge, using your falchion/ nodachi. The claws are weak for how this build is made, just use your weapon, which is better.

Yeah, I picked up on that. Although the claws will do more damage than a 1d10 weapon until you get your first iterative. If you got 'em, no reason not to use 'em.

And this totally makes me want to make a half-orc barbarian with the Toothy alternate racial trait. Three primary natural attacks at level 1 that all do full strength damage. That almost seems unfair.


Bigdaddyjug wrote:
Grizzly the Archer wrote:
Your not taking the beast totem for the claws, your taking it for the level 10 rage power to pounce. You can now full attack at the end of a charge, using your falchion/ nodachi. The claws are weak for how this build is made, just use your weapon, which is better.

Yeah, I picked up on that. Although the claws will do more damage than a 1d10 weapon until you get your first iterative. If you got 'em, no reason not to use 'em.

And this totally makes me want to make a half-orc barbarian with the Toothy alternate racial trait. Three primary natural attacks at level 1 that all do full strength damage. That almost seems unfair.

Yeah but giving up human gives up the ability to compete with paladin for the "best saves in the game award" ;)

Silver Crusade

Thomas Long 175 wrote:
Bigdaddyjug wrote:
Grizzly the Archer wrote:
Your not taking the beast totem for the claws, your taking it for the level 10 rage power to pounce. You can now full attack at the end of a charge, using your falchion/ nodachi. The claws are weak for how this build is made, just use your weapon, which is better.

Yeah, I picked up on that. Although the claws will do more damage than a 1d10 weapon until you get your first iterative. If you got 'em, no reason not to use 'em.

And this totally makes me want to make a half-orc barbarian with the Toothy alternate racial trait. Three primary natural attacks at level 1 that all do full strength damage. That almost seems unfair.

Yeah but giving up human gives up the ability to compete with paladin for the "best saves in the game award" ;)

This is true. Hmmmmmm....

I can't wait for some of the other classes when I post those threads. I figured I'd do 1 class per week day.


My suggestion, is forget the toothy half Orc idea. It's nice on paper, and even in combat, because there are builds that have a barbarian making 7+ attacks, all natural, from different things, tails, hooves, claw, wing, bite, and the sort. Problem is its very focused on damage where the barbarian is already a beast. The human + superstion boost to saves is HUGE. Currently my level 10 barbarian is getting a +7, +8 when using headband of havoc, that is huge on a rage., considering you will always be raging.

Door blocking a room, but you know the big bad is on the other side, rage a round before and burst through.

Your saves at even level 10 will be: base 7+ con 2 (assuming even a +2 start con), rage con bonus +2, superstition +4, human favored bonus +3= +18

That is not including magic items to boost your con stat, or items such as cloak of resistance to boost the save itself. Also, this is not including the courageous bonuses you would get from your weapon.

Instead of the rogue going into a room first sometimes, or a scout, send in the HIGH save, DR having, heavy HP barbarian who can take a whooping, and still smile at it, because he hasn't gone yet. Your damage will be impressive, and actually higher than a fighters will be if when raging, otherwise the fighter does a few more points than you would. However he will have poor saves compared to you, and so is his HP, and no dr. So I suggest that barbarians go in first, because they just can.


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I played my most favoritest barbarian in a Crimson Throne campaign that was pretty much exactly what Grizzly the Archer spelled out with only a few differences. Oh look! I have her coffee-stained character sheet in my bag!

Sydney
12th level Superstitious Barbarian

STR: 20 DEX: 12 CON: 14 INT: 10 WIS: 14 CHA: 14

Trait: whichever ones give you will bonuses
human: favored class bounds: 1/3 level superstition bonus

1 Dazzling Display- feat , Race feat: Weapon Focus (Longsword)
2 Intimidating Glare- power
3 Gory Finish- feat
4 superstition- power
5 Power Attack-feat
6 Witch Hunter-power
7 erp: Strength Surge
8 Spell Sunder-power
9 Intimidating Prowess-feat
10 Terrifying Howl- power
11 Combat Reflexes
12 Eater of Magic- power

She went in with a sword and shield without raging to get into position and lay waste to a weak enemy so she could get off gory finish. With a monster intimidate, she would get almost every living creature within 30 ft and then rage->terrifying howl to get them all panicked. From there it's chasing down the witches and warlocks and butchering them while two-handing the longsword and dropping the shield for massive damage.

She was a real pleasure to play. There was nothing better than using strength surge to boost my roll for the spell sunder on some enchanted jerk. And her will save against magic stuff was just intense.

Silver Crusade

I like the save thing. I've never built a barbarian, I just like building characters and seeing other people's ideas. That's why I'm going to make a thread for each class.


Quick rundown: barb (inv rager) 7/ cleric (crusader 5) plant domain for swift enlarge person.

20 pt buy
Str: 16
Dex: 12
Con: 16
Int: 10
Wis: 14
Cha: 8

1) barb- power attack
2) cleric- hvy armor prof
3) barb- versatile channeler
4) cleric-
5) barb- channel smite
6) cleric-
7) barb- extra channel
8) cleric-
9) barb- *whatever feats you want from there*
10) cleric-
11) barb-
12) barb-

Finish out as barb with 1 extra cleric lvl if you must.

Gear that you want is a phylactery of negative channeling to bump up your channel smite to 5d6. So basically, you enlarge + rage for high str and dmg, then channel smite for 5d6. I highly doubt you will ever fail a will save, and you can heal/ buff yourself before you smash


^ dwarf... Sorry about that.


Human Barbarian (Invulnerable Rager)
Traits: Berserker of the Society, Carefully Hidden
Favored Class Bonus: 1/3 Superstition
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Statistics
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Str 17, Dex 12, Con 16, Int 10, Wis 10, Cha 10

Level 1: Power Attack, Raging Vitality
Level 2: Lesser Beast
Level 3: Extra Rage Power: Superstition
Level 4: Reckless Abandon
Level 5: Extra Rage Power: Witch Hunter
Level 6: Spell Sunder
Level 7: Extra Rage Power: Beast Totem
Level 8: Strength Surge
Level 9: Combat Reflexes
Level 10: Greater Beast Totem
Level 11: Dazing Assault
Level 12: Come and Get Me

I'm debating whether or not to dump charisma a bit to boost Wisdom. Currently I plan to put my 4th level ability increase into Strength. I'm not yet certain where I'll put my 8th and 12th level increases.


Deane Beman, your build looks very similar to what I'm working on. Our only differences are the three abilities I highlighted below. I'm not sure I want to commit to Come and Get Me as a strategy.

I'm considering Improved Sunder, Reckless Abandon, Eater of Magic, Internal Fortitude (with a flawed ioun stone for rage cycling), and Raging Brutality as other candidates.

I'd love some feedback on this build. In particular, what to use those three slots for. I worry that Come and Get Me makes easy fights easier, and hard fights harder.

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Human Barbarian (Invulnerable Rager)
Favored Class Bonus: 1/3 Superstition
Str 17, Dex 12, Con 16, Int 10, Wis 10, Cha 10

Level 1: Power Attack, Raging Vitality
Level 2: Lesser Beast Totem
Level 3: Extra Rage Power: Superstition
Level 4: Reckless Abandon
Level 5: Extra Rage Power: Witch Hunter
Level 6: Spell Sunder
Level 7: Extra Rage Power: Beast Totem
Level 8: Strength Surge
Level 9: Combat Reflexes
Level 10: Greater Beast Totem
Level 11: Dazing Assault
Level 12: Come and Get Me
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Sznek truly fearsome Goblin barbarian and only 15 Pt buy. Look into profile you see. But Sznek is useless little Goblin without Agile AoMF! Sznek still need helm of mamoth lord to make 4 attacks.


Consider Unexpected Strike instead of Come And Get Me.
It's an oldy-but-goody from the CRB, even though Barbs didn't get much love from the forums at the time.
It's extra nice because it only has Barb Level Pre-Req 8 instead of 12, making it much more useful in PFS (and most games).
It doesn't grant 1 AoO per attack on you, but it does grant 1 AoO on threat ENTRY regardless of 5' step or anything else.
It doesn't have any AC penalty or anything else.
So it's great for using that 1 AoO to Knockback an incoming attacker so they can't attack you.
Going with that approach could mean that Combat Reflexes is less important, as well, opening other options.
And it's also convenient because you can use it not just when you personally are being attacked (like CaGM),
but an enemy can provoke (under it's new broader terms) while trying to go after your caster ally,
and you can interrupt that and possibly prevent them from doing what they want to.
Unless a fight is totally static, characters will be moving around (at least 5' steps), which triggers Unexpected Strike.
Along with Knockback, picking up Improved Bullrush could make sense, and that is the Pre-Req for Rhino Charge from Sargava Companion, a great little Feat that let's you Ready a Partial Charge (still leaving your normal Move Action).


I'm seeing a lot of folks picking Pounce and charge attacks in the Barbarian builds. While I'm a big fan of charging attacks, it just seems in my opinion, over half of PFS fights discourage charging. Due to either terrain, junk in the way, or your fellow pathfinders being in the way.

So in my opinion, it's just not worth the feat investments for a attack you'll end up using so little on. It's a balancing at, do I take Pounce that I'll use around once a fight (on average) vs something that I'll use more often?


This is the build I use 1-20. The Fighter levels come at 5th and 20th.
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Human 2nd level Unbreakable Fighter / 18th level Invulnerable Rager & Urban Barbarian
Heart of the Fields alternate racial trait, Human favored class option for Barbarians

Attributes: (20 point buy)
STR - 15 (+2 racial bonus, +1 at 4th, 8th, 12th, 16th and 20th)
DEX - 14
CON - 14
INT - 14
WIS - 12
CHA - 7

Traits:
Threatening Defender (reduce Combat Expertise penalties by 1)
Auspicious Tattoo (+1 Will saves)

Feats & Rage Powers by level:
1st - Combat Expertise
1st - Power Attack
2nd - Superstition
3rd - Combat Reflexes
4th - Lesser Beast Totem
5th - Stalwart
5th - Diehard
5th - Endurance
7th - Deadly Aim
7th - Reckless Abandon
9th - Extra RP: Extra DR
9th - Beast Totem
11th - Improved Stalwart
11th - Greater Beast Totem
13th - Dazing Assault
13th - Come and Get Me
15th - Extra RP: Extra DR
15th - Extra DR
17th - Extra RP: Eater of Magic
17th - Witch Hunter
19th - Extra RP: Strength Surge
19th - Auspicious Mark
20th - Improved Initiative

Skills: (6 ranks/level)
Climb* - 1/odd level
Swim* - 1/even level
Ride* - 1/level after 1st
Handle Animal* - 1/1st level
Knowledge: Nature* - 1/level after 1st
Survival* - 1/level
Stealth - 1/level after 1st
Perception* - 1/level after 1st
Craft: Stonemason* - 1/1st level (+1/2 character level)

Diehard and Endurance are the pre-requisites for Stalwart and eventually Greater Stalwart which gives you a substantial boost of DR at the cost of attack accuracy. Reckless Abandon trades that accuracy for AC and Beast Totem trades that AC for nothing, meaning that collectively you get a big boost in DR for nothing.

Deadly Aim, Reckless Abandon and the ability to boost your Dex make you a credible ranged threat when times call for it.

He carries both a Bardiche and a Greatsword so that he has the proper weapon on hand to be able to use Come and Get Me to maximum effectiveness. And speaking of which, when using Come and Get Me, Dazing Assault resolves before your opponents attack, meaning that when it goes off as a result of an AoO, he never gets to actually make the attack. At low levels he focuses on the Bardiche, using Combat Reflexes to get extra attacks and the claws he gains from Lesser Beast Totem for adjacent AoO's.

The human bonus to Superstition makes your saves ridiculous for those who try to magic you out of the fight.

Strength Surge, Eater of Magic and Auspicious Mark all kick in right when you gain the ability to Rage cycle. Auspicious Mark + Focused Rage give you all kinds of useful boosts to skills, checks, saves, etc.

He has a broad range of useful skills so that he's not a pure combat machine.

I never pre-plan magic items as part of my build, but at 12th level, these are his combat stats before any magic items are:

Attack: +16/+11/+6
+12/+7/+2[BAB] +5[STR] +3[Rage] -3[Expertise] -4[Power Attack] +3[Reckless]
Damage: 1d10+24
1d10[Bardiche] +7.5[STR] +4.5[Rage] +12[Power Attack]
HP 107 (1d10+11d12+24), AC 18, DR 14/-
Fort +11, Ref +5, Will +5
(+7 saves vs. Spells & Spell-like abilities)

Obviously, the inclusion of magical items jumps a lotof those stats up significantly, but DR 14/- at that level is almost game-breaking and by 16th level it jumps to 20/-. Note also that due to the level dip in Unbreakable Fighter, I do not get the Dazing Assault/Come and Get Me combo until 13th level.


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Hey Grizzly The Archer, your build is pretty much THEE quintessential barbarian build. Most other builds are either a derivative of it or are compared against it.
Me? I like the different builds :)

I often do a dip in fighter when building a barbarian as it can get you some much needed feats easier/quicker. Other than that, I usually stick barbarian :)

A few quick build ideas (dont have time to flesh them out completely)
Half-orc breaker barbarian
Gate Breaker trait, get sunder line of feats, destroyers blessing, vital strike, furious finish, strength surge, hive totem, smasher, spell breaker, chord of stubborn resolve and maul of the titans. Your sunder will be sky high, you regain rage every time you sunder, hive totem is grand for maneuver builds (up to +10 to your CMB), chord lets you ragecycle, furious finish makes you deal max damage always, maul of the titans deals triple damage on a sunder. Dont remember when, but somewhere around 13-15 you can walk through walls all day, every day and (if memory serves me correctly) you can even reach the 540 hp mark of hewn stone at some point :)

Dwarven barbarian
Steel soul, glory of old trait, superstition.
You are magic immune at level 2 XD +7 to all your saves makes you equivalent to a 10th level monk in that department.

Human/Half-Orc Invulnerable barbarian
1 level of unbreakable fighter for endurance and diehard, 2 if you want the extra feat/unflinching.
Get Deathless Initiate, Deathless master, stalwart/imp, combat expertise, grudge fighter, fast healing (the feat) dragon totem/resiliency/wings, extra DR (if you want), renewed vigor/regenerative vigor and a high con score. You can have up to 19 +1/2 level DR and 28+level fire resistance, fast healing 2 +1/2 con a turn. Add in superstitious/ghost rager and you are resistant to spells/touch attacks and add in courageous weapon for +1 or 2 to saves, touch AC, strength, con, will saves, to hit/damage and saves vs fear, paralysis and sleep.
Note that the multiple save bonuses wont stack but they can come in at different times (a mundane fear effect for instance) and the bonus to hit/damage is only against someone who hit you first :)
Also you would need the racial heritage feat if your human
This gets the most out of the courageous property and makes you nigh unkillable, high DR, saves, hps, element resist and passive healing (5hp a turn mebby?). The main thing you would have to worry about would be a vorpal weapon...

Fiend totem powers +Hamatula Hide (armour) =porcupine.
Anyone attacking you takes 1d6+2d8+6 damage, good creatures around you take 2d6 damage, all non-evil creatures are automatically shaken, gain fire resist 20 and a bit of AC. Works well with terrifying howl as all creatures are automatically shaken. If you can get an elemental aura cast you you, even better :) Also works well with come and get me.

Human/half-orc mounted fury barbarian
Ferocious mount/trample is amazing. your mount can rage, gain rage powers, trample and get many overrun attacks. overbearing advance grants your mount extra damage equal to its str during overrun attempts so in effect you can trample for 2d8 +2 1/2 str, and your str should be massive. Add in hive totem (for higher overrun CMB) or fiend totem (for double the damage as above, dealt by you and your mount) or spirit totem (for double aoe damage again) or dragon totem/spirit steed (for good DR for you and your mount). For feats take trample and beast rider (if half-orc) or celestial servant (if assimar)(mounted onslaught is redundant with ferocious trample). Have your mount take improved/greater overrun and ability focus.
You might want a level in mammoth rider for a huge mount and/or beast rider (cavalier) for a more exotic mount.
Then just hang on while your mount runs roughshod over everything!

I got more, but I gotta get going so enjoy those!


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The thing I notice is that people ALWAYS go for the beast totem as if there was no other options.
Beast Totem is great (pounce is friggen awesome) but other totems also have their uses.

Dragon Totem. +6 DR and double your DR as elemental resistance! If you are going stalwart, this stacks so much better than beast totem. True, you lose pounce but get over it :P You also can fly when you need it. With this your max DR jumps up to 19 +1/2 level or 29 at level 20 AND 58 fire resist... 58...

Hive Totem.This gives you ut to +5 to str ability checks (witch maneuvers are) and CMD, resilience gives you up to +5 on CM checks and +5 CMD against grappling. Ignore the swarm part, thats gravy. Ignore the toxicity power, its unnecessary but you can take it if you plan on biting anyways. This is great for builds that plan on using maneuvers and in that regard, better than beast totem, you also get what you need by lvl 6 (compared to 10).

Fiend Totem. Is good for a turtling barbarian, especially with Hamatula Hide. Instead of jumping out and demolishing 1 target to make people focus on you, you make it so no one WANTS to attack you but have little choice because you are in their face and hey, you are a barbarian.
If your GM is willing to allow this to be turned into barding you also got the special ability to combine this with the furious mount line of powers, allowing both you and your mount to deal aoe damage and punish attackers painfully. It also works well with terrifying howl.

Spirit Totem. This one is sadly more flavourful than practical but for a character built for it (intimidate build, performance build), it can be a way to add extra damage while you do other things (terrifying howl, dazzling display ect). Honestly beast is better 90% of the time :(

I never did figure out what to do with World Serpent Totem :P

I guess I am just tired of seeing beast totem everywhere, even when it is not the best, just because it is the most common.


Gobo Horde wrote:

Human/Half-Orc Invulnerable barbarian

1 level of unbreakable fighter for endurance and diehard, 2 if you want the extra feat/unflinching.
Get Deathless Initiate, Deathless master, stalwart/imp, combat expertise, grudge fighter, fast healing (the feat) dragon totem/resiliency/wings, extra DR (if you want), renewed vigor/regenerative vigor and a high con score. You can have up to 19 +1/2 level DR and 28+level fire resistance, fast healing 2 +1/2 con a turn. Add in superstitious/ghost rager and you are resistant to spells/touch attacks and add in courageous weapon for +1 or 2 to saves, touch AC, strength, con, will saves, to hit/damage and saves vs fear, paralysis and sleep.

Has it been determined definitely that Dragon Resistance increases DR and not merely energy resistance?

Even if it does, its still a waste because you ALSO have to grab Animal Fury and Intimidating Glare, which leaves little room for everything else...


Gobo Horde wrote:
I guess I am just tired of seeing beast totem everywhere, even when it is not the best, just because it is the most common.

Its the best for me. I use Lesser Beast Totem to give me claws so that I can target adjacent foes when using a reach weapon, Beast Totem gives me an AC bonus to offset Reckless Abandon and Greater Beast Totem grants pounce which has proven itself to be very useful to me.


so uh, the thing I did without beast totem


Seems to me that most people are throwing out the build that was developed by StrRanger and a few others a while back (Barbarians Once and Future Kings thread). That build works great (I have mine at lvl 12 in PFS) but you have to work on alternative defenses in order to survive. Between Reckless abandon, CaGM, Rage, Pounce, etc. your AC is pretty bad. The best way to counter that is your DR, HP, Fortification armor, and some form of percent miss chance (concealment, blur, blink, etc).


Lab_Rat wrote:
Seems to me that most people are throwing out the build that was developed by StrRanger and a few others a while back (Barbarians Once and Future Kings thread). That build works great (I have mine at lvl 12 in PFS) but you have to work on alternative defenses in order to survive. Between Reckless abandon, CaGM, Rage, Pounce, etc. your AC is pretty bad. The best way to counter that is your DR, HP, Fortification armor, and some form of percent miss chance (concealment, blur, blink, etc).

That's one of the many reasons I added Urban Barbarian to Invulnerable Rager.

Sure I have high DR, but I didn't want to absolutely tank my AC, so I get to skip the AC penalty via Focused Rage AND Beast Totem makes up for the AC penalty brought on by Reckless Abandon. Moreover, when the situation calls for it, I can boost my Dex instead of my Str and gain additional AoO's as well as a better AC.

As for StrRanger and other builds, I can tell you that this one was developed from scratch and posted by me some time ago, and while I've seen Barbarian builds use the Stalwart line with the Unbreakable dip since, I had never seen it used before then.


Blueluck wrote:

Deane Beman, your build looks very similar to what I'm working on. Our only differences are the three abilities I highlighted below. I'm not sure I want to commit to Come and Get Me as a strategy.

I'm considering Improved Sunder, Reckless Abandon, Eater of Magic, Internal Fortitude (with a flawed ioun stone for rage cycling), and Raging Brutality as other candidates.

I'd love some feedback on this build. In particular, what to use those three slots for. I worry that Come and Get Me makes easy fights easier, and hard fights harder.

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Human Barbarian (Invulnerable Rager)
Favored Class Bonus: 1/3 Superstition
Str 17, Dex 12, Con 16, Int 10, Wis 10, Cha 10

Level 1: Power Attack, Raging Vitality
Level 2: Lesser Beast Totem
Level 3: Extra Rage Power: Superstition
Level 4: Reckless Abandon
Level 5: Extra Rage Power: Witch Hunter
Level 6: Spell Sunder
Level 7: Extra Rage Power: Beast Totem
Level 8: Strength Surge
Level 9: Combat Reflexes
Level 10: Greater Beast Totem
Level 11: Dazing Assault
Level 12: Come and Get Me
----------------------------------------------------------------------

That's a legitimate worry, especially when you don't have your DR raised as high as you can. Consider it situational, ideal at times, less so at others.

Speaking of situational, I know that Spell Sunder/Strength Surge is all the *ahem* rage in certain circles, but I just don't find it useful often enough to invest so many feats in it. Sure it becomes even better when you can use magic items to 'cheat' and Rage cycle at low levels, but then the build becomes item dependent, and a little cheese-dependent too, which I try to avoid.

I'd encourage you to at least consider this build, 1-12 (even though it really tops out at 13th):

Attributes: (20 point buy)
STR - 15 (+2 racial bonus, +1 at 4th, 8th, 12th)
DEX - 14
CON - 14
INT - 14
WIS - 12
CHA - 7

Traits:
Threatening Defender (reduce Combat Expertise penalties by 1)
Auspicious Tattoo (+1 Will saves)

Feats & Rage Powers by level:
1st - Combat Expertise
1st - Power Attack
2nd - Superstition
3rd - Combat Reflexes
4th - Lesser Beast Totem
5th - Stalwart
5th - Diehard
5th - Endurance
7th - Deadly Aim
7th - Reckless Abandon
9th - Extra Rage Power: Extra DR
9th - Beast Totem
11th - Improved Stalwart
11th - Greater Beast Totem

You use a reach weapon like a Bardiche (and your claws for adjacent targets of course), have a much higher DR and can still be effective at range. If that's not important to you, that 'Deadly Aim' slot could be used for a host of other things...


Can we discuss the merits (or lack thereof) of Raging Vitality? I see it left off of many builds but proponents of the feat consider it a death wish if you don't take it.


I've had an idea for a character banging around the back of my head for awhile: A halfling frontline thug.
Essentially he was the biggest toughest halfling in his isolated halfling village and now he's out in the real world.
I toyed around with a fighter build, but kept getting pushed towards more dex, more defense and away from the kind of thug I wanted. I think a barbarian may work better. Definitely a 2-handed Strength based melee character. That's pretty much the point of the concept.

I know he's not going to be the toughest barbarian around. Or even the most optimized halfling barbarian (you could probably do something interesting with finesse, Agile and an Urban Barbarian). But I'd like to get him up to viable. :)

Any thoughts on how to adopt some of these builds for a little guy?

Mostly, I'm not familiar enough with the Rage Powers to know how they synergize and what would work well for him.


Lab_Rat wrote:
Seems to me that most people are throwing out the build that was developed by StrRanger and a few others a while back (Barbarians Once and Future Kings thread).

what the-

the thing that I did
up there
it is a thing that is not involved with beasts or totems


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Deane Beman wrote:
Can we discuss the merits (or lack thereof) of Raging Vitality? I see it left off of many builds but proponents of the feat consider it a death wish if you don't take it.

It helps give another 1 HP per level to your rage HP you gain. It also helps out when you get below 0hp to allow you to continue raging, thus keeping your higher HPS stilled,mane not dropping them off, and thus practically killing you. I recommend it for those 2 actual reasons alone.

However, another good reason that many people miss is that it works well with raging brutality. Raging brutality will allow you to spend rage rounds to get your con modifier to be added to your damage rolls. With rqging vitality, that damage is increased by 1, and if 2 handed weapons are used, an additional .5 Dmg for every 1 damage additional.

Makes my barbarian throwing hammer build ridiculous, with deadly aim, raging brutality, 2handed thrower, rage, and so forth.

@gobo: thanks for the praise. I had only made the barbarin about 2 years ago, and had not seen some of the other barbarian builds, especially fully fleshed out ones. At the time, everyone was doing either the huge rage cycling half Orc for deathless stuff, or the ragepouncelance builds, that don't actually function. This build seemd like a happy medium of all the best barbarian stuff, smoothed out nicely. I also enjoy Diferent builds, but until now, I had never played a barbarian, some wanted to see what all the hype, fun, and talk was about. Loving it every moment.


Matt2VK wrote:

I'm seeing a lot of folks picking Pounce and charge attacks in the Barbarian builds. While I'm a big fan of charging attacks, it just seems in my opinion, over half of PFS fights discourage charging. Due to either terrain, junk in the way, or your fellow pathfinders being in the way.

So in my opinion, it's just not worth the feat investments for a attack you'll end up using so little on. It's a balancing at, do I take Pounce that I'll use around once a fight (on average) vs something that I'll use more often?

I understand your concern, and since I'm considering a three-power investment myself, I'll look at a few parts individually.

Encounter Design
My experience with Pathfinder published fights consists of a half dozen PFS games and two Adventure Paths. In general I see:

  • Home made encounters = very few obstacles to charging
  • Adventure Paths = some obstacles to charging
  • PFS Scenarios = many obstacles to charging
It seems like Paizo uses the PFS scenarios as a place to show off interesting encounter design. I think that's a good strategy on their part, but it could also make a charge-based character sad.

Fellow Pathfinders
While this can occasionally be a problem, the groups I play with usually have it straightened out by third level. Knowing your party members' abilities and accommodating them is Battle Tactics 101.
"Leave a line of charge for the barbarian." is comparable to
"5' step to help the rogue get flanking." or
"Stay within 30' of the witch."
Of course, it is dependent upon your group, and I can see why many PFS games could cause difficulties. Most PFS games have rotating membership, and the ones I've played all had large parties, leading to a situation where party coordination was more troublesome than in a typical "home game".

Level
Pounce becomes available at level 10, but gets better with every attack added to your full-attack routine: level 11, level 16, and Haste. At level 11 with Haste on (Haste, Blessing of Fervor, Boots of Speed, whatever) that full-attack with +2 hit from charging is 4 attacks in place of 1. That's a huge difference!

I don't mean to be too rough on PFS, but it caps out at level 12, and usually takes place from level 1-8. Pounce starting at level 10 just won't be a factor very often.

The Rest of the Time
Assuming the wants-to-charge barbarian is in a typical 4-5 person party, in which he travels at the front, many fights will begin with an opportunity to charge. After the initial charge, only 10' of space is needed to set up a second charge, and 5' allows a full attack without charging. So, barring someone (intentionally or unintentionally) interfering with your charges, every round of combat should allow a full attack.

Final Assessment
I would not pursue Animal Totem with a PFS character.
I would pursue Animal Totem for an Adventure Path, expected to run through its conclusion, played with a group of 4 well-coordinated characters.


Wiggz wrote:
Blueluck wrote:
I'd love some feedback on this build. In particular, what to use those three slots for. I worry that Come and Get Me makes easy fights easier, and hard fights harder.
That's a legitimate worry, especially when you don't have your DR raised as high as you can. Consider it situational, ideal at times, less so at others...I'd encourage you to at least consider this build, 1-12

How many fighter levels does your build use? I recognize that it's excellent at what it does, maximize DR and AOO.

Shadow Lodge

This seems Like fun, this is my pirate captian thats been leading the charge into battle. Love this guy except he doesn't have enough skills for my play style.

Str 13
Dex 18
Con 14
Wis 10
Int 10
Cha 12

HP:111

Attack: 22/17/12 Damage 1d6+17 15-20*2 with his +1 Keen Furious Scimitar and his belt of Dex +2

Vagabond: Disable Device
Barroom Tale Spinner

1Supersticious Urban Weapon Finess, Power Attack
2Supersticious Urban Rage Power: Superstisious
3Unarmed Fighter Improved Unarmed Strike, Crane Style, Dervish Dance
4Supersticious Urban
5Supersticious Urban Dodge Rage Power: Reckless Abandon
6Unarmed Fighter Crane Wing
7Supersticious Urban Leadership
8Supersticious Urban Rage Power: Witch Hunter
9Supersticious Urban Crane Ripost
10Supersticious Urban Rage Power: Spell Sunder
11Supersticious Urban Combat Reflexes
12Supersticious Urban Rage Power: Eater of Magic

With a Celestial Shirt he is rocking a AC for 31 while raging and can deflect an attack a round. Has a good diplomacy insane acrobatics and decent perception.


Deane Beman wrote:
Can we discuss the merits (or lack thereof) of Raging Vitality? I see it left off of many builds but proponents of the feat consider it a death wish if you don't take it.

Urban Barbarians don't suffer the crash of 'fake' hit points so I didn't think it was needed with my build, especially with Diehard already in place.


Blueluck wrote:
Wiggz wrote:
Blueluck wrote:
I'd love some feedback on this build. In particular, what to use those three slots for. I worry that Come and Get Me makes easy fights easier, and hard fights harder.
That's a legitimate worry, especially when you don't have your DR raised as high as you can. Consider it situational, ideal at times, less so at others...I'd encourage you to at least consider this build, 1-12
How many fighter levels does your build use? I recognize that it's excellent at what it does, maximize DR and AOO.

Over the life of the build, once at 5th level and once at 20th.

Once the character gains Dazing Assault and Come and Get Me at 13th, he starts carrying a Bardiche and a Greatsword strapped across his back, primarily so that he can use reach or not depending on the threats he faces. If you think about the way Come and Get Me works, its pretty much necessary unless you're throwing around a Dorn Dergar.

What I like about the character is that he's not a one-trick pony. He's a credible ranged threat, has a solid skill set and can be both aggressively offensive or protectively defensive based on the circumstances.

As an aside, I go back and forth all the time over 'Dazing Assault' and 'Raging Brutality'... both have excellent arguments to be made for this build and both have downsides.


Dazing assault and raging brutality, even reckless abandon are 3 abilities, once gained, that is all dependent on the situation. Fighting other melee combatants, dazing assault probably won't be best, not only for the low fort save, but even the -5 to hit will hurt vs them. Fighting non-melee brutes, or high fort characters, then daze assault away. They have to fail on just one save. You force them to make a save with each attack.

Raging brutality, for the 3 rage rounds, in my mind is pretty much worth it, unless you are low on rage rounds. One way mitigate the downside of the rage round expenditure, is get the trait optimistic gambler. The trait allows you to continue all morale bonuses, which includes your rage bonuses, superstition and such, for 1d4 rounds. Since you can use that to continue your higher str, and con, you can need your rage, even in combat, to help stretch out rage rounds. These two things, optimistic gambler+ raging brutality pretty much guarantees most of the time that you will be adding your con modifier to your damage rolls.

Reckless abandon again as the other two, is dependent on the availability of the situation. Vs high hitters (strong enemies) I'd use it, because they will still hit you, so you MIT as well get the ability to have a better chance to hit them. VS. weak/caster type/squishy enemies, I wouldn't use it unless needed. Keeping the higher AC will make it harder for them to hit you, and you won't really need that higher to hit bonus. But if you think you do, just use it no big deal.

Dark Archive

Breathing some life back into this thread, as it were.

Grizzly: optimistic gambler would extend your rage bonuses, but wouldn't actually extend your rage. you would still be exhausted, but with bonuses to CON/STR.


Argus The Slayer wrote:

Breathing some life back into this thread, as it were.

Grizzly: optimistic gambler would extend your rage bonuses, but wouldn't actually extend your rage. you would still be exhausted, but with bonuses to CON/STR.

Exhausted? Why not fatigued?


Unless of course you had a way to work around fatigue, like a cord of stubborn resolve.

Also, you might not use a once per rage power every round so using optimistic gambler when you need it, in between those round is beneficial.

Dark Archive

Sorry, Blue - was thinking fatigued but typed exhausted.

I hadn't seen the Cord before, Griz: that's pretty efficient for rage cycling, but a tough call between that and a DEX/STR belt for a Barbarian, IMO.


I don't see why you can't combine them, especially when multiple belts provide the same bonus. Still for barbarians before level 17 it's practically a must.


Grizzly the Archer wrote:
I don't see why you can't combine them, especially when multiple belts provide the same bonus. Still for barbarians before level 17 it's practically a must.

Rage cycling can be a great trick, but it's definitely necessary to making a strong barbarian. I have an 11th level Barbarian with Heart of the Fields as my only method to rage cycle (1/day) and I rarely even use that.

My 1/rage powers:
Spell Sunder - Some uses are outside of combat, an in combat there aren't that many spells worth sacrificing a round of attacking for.
Eater of Magic - With Superstition, I rarely fail a save while raging, let alone twice!
Strength Surge - I only use this with Spell Sunder or outside of combat.
Unexpected Strike - This is the only one I'd like to cycle more, but even this one is rare. Once an enemy is engaged, they're just as likely to provoke by moving out of a square as into it.


Sunder is an attack, a single attack, not a full round or standard. As such, if your DM is liberal, you can get off multiple spell sunders in a round, not just one.

Silver Crusade

Grizzly the Archer wrote:
I don't see why you can't combine them, especially when multiple belts provide the same bonus. Still for barbarians before level 17 it's practically a must.

For the purposes of this thread, a PFS barbarian, you can't combine them because custom mgic items are illegal in PFS. For a home game, you certainly could combine them by paying a total of 38,500 gp for a Cord of Stubborn Resolve (Str +4).


Human lvl 12 Barbarian Invulnarable Ranger

Attributes: (20 point buy)
STR - 14
DEX - 10
CON - 21 (18 +3 lvs)
INT - 14
WIS - 10
CHA - 10

Racial Trait:
Heart of the Wilderness: half their character
level to their Constitution score when determining the
negative hit point total necessary to kill them.

Feats:
1st - Endurance
1st - Diehard
3rd - Combat Expertise (-4 attack + 4dodge)
5th - Stalwart (-4 dodge + 4 RD)
7th - Deathless Initiate (fight at negative hp)
9th - Toughness
11th - Improved Stalwart (-4 dodge + 8 RD)

Rage Powers:
2 - guard life
4 - Renwed Vigor
6 - Gaurd life, greater
8 - increased damage reduction
10 - increased damage reduction
12 - increased damage reduction

Rage Rounds: 31

positive HP:203 (d12 +1favorite class + 1toughness + 8cons(with rage))
0 HP: convert 24 damage points to nonlethal (guard life)
negative HP: -34 (diehard, deathless initiate)

RD: 17/-

Attack:+13/+8 ( 12 + 5 - 4)
Greatsword: 2d6 + 7 (next lv 2d6 + 19(Raging Brutality feat))

Dark Archive

Leonardo: you have created a durable Barbarian that does very
sub-par damage. What is the purpose of the build?


Argus The Slayer wrote:

Leonardo: you have created a durable Barbarian that does very

sub-par damage. What is the purpose of the build?

His name is Scar and he never retreat xD.

The damage will rise in the next lvs to 5hits + come and get with 4d6 + 50 damge. For now you can trade toughness(-12hp) for power attack (+12damage).
Lv12 2d6 + 19
Lv13 2d6 + 31 without itens.


Superstition is a trap in my eyes.
You are so great you can't be healed, don't receive the haste and can't be saved with teleporter you fail the combat.... It's. mix boon


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Here's mine. He's as powerful and versatile and especially survivable a build as I've ever put together.
.
.
.
.
Human 2nd level Unbreakable Fighter / 18th level Invulnerable Rager & Urban Barbarian
Heart of the Fields alternate racial trait, Human favored class option for Barbarians

Attributes: (20 point buy)
STR - 15 (+2 racial bonus, +1 at 4th, 8th, 12th, 16th and 20th level)
DEX - 14
CON - 14
INT - 14
WIS - 12
CHA - 7

Traits:
Threatening Defender (reduce Combat Expertise penalties by 1)
Auspicious Tattoo (+1 Will saves)

Feats & Rage Powers by level:
1st - Combat Expertise
1st - Power Attack
2nd - Superstition
3rd - Combat Reflexes
4th - Lesser Beast Totem
5th - Stalwart
5th - Diehard
5th - Endurance
7th - Deadly Aim
7th - Reckless Abandon
9th - Extra RP: Extra DR
9th - Beast Totem
11th - Improved Stalwart
11th - Greater Beast Totem
13th - Dazing Assault
13th - Come and Get Me
15th - Extra RP: Extra DR
15th - Extra DR
17th - Extra RP: Flesh Wound
17th - Witch Hunter
19th - Extra RP: Eater of Magic
19th - Strength Surge
20th - Improved Initiative

Skills: (6 ranks/level)
Climb* - 1/odd level
Swim* - 1/even level
Ride* - 1/level after 1st
Handle Animal* - 1/1st level
Knowledge: Nature* - 1/level after 1st
Survival* - 1/level
Stealth - 1/level after 1st
Perception* - 1/level after 1st
Craft: Stonemason* - 1/1st level (+1/2 character level)

Damage Resistance 14 at 12th level, 20 at 16th. Pounce, Dazing Assault and Come and Get Me make him devastating in combat. Deadly Aim, Focused Rage and Reckless abandon makes him a solid ranged threat when the situation calls for it. All the 'once per rage' goodies when Rage cycling becomes an option. More skills than most melee types and ridiculous saves, particularly against magic.

The Fighter levels come at 5th and at 20th level.

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