So I started trying to read through this whole thread and made it 5 pages in before I had an idea for a rogue that I hadn't seen yet. I have no idea if it has been presented in the 1400+ posts, but:
Antipaladin 2/ Rogue 6 or Paladin 2/ Rogue 6 if you want to be a nice guy.
I also chose halfling (Edit: with the Fleet of Foot racial trait to get 30 base speed) using standard WBL, but this could easily be done with any versatile +2 race with some slight changes.
Str: 12 Dex: 20 Con: 14 Int: 8 Wis: 12 Cha: 18
HP: 64 AC: 25 FF: 20 Touch: 17 Initiative: 11 Fort: 12 Dex: 12 Will: 11
Feats/Rogue Talents: Point Blank Shot(1), Precise Shot(Class), Snap Shot, Ranged Flank, Sniper's Eye, Improved Initiative, Hard to Fool
Gear: +2 Comp. Longbow (+2), +1 Mithril Breastplate, Headband of CHA +2, +1 Amulet of Natural Armor, +1 Cloak of Resist, Bracers of Lesser Archery, +2 Belt of Dex, Ring of Protection +1, MW Thieves' Tools, mundane gear.
Attack Sequence: +13/8 1d6+3d6+3 with sneak attacking
I really like this build and actually have something similar except as a melee build as a back up for a Skull and Shackles campaign I'm playing in. It gives you some party face options, scouting ability, utility with UMD, and an okay attack sequence with pretty good survivability and a solid initiative. Also, the Paladin/Antipalidin levels fixes any sort of save issues and gives you a chance to smite once a day and a free archery feat.
I ran these four characters through PFS Scenario 4-24: Glories of the Past Part 2: The Price of Friendship. Warning now, there will obviously be spoilers ahead and what will undoubtedly be an incredibly long post...
Dwarf Warpriest of Torag HP- 67 Initiative- 3 Armor Speed: 20
AC: 28(10 armor+5 shield+1 Dex+1 Nat Armor+1 Deflection)
Feats: Toughness, Weapon Focus(warhammer), Power Attack, Skill
Gear: +2 Warhammer, +1 Full Plate, +2 Heavy Steel Shield, +2 Headband of CHA, Amulet of Nat Armor +1, +2 Cloak of Resistance, +2 Belt of STR, Ring of Protection +1
Elf Arcanist HP: 50 Initiative: 10(Dex, Trait, Feat, Alt Racial)
AC: 18(4 Mage Armor+ 2 Dex+ 1 Nat Armor+ 1 Deflection)
Exploits: See Magic, Counterspell, Dimensional Slide, Spell Disruption
Feats: Toughness, Improved Initiative, Spell Pen, Toppling Spell
Gear: MW Morningstar(For Show), +4 Headband of Int, +1 Amulet of Nat Armor, +2 Cloak of Resistance, +2 Belt of Con, +1 Ring of Protection
Half Orc Slayer HP: 84 Initiative: 8 Speed: 40
AC: 21(7 armor+ 2 Dex+ 1 Nat Armor+ 1 Deflection)
Slayer Talents: Hunter Feat(Double Slice), Trapfinding, Hunter Feat (Improved TWF), Combat Trick(Improved Crit: Kukri)
Feats: Two-Weapon Fighting, Toughness, Weapon Focus: Kukri, Improved Initiative
Gear: 2x +1 Kukri, +1 Mithril Breastplate, +1 Amulet of Nat Armor, +2 Cloak of Resistance, +2 Belt of Str, Boots of Springing and Striding, +1 Ring of Protection
Half-Elf Hunter and Large Cat Animal Companion
AC: 24/23 Teamwork Feats: Distracting Charge, Enfilading Fire
Feats: Point-Blank Shot, Skill Focus: Stealt, Precise Shot, Rapid Shot, Weapon Focus: Longbow. Pet: Light Armor Prof, Power Attack, Furious Focus, Toughness
Gear: +1 Amulet of Mighty Fists, Large/Exotic Mithril Chain Shirt, 2x +2 Cloak of Resistance, +2 Headband of Wis, +2 Belt of Dex, +1 Ring of Protection
Okay... Now that that is over with, I used the same Initiative throughout. Arcanist, Slayer, Baddies, Hunter, Warpriest
Thanks to some decent Knowledge Local checks the party was able to find out the information they needed and were directed to Ploog. The Warpriest made an impressive roll to add to his +19 intimidate which got the group escorted to Ploog's office. Ploog on the other hand was not so easily handled. No one in the party had more than a crappy Diplomacy bonus and with all the guards they didn't want to just jump him, so they agreed to his terms and went Bulette hunting.
Initial hunt time of 12 hours was kicked up to 14 then back down to 10 after player speed was factored in. Then with survival checks, the party knocked time down to 6 hours.
Hour 1: Methane Seep Rockfire: 8d6= 21 damage(Low rolls). Hunter, pet, and slayer all made the save of DC 25 thanks to some very spot on rolls.
Hours 2&3: Nothing
Hour 4: Emberstorm: Another stroke of luck for the party. They Arcanist made a nat 20 on the Knowledge Nature DC 30 check and they were able to avoid the storm completely.
Hour 5: Sarenrae's Tears: DC 20 Reflex save. 6d6. 25% chance of second tear falling 26% rolled. Lucked out again. Rolled for who it would land on, hit the slayer who was leading the group. Splash to the Arcanist and Warpriest. Slayer made and the other two failed for 13 damage.
Hour 6: Nothing
The group healed up after every time they were hurt.
The Bulette encounter on high tier is two Advanced Bulettes underground jump/charging from oposite directions. The hunter and pet make the perception checks allowing them to act in the surprise round, but after the bulettes.
Unfortunately I didn't get to see the Warpriest in action but the rest of the party seemed to handle things rather well on their own. Well, the Pet was really the one who did everything. The hunter felt kind of useless, but that wasn't overly surprising. The class kind of feels like a weaker Summoner right now. The slayer just tried to stay alive which can happen with encounters like this and the Arcanist had the right spell, at the right time.
After healing up and stabilizing the unconscious Bulette, they used the healthy one to drag the other back to town. If one gives them the information they needed then maybe the second will fetch a reward?
The group travels back to town. About two hours outside of town they are hit by a sandstorm and snuck up on by a Roc. Well, kind of... The Hunter makes the perception check but isn't able to identify or see how big said bird is. Just that it's there. This was actually a very interesting encounter, because the Roc is supposed to attack a bulette. The Roc actually does just that. It grabs the unconscious one in a flyby attack and flies off. Very anticlimactic in my opinion, but they still had there healthy one.
The group goes into Ploog's office again and the group again agrees to his terms instead of killing him. Mainly because I thought it would be more interesting to do the arena fight to see how the group handled it.
I gave the 4 Advanced Large Aurochs a trample surprise round. Not supposed to, but figured if they didn't, they wouldn't get to do anything.
The way the group was spread out the Aurochs were only able to get the Hunter, Pet, and Slayer who all made the save and took no damage... Blown surprise round.
I end the encounter there since the only thing left was a single hurt Auroch.
Okay, so now it's time for me to give my opinion on each class. The Arcanist played as I expected. It was an interesting dynamic with the casting. I never had a chance or reason to use any of the exploits so I can't really comment on them. Though they seem cool.
The slayer actually played better than I thought it would. The Favored Target was really cool and was definitely helpful. The sneak attack was a big portion of his full round attack damage and was surprised at its ease of access. I've never had much luck with sneak attack. The class itself felt like a better more battle minded rogue with a cool tracker ranger feel. I think this class is basically where it needs to be.
The hunter felt like a slightly better fighter than a summoner. The pet was awesome and the Animal focus really boosted it. Put a +4 in strength and constitution to up its survivability and battle effectiveness. I never remembered to activate it on the Hunter itself though... Maybe would have helped him hit with his bow. Still though, it was a fun play experience. Not great and not as strong as a druid or really even a ranger with the boon companion feat, but not bad.
The Warpriest was a blast to play. The swift action casting and the option to dazzling display(even if I didn't and attacked instead), mixed well with the damage and casting. Probably could have hit harder with more buffs but none of the combats lasted long enough for that to have been an issue. He was flavorful, interesting, and just fun overall.
I hope this helps the devs and others.
I legitimately laughed out loud at this... I know its off topic, but I felt it deserved a mention.
It's interesting to see all of the people changing their answers to a modified C. Allowing the favored weapon to be the one that progresses also seems to be a popular idea vs any weapon that the WP has weapon focus in. I really have nothing palpable to add here, but just wanted to make an observation.
I think that if we are keeping the blessings, which I like the idea of, most if not all of them should be swift, instant, or free actions to activate. Judgments are a swift, a lot of domains are free/swift (eg Agile Feet is a free action), magus Arcane Pool weapon stuff is swift, Smite is a swift, etc...
Actually, thinking about it, maybe blessings should have a scaling speed. Standard, move, swift/free? There's already an abundance of swift actions in the WP abilities, so maybe move or free? Where free may be too powerful, move may be a slightly too weak. I don't know, now I'm just brainstorming while typing and am going to stop.
I'm confused as to why a WP of Sarenrae should be penalized for using her deities favored weapon by not gaining the damage dice increases if she wants to keep her crit range? If you're gonig to change how crit ranges work for a single class why not just change how it works completely and redo all weapons' crit and multiplier?
Sure going with option A will root out powergamers, but if that was what you were wanting to do then shouldn't all powergaming options be reworked? Is the Magus getting redone to where spells no longer work off of crit range? Are Summoners being told how to restrict their Eidolons so that they don't wreck face? Or they myriad of other powergaming options out there?
This normalization of criticals is a slippery slope to making every character played the exact same. Granted this is my opinion, but I'm not even a fan of the progressive damage increases. Sure it's a nice bonus but if it takes away from those who are choosing to use their favored deities weapons then I'm against it.
My suggestion would be, if everyone is gung-ho on normalizing criticals and weapon damage then maybe there should be some sort of exception or differentiation for those who are choosing their deitiy's favored weapon.
Overall though, I'm a huge fan of the revised WP. I liked the class before, but love it now. It fits its own niche and has really cool unique class abilities.
Okay I'm done now. End rant.
Okay, so I made this suggestion in the previous thread and would like to reiterate it.
If the hunter is going to be the premier AC class then why isn't its AC at least as intelligent as a paladin's mount? Personally I'm of the opinion that this class should compete with the Summoner in terms of companion effectiveness and strength.
As for the spontaneous vs prepared caster, I like LadyWurm's idea of spontaneous +1.
I have to agree with many of the posters through this thread. The AC needs to get a better advancement than the druid companion, probably a d10 HD, and maybe even the chance to eventually get the magical beast template. I also think that the Hunter's AC should also have a higher intelligence than the paladin's mount. I mean if this is supposed to the best class for having an AC it should get the best AC.
Crap! I forgot to talk about Uncanny Dodge/Improved Uncanny Dodge. Okay, so I ended up getting flanked a lot and by a lot of rogues nonetheless. These abilities were probably lifesavers for me in the second scenario. I know that I was an advocate for ditching them in favor of some other ability, but after have play tested them in action while enlarged/on scaffolding/protecting the wizard, I think that they should stay. Maybe have them be some of the first things that go when choosing an archetype? I can't attest to DR though since I wasn't at a high enough level to utilize that one.
Hey guys! So, yesterday I got to play a Bloodrager 4/Inquisitor 1. Let me first explain this odd combination of multiclass: I retrained my Barb 1/Inq 4 and didn't have quite enough prestige to afford the full retrain.
Teddy is a Human BR 4/Inq 1 with 53 HP and a 50 base speed (40 in Med. armor)
Str: 18 (22 when raging)(17+1 at level 4)
Fort: 11 (Base 6+ 3 Con+ 2 Cloak)
BAB: 4 Rage: 16 Judgement: 1/day
+1 Falchion: Atk Bonus: 9 Damage: 2d4+13 Always power attacking due to Furious Focus.
I went with the arcane bloodline and have Cayden as my Inq deity and the travel domain.
First off, I was really worried about the multiclass and wasn't at all happy with having to leave the character like that. I got 2 spells known from each class and 2 spells/day per class.
The party consisted of myself, a level 3 Barbarian, level 3 Drunken Master Monk, and a level 3 Bard. I felt like a beast running around with these three lower level characters. There were a few sticky spots for the Monk and Barbarian as their low AC and moderate HP caused them to be targeted quickly by the baddies. My AC was normally equal to theirs though since I was raging in almost every combat. Blur was super helpful and came into play a lot. Eventually frustrating the GM. It was an incredibly fun time when I got to use my Freedom of Movement to avoid some rough terrain, then Rage, then Charge the spell caster. I was pleasantly surprised at the synergy between the Inquisitor and Bloodrager levels. Even if I can't cast the Inq spells while raging they were very helpful for the party and the other Barb when I cast Pro Evil on him. Overall for the scenario I'd say it was a great success and a ton of fun.
After completing the scenario I had enough xp to hit 6. So I picked up a 5th level of BR and decided to keep my 1 level of Inq. Not only does it give my a massive amount of diversity and a plus to my will saves, roll playing-wise it makes for a fun dynamic and Teddy can alter his reality just a little bit more thanks to the drunken god.
Played another scenario as Teddy. The party consisted of a Shifter Druid and her large tiger AC, a buffing Conjuration(teleportation) wizard, and a Barb 1/Shapeshifter Rager 5, and of course myself. I didn't feel as OP in this group since the druid was shifting into a dire tiger and double pouncing everything, the wizard was hasting and single mirror imaging all of us, and the Ranger was pulling off some big hits. I still felt like I carried my part and having all the beatsticks allowed me to cast a bit more and enlarge myself a few times, bless the party, and overall just have fun. I even got to yell "Teddy want horse! Teddy get horse!" and cast mount. It was a total blast.
Overall, I'm going to have to say that when I compare this to my Zen Archer, Shield Bashing Pally, and Hippogriff Riding Ranger, Teddy holds his own on damage output and survivability. All have their strengths, but I think that Teddy in his two scenarios was more fun than any other character I've made.
I've got to give this class an A+.
Any questions or comments on my build please let me know.
Okay, so I play tested a level 2 Warpriest (Half-orc).
AC: 22 (armor 9+ shield 2+ Dex 1)
That said, where I couldn't even hope to keep up with the raw damage of the Barbarian, I felt not only useful in combat, I was the other beatstick and the tank. Which was a far different feeling from when this character was a pure cleric. On top of that, beyond a single bomb, I never got hit.
Over all, it was a really fun time. The class is incredibly front loaded though and you can really start off with some great options even with the limit of a 3/4 BAB. I think the class itself will probably quickly cool off and start dragging behind, especially in damage, once they hit those later single digits.
I'd like to weigh in on the idea of burning rage rounds to apply metamagic feats to where they don't cast at a higher level. I'd link the post, but I'm new to the forums and haven't quite made it tthat far yet. Anyway, I really like the idea. It forces the player to choose between metamagic feats and more combat oriented feats. It also adds an even deeper level of uniqueness to the class. That being said, while I do agree with the idea, the ability will have to be extremely limited in its uses. Once per day would probably work best, and have it scale as you level. Maybe 1/day at level 6 and every 6 levels after?
I'll be play testing a level 5 BR today and will give some more feedback afterwards. Its a retrained Barbarian 1/Inquisitor 4. I'll let you guys know how it goes later!
I've lurked on this thread and many of the others concerning the new classes and have to say that this might be the first time I fully agree with what Ciretose is proposing. Flavor-wise giving the Warpriest weapon training in the favored weapon only would be awesome. It would also give them the needed oomph to attack.
I also think that the weapon ability needs to have a longer length, probably similar to their armor one.
I'm going to be play testing a level 2 Warpriest of Sarenrae later today. I'll post afterwards how things went. As of right now I believe there will be two barbarians and a witch in the party with me.