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Organized Play Member. 226 posts (597 including aliases). No reviews. No lists. No wishlists. 3 Organized Play characters. 3 aliases.


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VRMH wrote:
Who said anything about the corset being female-only? It's a common enough garment, worn by both sexes over many time periods. Just 'cause nowadays the male versions are out of style (unless you call them kidney belts) doesn't make the Pathfinder version mono-sex.

I must agree. While they're perceived as gender-specific, they are not. Men have worn them for the last few centuries, at least.

And they can look dang good on men. I have two myself, and can't wait to get my hands on a third. Do a search for Dark Garden Corset Beau Brummell to see a fine example (and, I hope, my next one...)

Stockvillain wrote:

I picked up the pdf for "The Maiden" from Worldworks Games ...

I'll second WorldWorksGames. Their stuff is amazing. The TerrainLinx are labor intensive (though what 3D terrain people have mentioned isn't?). But they are fun to put together.

However, if you want a balance between price and labor, check out their latest products, called TerraClips. I bought the Streets and Buildings, and they're fantastic. Can't wait for their dungeon sets! (They do have slight limitations in terms of accurately depicting maps you see in Paizo products, but if you're willing to change that 5-10' hallway into a 15' hallway, they'll work well.) If you're not set in stone map-wise and willing to "get close", I think you'd do well with TC.

My 2 bits. :)

Laithoron wrote:
Is it just me or does the illustration of Isabella (really? the same name as the sexy pirate from Dragon Age 2?) have teeth when she's described as having had them all knocked out? Botched art order? Editorial mistake? Regeneration spell?

I can't speak for Paizo's publishing, but at other places the artist might not get information on every little detail. A short description might be all they receive. And while they're busy sketching and drawing, the writer is busy writing, and by the time everything's ready for the printer's, it's a bit late for someone to say "Hey, redraw this!". :)

As for Isabella, I hadn't caught that one. But I have caught a dozen or more other references in this and other APs. Personally, I kinda like 'em. (Especially when they give a nod to my favorite author. Not unexpected, when I know at least one of the Paizo writers is also a fan of his...) :)

Erik Freund wrote:
]One feature of Kingmaker that you need to be keenly aware of as GM: there is typically only one fight per day. Once the PCs figure this out, expect them to "nova" every fight. To specifically answer your question: it also means they don't need to prep any healing. The fight will go however it goes, then they can rest, and do whatever healing in the morning. There is no need for dungeon-crawl-style resource management.

However, this isn't always the case, and if the players expect every encounter to be like it, they won't be at all prepared for the few major dungeons there are. They could end up using all their resources and healing too early. Just a thought....

And there are a few choice items for wizards out there in terms of power (spellbooks being the main thing). When you get the time, read through the rest of the books and plan accordingly. It wouldn't be hard to tweak the books to suit your group's needs.

(My group doesn't try to work the system hard, so I've never had a problem with the magic item economy or super-crafters or anything.)

Jason Nelson wrote:
He's the king. He can have a potion. :)

It's good to be da king! ;)

There is a couple of nice weapons; the most famous of which, coming towards the end, is called out in the AP as changeable. That is, it mentions "if your PCs don't have this particular type, change it to something they do have".

But the above suggestions will quite work. :)

If you have the Chapter Six book, read up on the First World, specifically Shyka <sp> the Many, one of the Elders. He could easily be a starting point for time-travel adventure (or at least help in getting them through time). Might also tie in the Fae aspect of the adventure as a whole, too. (Maybe deliver a certain sword to a certain Neried in exchange for a trip, or something? That'd be weird; just don't tell the players *anything* about what or why!) :)

Since you didn't specify genre, two from musicals: :)

"In His Eyes" from Jekyll & Hyde
"I Know Him So Well" from Chess

Both are amazing.


-- "The Wizard Knight" duo of books by Gene Wolfe. (One's "The Wizard" the other, "The Kniight".)
-- The "Khaavren Romance" series (The Phoenix Guards, Five Hundred Years After, etc.) by Steven Brust. (Steven's "Vlad Taltos" series might also work for you.)

Just some opening thoughts. If you wished to expand out some more (from high magic fantasy into, say, urban fantasy, period fantasy, etc., I could suggest some others as well.) :)

Good luck in your new adventure in reading! :)

Luthia wrote:

So, I recently changed my kingmaker sessions from a weekly to monthly game, partly because of rising disinterest in the campaign, partly because of 2 new players who wanted to be introduced to Pathfinder on the day of my weekly games.

Hmm... Well, a couple of thoughts spring to mind.

Firstly, the Awaken spell. It grants them intelligence, but frees them up to be their own "person". Lots of RP potential there. Do they like being ridden? Do they want a cut of the treasure if they're helping in the fights? Maybe they want a say in government (Dinos have rights, too!). Give one or two some funny accents and weird quirks, and your players will love 'em even more.

As to using them in combat, I'd treat them as hirelings or something. They may increase the APL, so you will likely need to beef up encounters a bit. And allow them to be raised from the dead (or reincarnated!). But that, of course, means...

Dungeons and large or huge creatures might not work well. So sometimes, their dino mounts will need to be left outside to graze (on kobolds or local barbarians or something, I expect). Maybe let the players research and create a new spell: shrink dino. That will allow them to bring their scaly friends into dungeons (though not ridden).

All in all, if your players are getting excited, I'd run with it. You can work it so that it doesn't overpower their characters, and can bring in new role playing opportunities. Always a Good Thing<tm>!

Kthulhu wrote:
Another thing about the Helen Mirren deal...that's kind of a b%~%~y move. She's essentially asking them to fire Matt Smith so that she can cross "Be Doctor Who" off of her to-do list.

Why? They've already had multiple Doctors in the same place at the same time, in one form or another. I could easily see her playing the Doctor in a one-off episode. She gets her dream, we get to see a female Dr., and (provided its well written), the world gets an exciting, new episode.

Me, I'm okay with that.

Book 2, towards the beginning. :)

You may still be going crazy, though... ;)

Hmm... Interesting idea. For ease, I'd go with Ruyan's plan. Less work and headache. :)

However, if you *really* want to, you could:

Major KM Spoilers!:
Pick up Fellnight and read through it, and make sure you've read through KM Book 6. You'd need to fashion a way both to get Nyrissa out of Fellnight and back to her other realm. If your players won't have a problem with you having the BBEG escape, or maybe changing Fellnight so that they accidentally release her, then that may work.

The biggest issue, I think, will be how she was influencing Thousand Breaths and the Stolen Lands while imprisoned in Fellnight. With the nature of the First World and demi-planes, perhaps Fellnight was a plane-within-a-plane of Thousand Breaths? Perhaps the PCs, when finally getting to book 6, find another bottle next to the one destined for the Stolen Lands, wherein they see the Fellnight realm? Perhaps Nyrissa found a way for part of her essence to escape Fellnight and travel abroad, or she possessed a nymph or dryad or something?

All in all, it's doable, but read both mods carefully, write up a plan and what you'll be changing, and take copious notes! (Maybe use that mirror found at the end of Fellnight as a way for her to escape or travel?)

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Manx Serimus wrote:

I have suggested for the game I play in that each existing hex be subdivided into 7 smaller hexes for the purposes of building a kingdom.

Stating that the only function possible to get from an area of 374 sq miles is one single farm is stretching it. A lot. (If one line is 12 miles long).

Most medieval farms were more in the order of a mile or two in area.

FYI-- It's been mentioned elsewhere, but it isn't one farm, it's a hex dedicated to farming, which would include many farms and farmland in that hex, as well as whatever else would be needed for such. Unless you wish to think of it as one farm and subdivide, you need not do so, just assume that the hex contains a bunch of farms and the people to work them. :)

cartmanbeck wrote:
I really love this concept and will probably use it for an NPC in the campaign i'm running now. I'd like to see what happens if my players are working with a character and then suddenly she is found to be a generally "evil" race.

Might I suggest that she be an artist, specifically a sculptor. Not necessarily turning people into statues and claiming they're her's, but an actual sculptor who happens to be a medusa. You could have a great deal of fun with your players on that.

(I once took a group through an entire mod based off this concept, combining elements of investigation, murder, and love. It was fun! :)

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Chevalier wrote:
War for the Oaks, Emma Bull.

Chevalier, you get props for this one!! I was going to mention it myself. Happy to know others out there have read this EXCELLENT novel.

DeathSpot wrote:
Try Steven Brust. The Vlad Taltos books, in particular. Really good, lots of strong women, and no sexual abuse. Well, none I can remember.

You get props, too, as I was going to mention Brust (I *always* mention Brust!) as another excellent choice. And no, no abuse in them.

Now, with those out of the way... These aren't pure fantasy, but I highly recommend:

The Thursday Next series by Jasper Fforde (starting with The Eyre Affair)

Kim Harrison's "Rachel Morgan" series (starting with Dead Witch Walking)

As someone with similar tastes, it seems, you can't go wrong with any of the above. :)

I don't read much Sci-fi, but when I find a good one...

Might I suggest the author Neal Asher? A few of his more memorable ones, in my mind:

"The Skinner" - Asher's Spatterjay world is incredible. And while the trade paperback says "Dune meets Master and Commander", it is SOO much more.

"Gridlinked" is also a good starting point, though it has no world of Spatterjay (sadly).

I've read most all of Asher's books. He's a damn fine writer with excellent characterization, plot, and universe-building.

I'd suggest grabbing either of the two above, and seeing how you like it. I'm re-reading "The Skinner" now (for the half-dozenth time) and I still love it.

(And with that recommendation, I throw in Zelazny, because I have to.) :)

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Evil Lincoln wrote:
Are all generalizations bad?


"Of course, everyone generalizes from one example. At least, I do."

Attribution: Steven Brust, Issola

Zmar wrote:
Dwarves are medium actually. A lot o people forget about that...

From a rules standpoint as regards a creature's size, yes. From the standpoint of a Large size ogre, they're "small". (Admittedly, I'd not differentiated which I meant, but as that suggestion was meant in jest...) :)

but now I'm looking for ways to occasionally challenge him even when there's no caster or anything with touch attack at hand WITHOUT stealing his shtick, ignoring him in favour of the others or overwhelming the group.

Well, if the baddies have a height advantage, there's the tried and true method of dumping oil on them and lighting it up...

If he's up high with you, perhaps bull rushing him off the side.

Heck, he's small. Do a touch attack against the head and hold him at arm's length, the ogre saying "Ha Ha! Little dwarfie can't hit me!" (Until the PC takes a swipe at the ogre's arm.) (NOTE: Okay, this one's more in jest, but it'd be funny!)

Hey, a trap door in the floor to separate him from the group might work. While the others are fighting their way in, he can use his high AC to battle through and get back to his friends. Toss in some swarms or oozes, and some ogres to make him feel cool and invincible, while the rest get the normal treatment.

I've found that if you give the opportunity for a player to feel awesome, they're less inclined to hate you when you bash 'em some other time. (NOTE: This doesn't work with everyone...:)

Red Ramage wrote:

Still have to hammer out the details of this, and since we haven't started the AP at all I have awhile. Does this sound good? I'm new to DMing and suggestions would be appreciated.

I kinda like it, actually. Maybe, if they get the beheading roll, you can ask if they'd like to behead or plunge into the heart. If you drop hints as to the nature of Briar, you can have it be their decision. By this time, she's ticked 'em off enough that they may decide she's gotta go the old fashioned way, but the chance for a different resolution is always nice.

May have to lift this idea. Knowing my players, if they knew about the history of Briar they'd *want* to "give it back" to her. :)

It's your GM, and he's not posting here that I know of, so it's tough to say what, precisely, is going on. Be that as it may, I can think of more than one item that you should have by now (if you've explored every hex) that is above the power level you listed. Also, as has been mentioned, taking time to build up a kingdom, explore hexes, and run into random encounters offers XP.

Without sitting at the table or getting all detailed, it's hard to judge what the problem is, exactly, but the AP is NOT "epic". Some fights are tougher than others, and PCs can get in WAY over their heads--such is the nature of a "sandbox" game like this.

My players, for example. Some Big Boss fights they've walked through (I've a couple experienced Pathfinders at my table). Other fights have been a struggle when I wouldn't have thought it would be. So, there could be a number of factors contributing to your difficulty.

I'll end with my players' take on the Lizardmen quest: The druid scoped out the area and spotted the kid; most of the party approached the front and started a conversation/fight, two went around to the side where the kid had been spotted, crept over the wall, and stole him back. When the Wisp came out, the party retreated.

Overall, I wouldn't say the AP is super tough. It can be, at times, but overall it's written according to the CR guidelines outlined in the CRB. Of course, sometimes, dice happen... ;)

Frank Williams 624 wrote:

Any advice to get my players to go back there at some point so they learn of Nyrissa and the sword and all that jazz?

Or does it not really matter, and they can just figure it out some other way.... like when the blooms just start.

Huh. It might not matter, if they find the sword in the palace. It'll be difficult to learn about, and maybe trying to Identify it will send them a vision of the Neried. Also, it's with the shawl, which could also point them back towards the Abbey.

Could also do a little side-trek after the book. Maybe some friars want to rebuild the Abbey, but it's haunted and so ask the PCs to clear it out for them.

Of course, if they *don't* find the sword, you can point towards the Abbey and the weapon once the blooms begin.

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Enthallo wrote:

The Cleric answered, "I just Googled it."
Why bring a Bard when you have Google.

So, do you use Obsidian Portal or any other online information for your PCs?

Cause what's good for the Good Guys is good for the Bad Guys... ;)

"Yes, Your Majesty?"
"I just Googled those upstarts building that kingdom to the East. Seems they have a Wizard amongst them with a staff of fireballs, a Cleric of Pharasma, a rogue who wields a magic shortsword, and that king of there's is actually a Paladin of Erastil! Also, seems the wizard just got a new Imp familiar, and that holier-than-thou king is big on Leadership--just got some stupid fighter cohort. So, here's what we're gonna do..."

Con carne wrote:
Any advice at all will be apreciated this seems pretty big.

Heh. It is big. But fun, too. In addition to the excellent advice above:

You've got a bit of time, but figure out how you plan on doing kingdom building. I highly advise getting ahold of one of the spreadsheets on the forums and playing with it. They're very useful.

Open up the Kingmaker forum and spend an hour skimming through it, hitting topics you may find interesting. A great deal has been offered since this AP came out, and the folks on here are fantastic. Chances are you'll get some amazing ideas just taking a bit of time and reading through old posts. (And don't forget the Fey Pranks post!)

Keep a pad and pencil handy to take notes before, during, and after a game day! You'll thank yourself. (Marking the days and hexes of exploration alone is useful.)

Someone posted up a Golarion calendar. Might want to print out a couple months and mark that up as the PCs go along. You'll not only be able to mark the days and hexes, you'll also be able to note what happens for later use AND be able to show your players the days/months as they progress. (Although, once they start building the kingdom, it goes from "mark the days" to "mark the months".)

Good luck, and have fun! And feel free to hit the forums here if you have further questions! :)

BfB (Book 4) has some fairly easy cake-walks, but as it sounds like you're already through it, there's not much point in discussing upping that.

War of the River Kings, however, you're starting, so...

I'd change around a couple of the baddies. And look into Nelson's original write-up, as it has some nastiness to it that could help. Maybe give the Pitaxian King some additional advisers. Jurg<sp> is another change up you could look into, if not I_ himself.

Speaking of the

Hows about he has a clone and/or a body double? He's crafty; I wouldn't put it past him to have a master of disguise in his place during battle. Scrying wouldn't help much with that.

Scrying can be a problem, but only if they know enough and the baddies haven't taken steps to prevent it. Take those steps!

Lastly? If all else fails, let 'em have book 5 and work on book 6. They'll be completely unprepared for the madness and the difficulty ramp...

(Oh, and if you want more particulars, just ask.)

With three PCs, they'll be a little below "level" for the AP if you run it as is. Keep a watch on it and go easy some later down the road. Or allow them to have a cohort or NPC run around with them. As for starting at third level, you can do it, but the first book will be a breeze without beefing up the encounters, even with only three of them. Perhaps compromise and start them at second level? At the beginning of the book there are remarks as to about when the PCs should reach what level, so take a look at that and get a sense of it.

While I highly recommend reading all the books ahead of time, it's not necessary. However, if they leave the area outlined in the book ("Hey, lets head into the swamps or mountains! No, let's head south!") you'll want to know what's there. The first book could likely be run without reading too much ahead. Beyond book 1, I'd start reading ahead for the NPC info, as outlined above. It's cool, for instance, for the PCs to have met someone like Varn before book 3 rolls around. :)

Good luck, and have fun! It's an entertaining AP!

ArchAnjel wrote:

I'm looking for advice on how to run an in-game tournament. Like, jousting, archery, strong-man, that kind of stuff. I'd like to use that kind of setup as an introduction to an adventure but I've always been disappointed with how in-game tournaments have been handled in the past. Too often, they rely heavily on a round of d20 rolls which have so much variability that even someone who is highly skilled can roll a 1 and totally bomb.

Does anyone have any suggestions for how an in-game tourney might be played out in a way that's fun?


Hi Shannon,

If you're looking for a set of rules, I suggest getting Book 5 of the Kingmaker Adventure Path, "War of the River Kings". While it uses d20 rolls, it has a number of events included and may give you many an idea on what to alter or add. The Kingmaker forum for that book might also have ideas for tournament play.

Frozen Forever wrote:

So, if the horses have 256 or more hit points, it shouldn't be a problem.

To the left, yes, horses will allow exploration of hills and plains in one day. This isn't so bad, though. The first couple of books, these hexes will be present the most, but after that there are mountains and swamps and other terrain where it'll take two or three days by horses. And some may be impassible by horse.

Just don't forget that, when confronted by encounters, your PCs may be mounted and need to make ride checks or dismount before they can do anything...

drennier wrote:
(I started typing the cards up for Book 3 and 4 if anyone wants to google docs access or a copy of the generic fill in cards)

Uh... yes, please? :)

Slighted wrote:

A bit of a thread necro, but here goes. I am new to Pathfinder and new to GMing. I will be running Kingmaker as my first adventure path. My players are also brand new to this, so I want it to be an awesome experience for them and to hook them on Pathfinder forever!

There is almost too much info out there (at least by forum searching) on Kingmaker campaigns. Any further tips on a good GM blog or site to read for advice? Or game aids to buy to really make the game pop? I was going to buy some flip mats (other terrain aids I should buy?) and I just picked up a bunch of DnD Heroes minis. What about monster minis? Any other suggestions? Thanks for your help.

Necroing threads now, are we? :)

Well, as I'm not sure how much of these forum posts you've read, here's some general advice:

-Read ALL of the six KM books ahead of time (at least the AP parts). Knowing what's coming up will help tremendously and give you ideas on cool bits to toss in the game as foreshadowing and whatnot.

-Take the time to do some prep work before game day begins. I ended up grabbing a box and storing all my stuff in there for quick access. I'll fill out Initiative cards for monsters ahead of time (for those I know the PCs will encounter) and make notes where I can. A pad of paper is nearly essential for making notes and marking the number of travel days, hexes explored, etc.

-Figure out how you want to handle the mapping aspect. There are a number of good ideas on the boards. I printed non-marked maps from the pdfs, stuck them on cardboard, printed out a bunch of hexes of the same size as are on the maps, then pinned them to the map itself. As the PCs explore the map, I take away the pin and paper, exposing the terrain underneath. Time consuming to build, but the players like it. There are other ways, depending on your setup (using a computer/TV, etc.). There's also a site called Hexographer, I believe, which is pretty easy to figure out and use.

-When kingdom building, grab one of the excellent Excel sheets from these boards. You'll thank yourself, believe me!

-Don't fear changing things from the way they're written. Kingdom building ain't doing it for the players? Ditch it and have it in the background, etc. Make your primary goal a Good Time Had By All<tm>.

-For the first two books, there are paper minis that are pretty cool and easy to print and put together. Some of the major baddies from later books are finally out as metal minis. (One of them came out a month after I ran the encounter. Grr...:)

-Lastly (okay, not lastly, but my post is getting long, so if you've more questions or want more info, just ask), some excellent posts on the KM forums you might want to check out/search for:
The Fey pranks--Can be peppered throughout the module
Six-player conversion--If you've six or more players
The Obituaries--Gives a good idea on some tough encounters to watch for.
The Kingdom Building spreadsheets--See above. They're a BOON!

And, if you can, I know they are many, but scroll through the forum posts for Kingmaker and take a gander at a few that catch your eye. If you spend an hour reading through a few, you may be well rewarded.

Oh, and lastly (did I say that already? Ah well), don't hesitate to ask questions. I've been running KM for over a year, and this board is the first place I go when I need answers. The folks here are great!

Good luck, and have fun!

Male Human (Unconfirmed) Bard 3/Rogue 2
Dr. Benedict Darcy wrote:
If you bring up the scree to write a post then look below the field you are writing in it says "How to format your text" with a show button next to it. Hit the show button and it gives directions to all the little tricks for your text. For the blue text which is used for OOC content then you put OOC between the [ ] just like you use B between [ ] to make text bold.

Ah, okay. That makes sense. I'd known about the "How to format your text", but wasn't sure what the OOC command was.

Much obliged! :)

Male Human (Unconfirmed) Bard 3/Rogue 2

INIT 1d20 + 2 ⇒ (9) + 2 = 11

At the instigation of hostilities on the part of the peasantry, a large, black raven with a striking blue tail feather swoops towards the crowd, caws loudly, and perches on the nearest mausoleum, tilting his head and glaring at the angry mob.

Talia sighs in disappointment. Alas, I fear these folks will not be dissuaded. And the procession started off so pleasantly. Shall we set down the coffin?

Ready action= Set the coffin down when others start to do so.

How does one change the font color to blue, anyway?

Male Human (Unconfirmed) Bard 3/Rogue 2

Talia listens politely, her eyes roaming over the people assembled, the casket, and the brisk morning, before settling on the Councilman.
"I would be honored, Ms Lorrimor," she says, her eyes never leaving the elder gentelman, "to perform this service for the late Professor. It is the least I can do for one who had done so much for me. Her eyes finally leave the Councilman to focus on the grieving daughter.
Stepping towards Kendra, Talia bows deeply, saying "My condolences, my Lady, on your loss. If there is aught I can do..."

I'll complete the full character tonight and get it posted by tomorrow morning. In the meantime:

Name: Talia Senshir
Race: Changeling
Class: Witch
Familiar: Raven
Deity: Shelyn

I've started a messageboard alias for Talia (Thanks, Azure_Zero!) and will update that as well, write up a background, etc. I'm entirely new to playing this way, and beg forgiveness when I must ask the most basic of questions. :)

GM - Zombie Master wrote:

Sorry but I don't wish to open the "customize" can of worms. But I will listen to any ideas you have for adding in aasimar alternate racial class features (to spend your favored class point on) for cleric as they have none listed in the APG.

Sure if redclover can be in group 1 and then group 2 would need a player that's easy

GM-Zombie Master,

I've never played in a pbp game before, but have been told about them and am interested in attempting one. If you've room for another player in Group 2, I would like to join if I may. Leaning towards a Witch, but I'm flexible when it comes to characters.

Some good advise above, to which I will add only one thing, and its viability depends on how often you have a full 6+ group.

You can keep the players one level lower than the books recommend. This may come about naturally, depending on how swiftly they approach certain goals. The only real issue is when you have four players show up for a game instead of all eight. They might find it tough then, even if you use the encounters straight from the book.

Humorous Suggestion: Every baddie in the book has a twin! Hey, The AP is closely tied to the realm of the fae; it's not THAT out of whack!
"Hi, I'm Joe, this is my twin brother Ted. We'll be your bandit attackers for the evening." :)

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Gentleman wrote:

I've a question about Vordakai's familiar. In his paragraph it says "Horagnamon may take a specific act against the PC, as indicated by the text".

What other ways have you people managed to use him as?

He followed my players around for days. They spotted him, but he kept flying away. Finally they caught up to him (dimension door), but I had V blow him up. I gave the surrounding PCs a Reflex save for half X damage (can't recall what damage I used). It mentions something similar in the text, but not how or what, so I made it up. I can do that; I'm the GM. :)

Oh, and my players were *shocked* that a believed wizard would do such a thing to his familiar. They just couldn't understand it. But hey, it was that or have the familiar give away spoilers!

Before he was caught, he was the main reason why Soul Eaters kept harassing the party. Each week they spent before H was blown up, they'd be attacked in the night. Annoyed the heck out of 'em (though they learned how to deal with the annoyances rather quickly).

KCWM wrote:

Awesome. I didn't have a chance to check this thread after yesterday afternoon and came back to find some more responses. I really appreciate you guys responding.

You know, you *will* get sucked into this one! :)

I know that office supply stores sell large sheets of 1" grids. The one I saw was like $25 or so for a whole bunch of sheets (can't recall the precise #). You might want to look into that if you're planning on reusing "generic" settings. Also, Paizo sells their own line of "generic" mats that look pretty cool, in a variety of settings.

Oh, and the NPC thing is a good suggestion. If you want to keep things in-game, you might also create an NPC to act as a Kingdom Planning Adviser or something, once they get to that stage.

Overall, have the players take their time and explore. Show them a blank map and give 'em free reign. I suspect they'll enjoy themselves. Who knows what's in that next hex! :)

As others have answered your first, specific questions, I'll just offer some unsolicited advice. :)

Read all six books ahead of time! Even if you just skim the second to sixth, it may give you some great ideas for little tidbits to toss the players in even the first book. It may also give you ideas for tying in each character to the overall story, either by adding in places/NPCs or sliding some of your PCs directly into the plot down the line. I've used this to good effect, giving my players "visions" of possible futures which won't occur until much later, if at all.

If you have six or more players, use the conversions; if you have four or five, the AP as written should be fine. And I agree with testing the waters on the 15 pt buy. Should be okay, as it's written for it, but if the players are new...

Write up some "random" encounters ahead of time. I've gone entire game days without rolling a single random encounter, so started just tossing them out there when I felt like it. Stupid dice won't obey me!!

The sandbox nature of the AP is both a blessing and a curse. Sometimes they'll feel like they're unsure of what to do or where to go. At those times, exploring is a great option! Other times, they may hear of some big bad and make a beeline for it, approaching under the "suggested level". So be prepared to do some on-the-fly GMing.

Lastly, as you've already done, read through the posts on the Kingmaker forum, and don't be afraid to ask questions! I've been delighted and amazed at the awesome people here, and admit to having lifted more than two ideas over the last year... :)

Okay I lied. Here's lastly: Have fun! This was my first AP with a new group of players, and I've truly enjoyed it.

PS--The Kingdom Excel sheet is your friend!

Did anyone notice the remake and the original were written by the same person? I approved of that immensely!

I would have enjoyed it even if Tennant were not involved. (His role being the primary reason for seeing it in the first place.)

I highly recommend as a good vamp flick!

Green Eyed Liar wrote:

I am planning out an opening encounter for my Jade Regent, as sort of a prelude to the "So, you are all sitting around in the tavern, when..." scene.

** spoiler omitted **

While it may give a slightly altered effect, you could use

Lamp/lantern oil.

Belgerod wrote:

I'm looking at running this adventure path for some of my friends. As a whole in our personal games we've always leaned towards 25pt buy. With premade adventures geared towards different numbers of players/character point buys it might disrupt the balance of the game. That being said, how much difference would 5 extra points really make?

Opinions? I'm basically just wanting to see if anyone else is using 25 point buy, and the effects it's had on their games. Thanks!

I believe (and if I'm wrong, someone, I am sure, will correct me) that the pre-made characters are built with a 15-point buy, and the modules and APs are written with a 15-point buy, four-person party assumption.

That said, if you have a party of four with a 25-point buy, you might consider upping a few encounters. If you have more than four in your party, you might want to consider the same, even with a 15-point buy. But you can always allow the 25-points and see how things go, adjusting accordingly once you've a sense for how they fare. The experience of the players, how their characters are built, etc., can alter encounters more than the points they're given. Your dragon's mileage may vary... :)

leo1925 wrote:

Am i at fault for not trying to figure out what a DM might have in his mind? The rule say that the DM can put a limit to the number, it doesn't even give a guideline, so how can i predict what another person is thinking? especially if he has never said anything about that?

It's not a question of fault, really. But saying that an encounter was a huge disappointment and you wiped the floor of what otherwise should be an epic, legendary bad guy, while simultaneously saying what rules were violated/altered, and how things were handled "poorly", has led to this discussion. Yes, it sounds like the situation was unfortunate, and should not have occurred in the way it did. A group error, if you will.

Sad, more than anything. I've been looking forward to this encounter more than any other in the entire AP. Or any AP that I've yet read, actually. (So major props to Pett!)

I'll not speak for others, but IMO the fault was not in the design (even one against four), but in the execution.

And I will admit I've had my own failings. I've found I must make special note of spell resistance. I've a tendency to forget about that one! Fortunately I've got some good players who know the rules well, and will keep me honest. Both in their favor and in my own... :)

Elucidarian wrote:

Also, make sure to check out the Kingmaker City Map Toolkit a buddy of mine put together (with approvals by by Lisa Stevens, Vic Wertz, and Dale McCoy Jr!).

Full props on this one! I started using it for my Kingmaker webpage, and my players all love it. And yes, it DOES work online! Many thanks, Elucidarian! Awesome addition!

cibet44 wrote:

My group will be finishing up CotCT this weekend and next up for us will be either KM or CC. I have a few concerns about KM that hopefully some experienced KM GMs can help with:

1. Should my group decide to abandon or otherwise completely sideline the kingdom building aspect of KM does the AP still have enough content to be interesting for a group that has already done Savage Tide, Rise, and Curse back to back? I have read most of the first two parts of KM and can't quite get a feel for the overall campaign other than building a kingdom.

2. If my group does adopt the kingdom building aspects of the AP will this significantly expand the amount of time the AP takes to complete? We like to finish an AP in 7-10 months. I would not want KM to go much beyond this with or without kingdom building.

Thanks in advance.

1-Apart from the rules, the Kingdom Building aspect can easily be moved into the background entirely, and the rest of the AP has plenty to go on. I've only been a part of two APs (running KM and playing Runelords) so I can't speak as to how much "content" it has, necessarily. On the other hand, the AP as a whole is different in that it's free-flowing. PCs can go explore and aren't on many tracks throughout. Though that does allow for getting lost in the woods, if your PCs are into taking off wherever... :)

2-It may, though there are ways around it if you're willing to put in time yourself outside of game. 7-10 months? Dang, my group is slow. We've been playing for over a year and just hit book 4 (though we play, at most, every other weekend, and we've gone a month or more without gaming at times).

Xexyz wrote:

1-I need ideas for the other five feats. Are there any that are especially appropriate (and effective) for Antipaladins?

2-His cohort will be lvl 14. I like the idea of giving him a demonic cohort, like a succubus with some class levels. Is this allowed? If it is, how do I determine how many class levels to give a succubus (CR 7) to make it equivilent to a lvl 14 character? Is it as simple as giving the succubus 7 levels in a PC class?

3-I want to give him magic items valuewise as if he were a PC, not an NPC. That's a difference of over 250k, so would that increase the CR of the BBEG, and would it be too much since the PCs will obviously take most of his stuff when they kill him?

4-If it makes a difference, when the PCs finally engage the BBEG for the final showdown he'll not be alone. He'll have his cohort, a maralith, plus as many additional demons as necessary to make the encounter challenging.

1-I'm not great at picking perfect feats; I tend more towards flavor than anything else (my paladin in Runelords has a Faerie Dragon familiar, for instance). So I'll let someone else suggest this one.

2-Yes, it's allowed! One of the cooler aspects of the anti-paladin, IMO. Strictly by RAW, a succubus wouldn't gain levels, but would gain the templates mentioned in the anti-paladin. That said, it's you game, so level away! I strongly recommend reading the Bestiary regarding granting levels to creatures, as it's a little weird. Some classes dovetail well with a succubus, others don't. (Might I suggest bard, though?) But yes, if a class dovetails well, it's 1 CR per class level.

3-Gear equivalent to a PC increases CR by 1 (usually), and should be made up for by having other encounters which don't give treasure (treasure-less monsters, traps, hazards, etc.) That way the gear the PCs take stays consistent with the treasure they should be awarded, overall.

4-Hey, that isn't a question! But, it's a good idea. Minions swarming over the PCs while the anti-paladin wades in and his succubus cohort annoys them from the side... sounds like a mighty fine shindig! (And stop reading my notes, as I'd already planned something similar for my current game!) :)

Eel wrote:

I've been told that the APs are generally balanced around a party size of four PCs, and I've heard about fan conversions of other APs for parties of about six PCs. Do parties of 3 or 5 need much adjustment, or is there enough wiggle room that you can generally run an AP as-is with one more or less player?

Welcome, Eel! I suspect you'll have fun with both Pathfinder and this AP. The d20 rules will come, so don't sweat it.

As for your particular question, 3 or 5 players shouldn't harm things too much. If you *really* want to balance, I might suggest using a 20-point buy for stats (Str, Dex, etc.) for a 3-party, and a 15-point for a 5 party, but it wouldn't be bad either way. If you find your 5-person party is walking through everything too easily, toss in an extra critter or so and see how they do. If your 3-party group is being trounced, toss 'em a bone instead. And, actually, with this particular AP, they'll have helpful NPCs with them in a three-man group who can help if they're struggling.

FYI--This board has some fantastic folks who are willing and able to help answer questions, so if you have 'em, ask away! :)

Erodel wrote:
...of an AWESOME encounter...

Now *that's* what I'm talking about. A right proper fight. Cookies and kudos to all involved. And thanks for sharing! Gave me some ideas of my own... :)

Turin the Mad wrote:

Which was a real shame, since it's clear you were looking forward to it once you heard about it.

I have tried. REALLY tried, to keep this encounter a secret from my players. Some of them may know about it, I'm not sure, but it should come as a surprise to at least half of 'em! Ack! Two books to go...

Oh, and I'm SOO going by the Bestiary's call-out on DR. My group's paladin be damned! There's plenty in this AP for him to get his Smite on, and I want at least ONE baby of my own, dangit. (Well, I've a couple, as I'm also tossing in an anti-paly just for him. Shhh!:)

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