By which I mean the actual application of the Superstition rage power in an adventuring party. There are a lot of relatively short duration buff spells a friendly arcanist might provide a barbarian, including Enlarge Person and Haste, that would be cast in combat. Other spells that might be cast as well after the nature of the enemy is discerned, such Resist Energy, or heals after some damage gets done.
So would you take superstition in the classic party (meleer, arcanist, divine caster, skill monkey)? Do you hold back on raging until you're good to go on buffs? Or do you just flat out reject them/save vs. them?
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I rage cycle them in. Free action end rage, they cast spell or buff, free action resume raging. Helps that I'm an urban barbarian in an urban campaign though.
Yes I would still take superstition, and no I wouldn't normally hold back raging to get buffed up.
If the casters have emphasized their initiatives properly and get to act before you just get prebuffed. Superstition annoys me sometimes but overall it's a lifesaver.
Yes, save your buffs for the puny skillmonkey, he needs it. And if you're healing in combat I've done my job horribly wrong.
If it's a really epic fight and I really need a couple of buffs I can wait a round before I start shredding people into small chunks.
Yeah....rage cycle or getting buffed by casters who go first is pretty much all you need.
Really, you could even have them ready an action to cast on you when you drop rage. "I ready an action to cast X whenever my barbarian friend ends his rage." If the GM doesn't like that condition then it can be when your friend gives the signal.
The superstition bonus is just awesome. Especially with a courageous furious weapon. At 20th level human barbarian who puts 18 of his favored class bonuses into it will get 2 from the base skill, 5 more over levels, 6 from favored class bonus for a total of 13. With a courageous furious +5 weapon, your weapon counts as a +7 weapon. Courageous increases all morale bonus (which superstition counts as) by half the weapon enhancement. This brings the total up to a +16 to your saves against all spell, spell-like, and supernatural abilities. +16. That's enough to make even the most charismatic Paladin jealous.
So is it worth it? Hells yes.
You sure about the +5 becoming a +7? Never seen a published example that wasn't unique or an artifact, I figured it was a way for barbarians to save wbl and still get a +5 when it counts. Hrm.
Well, courageous and Furious are both +1s, so you can have a +3 courageous furious weapon and when you rage it gets the +5 bonus and the nifty things that come with it. You almost always rage, its almost worth the bonus.
I'm fine with rejecting a few buffs if it means not dying to a save or die. I love superstitious. It gives me the feeling of being the juggernaut, and that I don't need magic. That said, I like having haste and if it doesn't hurt to delay I'm fine with delaying to get it.
Max enchantments on any magic item is +10. Highest straight numerical bonus is a +5. Furious lets you go up to a +7 when raging, but it has the costs of a +6 weapon (+5 bonus plus +1 for Furious property).
Yes I would still take superstition, and no I wouldn't normally hold back raging to get buffed up.
Of course you would! ;P
Raaaargh - Qhude smash :P
Max enchantments on any magic item is +10. Highest straight numerical bonus is a +5. Furious lets you go up to a +7 when raging, but it has the costs of a +6 weapon (+5 bonus plus +1 for Furious property).
Even better is that it goes above the straight +5 enhancement that you can usually obtain for weapons, because that extra +2 to hit and damage may not seem like much, but every little bit helps.
Didn't know bane holy or furious were exceptions to the " cannot have an an enhancement bonus higher than + 5." If it was then why wouldn't the holy avenger have a higher bonus? It's a higher+5 max enhancement unless epic or artifact.
The +5 is the cap. The straight numerical cap. Any weapon can have up to a flat +5 and another +5 worth of special abilities such as furious, courageous, bane, speed, keen, and whatever else. So long as the total isn't more than +10.
Except none of the abilities state to a maximum of... so I can see that also. Love this game just seems to be a lot of gray areas.
A single weapon cannot have a modified bonus (enhancement bonus plus special ability bonus equivalents, including those from character abilities and spells) higher than +10.
Is that what you're talking about? It's after the list of tables of bonuses and special abilities and their costs.
Yes that and the part where the rules elaborate to say that this also cannot exceed +5 for either category: special abilities +5, enhancement +5=10.
Just read the crb and the wording has changed from 3.5 I see.
A weapon can't have an enhancement bonus higher than +5.
That's footnote 2 in the first table. So enhancement bonus is capped at +5 and everything else can't take you higher than +10.
you can have a +1 weapon and +9 worth of abilities. But as for flat magic bonuses, +5 is the cap.
Anyway please try not to be angry with me I simply don't always read rules as cut and dry or in the same way as other people.
Right joana I'm stuck on enhancement bonus capped at 5 guess.
As in I'd never make a furious weapon more than a furious+3 instead I would add keen and vicious and perhaps an element for a +3furious keen vicious shocking burst greatsword.
Furious: This ability can only be placed on a melee weapon. A furious weapon serves as a focus for its wielder's anger. When the wielder is raging or under the effect of a rage spell, the weapon's enhancement bonus is +2 better than normal. If the wielder has a rage power that gives a skill bonus while raging (such as raging climber, raging leaper, or raging swimmer), the wielder gains an enhancement bonus to that skill whenever the weapon is wielded or held in hand, even when not raging; this bonus is equal to the enhancement bonus of the weapon (including the +2 when the wielder is raging).
No where does it say anything about a restirction. It say +2 better than normal. Normal can be up to +5. Furious will make it +7. I can't recall what thread this was discussed in previously, but it's be asked and confirmed before. It was also confirmed in that same thread that while it does count as a +7, it does not bypass Epic damage reduciton (as in 3.5 a +6 weapon did bypass DR Epic.)
Weapon Bonuses: Can weapon special abilities (such as bane) or class abilities (such as a paladin's divine bond) allow you to exceed the +5 enhancement bonus limit and the +10 bonus-equivalent limitation?
For the enhancement bonus limitation, it depends on the specific effect or ability that's altering the weapon.Bane: This allows the weapon to exceed the +5 limit, but only against the designated creature type. For example, a +5 dragon-bane longsword is normally a +5 weapon, but has a +7 enhancement bonus against dragons and deals +2d6 points of damage against dragons.
That FAQ sets a precedent that a furious weapon can have an effective enhancement bonus of +7.
Edit: BBT, you beat me to it.
+5 furious great sword is +7 when raging correct? and it overcomes epic dr?
Listen to the nice squid Admiral: “It’s a trap!” Can’t be healed, boosted, bard song, or even receive Channeling? For a mere +2? (more later, sure) And a Moral bonus to boot, which can easily be duplicated by many spells?
AND, you have to burn a rage power to get this cruddy ability?
Awesome! It just seems a shame they couldn't have foreseen the need to print it in the rulebook after what 2 years of 50000 playtesters ? Maybe rules design is like jumping on an overfull suitcase , one or more corners always pops out. Thanks for the faq.
Nope.+7 but still not epic according to faq.
Listen to the nice squid Admiral: “It’s a trap!” Can’t be healed, boosted, bard song, or even receive Channeling? For a mere +2? (more later, sure) And a Moral bonus to boot, which can easily be duplicated by many spells?AND, you have to burn a rage power to get this cruddy ability?
you get a boost to your saves against spells, spell like abilities, and SU that is broad enough to encompass aloft things. fire ball? that s a spell i get my superstitou bonus to spells, charm person? save. oh you glow and cause me to be blind strange monster is it a super natural ability i get a super bonus t that save also.
Matter of taste I guess. See with my barbs saves already really good I'd rather invest in something besides courageous ability or for that matter fearless rage.
If we're using the analogy about meeting your mother, should we mention all the good friends superstitious introduces you to? Witch hunter is pretty awesome, ghost rager is pretty cool, eater of magic is amazing, and spell sunder is icing on the cake.
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Listen to the nice squid Admiral: “It’s a trap!” Can’t be healed, boosted, bard song, or even receive Channeling? For a mere +2? (more later, sure) And a Moral bonus to boot, which can easily be duplicated by many spells?AND, you have to burn a rage power to get this cruddy ability?
Bard performance and channelling to heal both require no save. Delay the rage a round and you can get haste.
Actually it's assumed a character voluntarily fails for healing.
Not only that, but seriously with the cord of stubborn resolve you take non-lethal damage instead of becoming fatigued. That small item will allow you to rage cycle for a very small price tag. When the spell caster is ready to cast on you he can ready an action to cast when you signal him to (speaking is a free action). You give him the signal on the start of you turn after you drop rage, his turn interupts yours and he casts, then its back to your turn and you strat raging again. It's so easy to get around the limitation on Superstition that its ridiculous.
Also, there is a save against healing spells. If your Superstition Barbarian makes the save against it you take half healing instead of full, not a complete deal breaker to me.
No just really annoying.
Also because there is a precedent with curative spells and a dc given for channeling the same applies there as well in groups I play with.
The DC for channeling is to reduce damage to undead and undead only IIRC. Its sort of a weird case, but the reduction doesn't exist for channeled positive energy for healing.
Channel Energy (Su): Regardless of alignment, any cleric can release a wave of energy by channeling the power of her faith through her holy (or unholy) symbol. This energy can be used to cause or heal damage, depending on the type of energy channeled and the creatures targeted.
A good cleric (or one who worships a good deity) channels positive energy and can choose to deal damage to undead creatures or to heal living creatures. An evil cleric (or one who worships an evil deity) channels negative energy and can choose to deal damage to living creatures or to heal undead creatures. A neutral cleric who worships a neutral deity (or one who is not devoted to a particular deity) must choose whether she channels positive or negative energy. Once this choice is made, it cannot be reversed. This decision also determines whether the cleric casts spontaneous cure or inflict spells (see spontaneous casting).
Channeling energy causes a burst that affects all creatures of one type (either undead or living) in a 30-foot radius centered on the cleric. The amount of damage dealt or healed is equal to 1d6 points of damage plus 1d6 points of damage for every two cleric levels beyond 1st (2d6 at 3rd, 3d6 at 5th, and so on). Creatures that take damage from channeled energy receive a Will save to halve the damage. The DC of this save is equal to 10 + 1/2 the cleric's level + the cleric's Charisma modifier. Creatures healed by channeled energy cannot exceed their maximum hit point total—all excess healing is lost. A cleric may channel energy a number of times per day equal to 3 + her Charisma modifier. This is a standard action that does not provoke an attack of opportunity. A cleric can choose whether or not to include herself in this effect. A cleric must be able to present her holy symbol to use this ability.
The fact that your group houserules that the save is extended to channeled energy is not supported by RAW. I agree that while annoying, the potential savings you get from being able to resist virtually all the bad spells (especially when combined with a Ring of Evasion) will save you more HP in the long run than you would have received during combat from healing.
Certain healing effects, such as channeling, and I think lay on hands, are able to work around the superstition rage power. Nothing to worry about.
The Barbarian with Superstition only has to save against spells.
That's it.
Moment of Clarity frees them of this restriction when a spell is needed.
Channel is fine.
how does moment of clarity do that exactly?
Moment of clarity gives you a turn without any rage while still raging. All your bonuses and negatives get turned off for a moment, including superstitious.