Technological Weapon Questions

[Minigiant]

I am ramping up my preparations to run Iron Gods for my group. Still very much in the preliminary phases of it, and with that come 'stupid' questions. Today: Technological Weapons

Question 1
Can Tech Weapons be enchanted as magical weapons?

Question 2
Does reloading work the same as, say, an equivalent-weight crossbow? AKA Does Rapid Reload apply?

Question 3
Can a Magus (Eldritch Archer) spellstrike with them?

[Pizza Lord]

1. Yes. If you have the item, you can do that with the appropriate magic item creation feat (and a place to create the item). If you are building a technological/magic weapon, you need the Craft Technological Arms and Armor feat and a military lab.
Technological Equipment

Technological Equipment wrote:

Hybrid Items

Items with both magical and technological components, such as the null blade, use a special crafting process. The creator must first succeed at a skill check at the listed DC for crafting the technological portion of the item, and then must succeed at a check based on the item’s caster level for crafting the magical portion. Any spell or level-based prerequisites not met increase this crafting DC, as described for magic item creation. The skill used for each check is based on the item creation feats required by the item. Failure on either check ruins the item. Use the item’s listed price as normal for determining crafting time, and the item’s cost for raw materials. If the creator has feats or abilities that accelerate item creation, only the least favorable bonus applies. In other words, to create a hybrid item faster, the creator needs to be able to create both magical and technological items faster.

It is also possible to enhance high-tech armor and high-tech weaponry with armor special abilities or weapon special abilities, including magical enhancement bonuses. One could build a +2 laser rifle, a +4 dancing humanoid bane chainsaw, or a +1 ghost touch space suit. In theory, a magic item creator could even infuse a technological item with magical intelligence. To create a magical high-tech item like this, one must first secure the high-tech item itself, either via purchase, discovery, or crafting. All high-tech weapons and armor are considered masterwork for the purposes of adding magical enhancements to them (though they do not gain the other typical benefits for masterwork items). At the GM’s discretion, some magical special abilities might simply not be appropriate for application to certain technological items. When a character crafts an existing technological item into a magic item in this manner, he does not need to meet the base item’s crafting requirements—a wizard with Craft Magic Arms and Armor can create a +1 arc pistol from a normal arc pistol without having Craft Technological Arms and Armor and without having access to a military laboratory. In a situation where a character wishes to craft the entire item from scratch, the non-magical technological item must be fully crafted and completed before work on magically enhancing it can begin.

2. Probably not from Rapid Reload (there might be a technological variant). Since Rapid Reload says 'Choose a type of crossbow (hand, light, heavy) or a single type of one-handed or two-handed firearm that you are proficient with.' and I believe that the notes don't let it work with Advanced Firearms, I think Technological firearms would fall in that category. Most such items have magazines with multiple shots though and changing one out is normally a move action. I don't see why there couldn't be a version that allows rapid reloads... but I don't see one.

3. Most likely yes. Magus (Eldritch Archer) get a bonded object the same as a wizard at 1st level. Assuming your GM would let a 1st-level wizard start with a technological weapon, then the magus can, and I don't see anything that would prevent their spellstrike from working with ranged weapons.

[Minigiant]

Thank you @PizzaLord

Last Question, Proficiency.

Does Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Firearms) get all the Tech Frearms?

[Claxon]

Minigiant wrote:

Thank you @PizzaLord

Last Question, Proficiency.

Does Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Firearms) get all the Tech Frearms?

I'm not confident, but I think no. I think Tech Weapons are their own category.

Edit: Looking on AoN it depends heavily on the specific weapon to be used. Some are covered by exotic firearms proficiency, many others aren't.

[I grok do u]

Minigiant wrote:

Thank you @PizzaLord

Last Question, Proficiency.

Does Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Firearms) get all the Tech Frearms?

RAW, yes as long as they are classified as firearms.

From Firearm rules

Firearm Proficiency wrote:

The Exotic Weapon Proficiency (firearms) feat allows you to use all firearms without penalty. A nonproficient character takes the standard –4 penalty on attack rolls with firearms, and a nonproficient character who loads a firearm increases all misfire values by 4 for the shots he loads.

Even though the Exotic Weapon Proficiency (firearms) feat grants you proficiency with all firearms, anytime you take a feat that modifies a single type of weapon (such as Weapon Focus or Rapid Reload), you must still pick one specific type of firearm (such as musket, axe musket, blunderbuss, pistol, or double pistol) for that feat to affect.

All firearms are part of the same weapon group for the purposes of the fighter's weapon training class feature.

Additional support on RAI here is that Exotic Weapon Proficiency (firearms) is a prerequisite of the Technology Adept feat pertaining to technology firearms.

Firearm rules, especially when paired with technology rules, are not monolithic. How many of the feats work depend on the campaign, as seen in the "No Guns," "Emerging Guns," "Commonplace Guns," and "Guns Everywhere" rulesets.

I don't have the Iron Gods AP available to see what specifics it suggests to the GM.

[Belafon]

Minigiant wrote:

Question 2

Does reloading work the same as, say, an equivalent-weight crossbow? AKA Does Rapid Reload apply?

Pizza Lord wrote:

Probably not from Rapid Reload (there might be a technological variant). Since Rapid Reload says 'Choose a type of crossbow (hand, light, heavy) or a single type of one-handed or two-handed firearm that you are proficient with.' and I believe that the notes don't let it work with Advanced Firearms, I think Technological firearms would fall in that category. Most such items have magazines with multiple shots though and changing one out is normally a move action. I don't see why there couldn't be a version that allows rapid reloads... but I don't see one.

Rapid Reload would work. It does work with Advanced Firearms:

Ultimate Combat Page 136 wrote:

Advanced Firearms: Advanced firearms are chamber-loaded. It is a move action to load a one-handed or two-handed advanced firearm to its full capacity. The Rapid Reload feat reduces this to a free action.

However, be aware of the clarification on page 135:

Quote:

anytime you take a feat that modifies a single type of weapon (such as Weapon Focus or Rapid Reload), you must still pick one specific type of firearm (such as musket, axe musket, blunderbuss, pistol, or double pistol) for that feat to affect.

Quote:

Question 3

Can a Magus (Eldritch Archer) spellstrike with them?

Yep, it's a ranged attack. However since they won't be starting with any technological items they would have to use the normal process for bonding with one they find.

[Belafon]

Minigiant wrote:

Last Question, Proficiency.

Does Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Firearms) get all the Tech Frearms?

All but the heavy weapons, and you may decide to restrict them further if you wish.

Technology Guide page 20 wrote:

Proficiency: This entry lists whether the weapon is simple, martial, or exotic. If an existing weapon proficiency allows the new weapon's use, that weapon proficiency is listed in parentheses. Note that Exotic Weapon Proficiency (heavy weaponry) works similarly to Exotic Weapon Proficiency (firearms) in that it allows access to a wide range of similar weapons.

Some GMs may wish to replace Weapon Proficiency (firearms) with Weapon Proficiency (technological firearms) to further restrict access to these devices to player characters in their campaigns.

[Diego Rossi]

Ultimate Combat wrote:

Firearm Proficiency: The Exotic Weapon Proficiency

(firearms) feat allows you to use all firearms without penalty. A nonproficient character takes the standard –4 penalty on attack rolls with firearms, and a nonproficient character who loads a firearm increases all misfire values by 4 for the shots he loads.
Even though the Exotic Weapon Proficiency (firearms) feat grants you proficiency with all firearms, anytime you take a feat that modifies a single type of weapon (such as Weapon Focus or Rapid Reload), you must still pick one specific type of firearm (such as musket, axe musket, blunderbuss, pistol, or double pistol) for that feat to affect.
All firearms are part of the same weapon group for the purposes of the fighter’s weapon training class feature.

That changes how the normal Exotic Weapon Proficiency works, as the "normal" version covers only a single weapon, not a whole category that goes from small single-hand weapons to two handed weapons.

The feat should cover all weapons from Ultimate Combat.

The modern weapons from Pathfinder 71 are also included in those covered by Exotic Weapon Proficiency (firearms).

The technological firearms and Iron Goods have specific rules:

Technology Guide wrote:

Proficiency: This entry lists whether the weapon is simple, martial, or exotic. If an existing weapon proficiency allows the new weapon’s use, that weapon proficiency is listed in parentheses. Note that Exotic Weapon Proficiency (heavy weaponry) works similarly to Exotic Weapon Proficiency (firearms) in that it allows access to a wide range of similar weapons.

Some GMs may wish to replace Weapon Proficiency (firearms) with Weapon Proficiency (technological firearms) to further restrict access to these devices to player characters in their campaigns.