Unchained Summoner "mount" Evolution


Rules Questions


The rules say

Quote:
Requirements: Daemon, demon, devil, elemental, or protean subtype; quadruped or serpentine base form.

I would normally take that to mean that (specified subtype) AND (specified base form) are both required, but that doesn't make sense, as devils must be bipeds. So are those two clauses actually either/or?


IN general, if the body doesn't fit at the start it mean you need to change it to fit. get a tail to form serpentine. add limbs (legs) to form quadruped etc.


You cannot just 'add a tail' to make a form serpentine, nor 'add legs' to make it a quadruped. The Base Form of an eidolon determines their starting statistics and evolutions which they received for free, and which they can access later on.

One of the biggest changes from the original summoner and the unchained summoner was the restriction to base forms and subtypes, which served to limit the overall power of the class.

In all likelihood, the inclusion of 'devil' in the list was an oversight by the authors, as all the other subtypes listed have the option for the quadruped and serpentine form.

As a GM, I'd allow what zza_ni is suugesting to make the evolution functional. But it is not a RAW ruling.


Seems to me you could ride an eidolon without this evolution, if it were bug/strong enough and you are willing to take the penalty to ride checks.


Java Man wrote:
Seems to me you could ride an eidolon without this evolution, if it were bug/strong enough and you are willing to take the penalty to ride checks.

This is correct. Provided the creature is large enough to carry you, you'd treat it as a mount not trained for combat and take the penalty to your ride checks (-5). If you don't have a special saddle for the creature, that's another -5 to your ride checks.

The Exchange

rojomoke wrote:

The rules say

Quote:
Requirements: Daemon, demon, devil, elemental, or protean subtype; quadruped or serpentine base form.
I would normally take that to mean that (specified subtype) AND (specified base form) are both required, but that doesn't make sense, as devils must be bipeds. So are those two clauses actually either/or?

You are reading it correctly.

At a guess I'd say it was possible that Unchained devil eidolons might have had other form options during development that were removed prior to publications.

This actually wasn't a great way to word the evolution because it meant that no base forms published in later books could take the mount evolution unless it was specifically called out as allowed for them.

DeathlessOne wrote:
Java Man wrote:
Seems to me you could ride an eidolon without this evolution, if it were bug/strong enough and you are willing to take the penalty to ride checks.
This is correct. Provided the creature is large enough to carry you, you'd treat it as a mount not trained for combat and take the penalty to your ride checks (-5). If you don't have a special saddle for the creature, that's another -5 to your ride checks.

That falls into the realm of "ask your GM." Same as 'riding' a larger PC.


It's unchained. It didn't get a good testing before publishing. You are intended to house rule this stuff.

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