Reach while mounted


Rules Questions


If you are riding a Large creature, would you and opposing creatures need a reach weapon or have reach to hit each other. I would seem logical if your 10 or so feet off the ground they would a reach weapon to hit you and you to hit them. This would mean they have to kill the mount first? Is there more rules on this? I only found the rule that states

Quote:
When you attack a creature smaller than your mount that is on foot, you get the +1 bonus on melee attacks for being on higher ground


I found the following statement in the Mounted Combat section:

PRD wrote:


A horse (not a pony) is a Large creature and thus takes up a space 10 feet (2 squares) across. For simplicity, assume that you share your mount's space during combat.

It talks explicitly about large creatures, but I'm not sure what "sharing your mount's space" means. Does it mean you can attack/threaten every square adjacent to your mount even with a non-reach weapon?

And what happens when you ride a mount bigger than "large"?


Slacker2010 wrote:

If you are riding a Large creature, would you and opposing creatures need a reach weapon or have reach to hit each other. I would seem logical if your 10 or so feet off the ground they would a reach weapon to hit you and you to hit them.

No, you share the squares of your mount. Anyone who can hit your mount can hit you.


james maissen wrote:

No, you share the squares of your mount. Anyone who can hit your mount can hit you.

The "defensive" part of the rule seems to be clear.

Another related question: is there a rule that a character can't ride a mount more than one size category larger than himself?
The standard examples in the rules are halflings on ponies and humans on horses, but could a halfling ride a colossal mount?


If a human can ride an elephant, a halfling can ride a creature 2 or more sizes larger. The difference could require a special saddle, like the howdah used to ride on elephants.
But this isn't game rules. Just my thoughts.

Sovereign Court

I could see, however, that riding a creature more than one size category larger than you would force you to use a reach weapon to attack creatures not grappling your mount. I see the person on the elephant controlling the elephant to fight for him, as opposed to fighting enemies on the ground from elephant back - though a reach weapon might make this viable.

Are there any official rules on this?


Zen79 wrote:
james maissen wrote:

No, you share the squares of your mount. Anyone who can hit your mount can hit you.

The "defensive" part of the rule seems to be clear.

Another related question: is there a rule that a character can't ride a mount more than one size category larger than himself?
The standard examples in the rules are halflings on ponies and humans on horses, but could a halfling ride a colossal mount?

They would not gain certain benefits of ride that require a 'proper' mount as I recall. Off the top of my head things like fast dismount required the mount to be a relative size to the rider, etc.

-James

The Exchange

Slacker2010 wrote:
Reach while mounted

That's what he did.


niel wrote:

If a human can ride an elephant, a halfling can ride a creature 2 or more sizes larger. The difference could require a special saddle, like the howdah used to ride on elephants.

But this isn't game rules. Just my thoughts.

While I like the visual image of a gnome sitting in a little howdah about the size of a doghouse, perched on the back of a clyedesdale horse, galloping across the countryside as he fires tiny darts from his steam-powered repeating crossbows, I am compelled to make a couple points here:

1. Howdah's were not "required" for elephants. Maybe that's not how you meant it to sound, but it reads like you did. Many people ride elephants bareback, with no saddle at all, or maybe just a blanket to help protect the elephant (and the rider) from chafing.

2. Howdah's were barely practical on elephants when they just plod along slowly. Put one on a horse and it will never stay in place when that horse decides to gallop, so you might want to take extra precautions to prevent your horses from running with their gnome howdahs.

3. Don't forget that a howdah was a two-man affair. One driver, one archer/javelineer to make attacks. But basically the elephant was the weapon, trampling enemies underfoot and even more importantly, shattering defensive formations like phalanxes so the foot-soldiers could follow the elephant's breach into enemy lines. The archer was just to pick off anyone trying to take a shot at the all-important driver. While a warhorse was, historically, a serious force to be reckoned with, it was nowhere near as deadly as an elephant, nor as destructive to defensive formations (although, a clydesdale could make short work - pun intended - of a phalanx of gnome-sized soldiers).


Simple reason: Large mounts aren't usually tall creatures (they are usually large[long]), their space is 10'x10', but the rider is just 5' high, not 10'. Reach weapons aren't needed in those cases.
Huge mounts would need special rules. The table for Creature size lists tall and long creatures.

Historic armies used sables, long swords, spears and lances for cavalry. I can't recall the use of reach weapons to attack from african elephants (which weren't so big) but they were used to overrun the enemy.


Any chance on official rulings for this?

What is alo unclear to me is what happens when a mount is/becomes intelligent enough to not be ridden (via the ride skill) any more, but makes its own decisions. Which rules do still apply, which change, which can't be used any more?

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