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hmmmm, the CP adjustment appears to be missing for encounter B3. It jumps from 23-27 to 33+.
Anyone with an idea of what the adjustment would be for that 28-32 range?
As they adjustment table starts with 16-18 for the 5-6 Tier, Could it be that the 23-27 adjustment is actually intended to be the 28-32, and that the 16-18 is in fact the 19-22 adjustment?
Pathfinder Society Developer
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Whoops! The "Scaling Encounter B3" sidebar on page 28 should say:
19–22 CP: Add one hell hound to the encounter.
23–27 CP: Add one barbazu to the encounter.
28–32 CP: Add one barbazu and one hell hound to the encounter.
33+ CP: Add two barbazus to the encounter.
As the current, incorrect table could make the encounter much more difficult than it ought to be, I'll see about getting this fixed in the PDF, but it may not happen right away.
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What should a gm do if the PCs decide Tascio is correct in holding Sabina prisoner? From what I can gather from the scenario she is murdering police officers and is part of a foreign invasion seeking to overthrow the lawful government of Cheliax. Tascio gives you the information about where Varian is voluntarily. I could see PCs deciding it is not their place to intervene in a matter of civil war, especially since she is completely tangential to what they are actually try to do, which is find and retrieve Varian. After Colson Maldris, I kind of thought the Society had learned it was best not to interfere in the internal workings of a nation. However, here, part of the primary objective is freeing Sabina. Not sure how punitive a GM should be with a pretty murky political situation.
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Hellknights are not police, they're mercenaries, who regularly torture and kill people. Also they kidnapped Varian as well.
This is probably not a good adventure for those who put the law above Good, I'm unaware of what's involving this Colson person but you can't avoid politics, ESPECIALLY if you're doing a covert operation in a hostile nation to save someone who was kidnapped. It's not really a murky situation at all, unless there's a Scar Hellknight or Thrune crony in the group, which again, horrible idea to bring to this adventure.
"is part of a foreign invasion seeking to overthrow the lawful government of Cheliax"
The very very-regularly sacrifices its citizens-very evil hell worshipping government. Lawful is not Good. Or even okay.
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I would dock them the Primary Success Condition. PFS GMs are supposed to stick to the scenario as much as they can.
They could figure out that Jaggere wanted to meet with Sabina through their research, which would cause them to want to rescue her. Followed up Nan tells you that there meeting was interrupted. Leading to the assumption that the VC has unfinished business with her.
IMO they should have left finding out what happened to the VC as the primary and have what we decided to do with Sabina as a reporting decision. Like A-left her with Tascio, B-Saved her from Tascio
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I would dock them the Primary Success Condition. PFS GMs are supposed to stick to the scenario as much as they can.
Stating again as it seemed to have been overlooked.
Same thing with the treasure bundles. Just because we do not like the fact that some TB are locked behind Critical Success and flawless skill runs, does not mean we should grant additional TB to players.
Venture-Captain, Online—VTT
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What should a gm do if the PCs decide Tascio is correct in holding Sabina prisoner? From what I can gather from the scenario she is murdering police officers and is part of a foreign invasion seeking to overthrow the lawful government of Cheliax. Tascio gives you the information about where Varian is voluntarily. I could see PCs deciding it is not their place to intervene in a matter of civil war, especially since she is completely tangential to what they are actually try to do, which is find and retrieve Varian. After Colson Maldris, I kind of thought the Society had learned it was best not to interfere in the internal workings of a nation. However, here, part of the primary objective is freeing Sabina. Not sure how punitive a GM should be with a pretty murky political situation.
There are no ifs or buts, the GM should run the scenario as written making it clear what the Society expects from the info the players have. If they refuse to rescue Sabina then they fail the primary success condition, regardless of how the GM might feel about the politics of it.
Venture-Captain, Massachusetts—Boston Metro
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An international organization that depends on government's permission to allow their agents to operate within their borders?
Uhhhh.... You do realize your committing a crime in Cheliax full stop at the start of the scenario right? It sounded like you read the scenario but you missed the part which causes the kidnappings. We are operating in Cheliax illegally. We are arrest on site and that hasn't changed at all.
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You say Pathfinders are arrest on sight but Tascio gives you the information you want voluntarily and does not attack you unless you seek to take the rebel who has killing his fellow Hellknight and law officers.
I don't mean to cause a big to-do, but I think taking agency away from the PCs is a bit of a tonal whip lash given that the overall theme of this Season is reckoning with the Society past, and understanding that complicated situations require less murder hobo'ey solutions.
I also don't understand what Richard means that it is a GM's job to make sure that the PCs know what the Society expects from them. As far as I know, nobody ordered the PCs to rescue Sabina and I am not aware of any ongoing directive to free criminals from police officers who are enforcing the law. The PCs can get the information required to lead them to Varian without any violence at all.
That being said, I am not going to beat a dead horse. If the Scenario is meant to punish the PCs for not rescuing Sabina then that's the way I will run it.
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Venture-Captain, Massachusetts—Boston Metro
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I also don't understand what Richard means that it is a GM's job to make sure that the PCs know what the Society expects from them. As far as I know, nobody ordered the PCs to rescue Sabina and I am not aware of any ongoing directive to free criminals from police officers who are enforcing the law. The PCs can get the information required to lead them to Varian without any violence at all.
hat he's saying is that Sabina potentially has information regarding artifacts that Cheliax may want to destroy.
EDIT:Whats Delvehaven since Im here?
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On my play-through we had an unconditional party (human?, two kobolds, and a goblin.
Goblin was champion of Cayden Cailean, one kobold was a cleric of Kofusachi, other kobold a tempest oracle, and a really distributing yet interesting sorcerer.
The scene was going the route of talking through except A. Prisoner held in captivity. B. Realization that if Tascio escapes, he then reveals the Pathfinder presence in Cheliax.
Closest thing our party had to a conflict was clarified within the torturer continuing to work while the party was talking to Tascio. Whether that was a GM embellishment or scripted, those factors were enough to deal with him in a permanent fashion.
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Venture-Captain, Online—VTT
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I also don't understand what Richard means that it is a GM's job to make sure that the PCs know what the Society expects from them. As far as I know, nobody ordered the PCs to rescue Sabina and I am not aware of any ongoing directive to free criminals from police officers who are enforcing the law. The PCs can get the information required to lead them to Varian without any violence at all.
It's pretty simple, the PCs know Sabina is an ally of Varian and someone he was dealing with. They know that Cheliax and by extension, most Hellknights consider Pathfinders criminals generally and would not usually willingly cooperate if given the chance.
With this very basic information do the players choose to a) believe the Hellknight they randomly just met who is continuing to torture a prisoner for... fun? whilst holding a conversation with them, or b) rescue said prisoner who again, they know is an ally of the VC they are seeking, and get her info to help complete their task.
It's not a hard call.
Cheliax and the Hellknights are villains, they're not the heroes, they're not good people. Does this mean players can't make heroic or good Chelaxians or Hellknights? Not at all. But these are the exception, not the rule.
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Pathfinder Society Developer
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The scenario's author did an excellent job presenting some interesting moral and societal challenges that are taking place in Cheliax right now. I don't think either side in a violent conflict between two groups of people ever boils down to "Side A is always good and Side B is always bad." Various Paizo products and stories (including Pathfinder Society scenarios) have portrayed Hellknights in a variety of nuanced, non-villainous roles.
But, in this scenario, the PCs come across someone being interrogated and tortured. My expectation in that situation is that the PCs intervene, whatever the consequences for the Society may be. Once the PCs learn that someone else was captured along with Varian, and especially once they learn that person is being tortured and will likely be executed, their objective should be quite clear. As the "correct" response to stumbling upon someone being tortured may be a question of moral judgment, I suppose interpretations may vary, and I should not assume everyone shares my attitudes. Perhaps a more nuanced range of player choices in this circumstance was called for. As it is, please do not "punish" a group for deciding to abandon Sabina to her fate. Instead, as the scenario objectives are quite clearly stated (to the GM at least), my hope is that GMs guide the players to the expected course of action. Perhaps with a gentle reminder that while the Society may not be a good-aligned organization, it's definitely not evil-aligned, and torture is an expressly villainous act which Society agents should oppose.
Side note: Such mature content is not something we're going to depict often, or in detail. When/if it does come up, GMs might need to adjust descriptions if they're in public or have young players at their table.*
*I've seen plenty of kids have more mature and nuanced conversations than adult conversations I've seen about the same topics. My point more generally is that GMs should try to know their audience and adjust their descriptions accordingly.
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Venture-Captain, Massachusetts—Boston Metro
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I mean it's not a huge moral conundrum though. Assuming you know the metaplot it's quite evident that it's probably a doublecross. I can't believe a Chelaxian official would interfere with the destruction of evidence pointing to the illegitimacy of the government.
Edit
Though that may be because of a lack of knowledge of the issue. Seriously, how common knowledge is that?
Whats Delvehaven since Im here?IIRC, it was the Cheliax lodge for the Society before the banning of Pathfinders in the country.
Apparently it shows up in an AP. That's what I'm curious about.
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I'll post an actual review in the product area after running it later this week, but I wanted to mention before I forget, that I really appreciate the way that the optional encounters were handled. From a VTT prep standpoint its annoying to have to prep things you don't think you'll use. But at the same time you don't want completely repetitive same opponents optionals.
The way that the encounters are setup with trying to interleave 'required' opponents (from earlier or later encounters) into the optional, plus a smaller number of 'new' opponents feels like a great solution.
Apparently it shows up in an AP. That's what I'm curious about.
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Contributor
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What's the status of Habermorrow these days? Is it a functioning (hidden) Cheliax lodge?