Grip Throat

[Nefreet]

Posted this over in the Bestiary 2 product thread but figured I'd repost it here for discussion:

The Crawling Hand has an ability called Grip Throat:

"A Medium or smaller creature that is grabbed by the crawling hand has difficulty speaking and must spend an extra action to perform any action with the verbal trait."

However, there is no such thing as a "verbal" trait.

Do you think the author meant "any action with the auditory trait", or did they mean "any spell with the verbal component"?

[HumbleGamer]

Kinda confusing.

I think the latter, since verbal component requires the character to speak with a strong voice ( not to say the "verbal" Part).

[Blave]

I'd go with all actions with the Auditory trait are affected, so you not only have trouble casting spells but also doing stuff like Demoralize.

It's still weird because there's Auditory actions that don't rely on your ability to speak, such as playing a percussion instrument.

So I'd rule "Grip Throat affects all Auditory actions that rely on your ability to make sound with your mouth. When in doubt, the GM decides."

[Thod]

Nefreet is right - verbal is a spell component and not a trait

But lets take a step back:

Both verbal as well as auditory are in regard to sound.

Verbal is from the point of view making the sound.

Auditory is from the point of view of receiving the sound.

Auditory can't be used as trait - as the process of making a sound is affected - not the process of hearing the sound.

So what about demoralize (without intimidating glare). I think RAI is pretty clear - had difficulty speaking - so fluff again With a sudden shout, a well-timed taunt, or a cutting putdown, you can shake an enemy's resolve.

And back to Blave:

Blave wrote:

all Auditory actions that rely on your ability to make sound with your mouth

There is a word for that that describes it - verbal

I think in common English it is easier to understand the meaning of 'verbal' then the meaning of 'all Auditory actions that rely on your ability to make sound with your mouth'.

Keep in mind - the moment you use auditory - you have to also add that this only applies to auditory traits originating with the grabbed player - he himself can still be demoralized without problems or still suffers from sound effects.

Sometimes writing rules and keep them short isn't easy ...

[graystone]

Several things note that they are verbal like commanding a minion "if not otherwise specified, you issue a verbal command" or speaking like Command Activation "You must be able to speak to provide this component." There are also ones that have the Linguistic trait which assumes speech.

So it's a bit more difficult than just listing a trait. It should most likely say it like Drowning and Suffocation: "If you speak (including casting spells with verbal components or activating items with command components)", so 'A Medium or smaller creature that is grabbed by the crawling hand has difficulty speaking and must spend an extra action to speak (including casting spells with verbal components or activating items with command components).'