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I noticed that the Monster Hunter NPC on Gamemaster Guide pg. 227 has Monster Lore as a skill. I would think that covers just about every Recall Knowledge check for creatures other than common Humanoids, Animals and Plants. Is this something you would let your players take, particularly with something like the Additional Lore feat? If so, would you put limits on how it is used and if so, how?
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As with any Lore, this will invariably come down to a discussion between the GM and the player with Monster Lore.
Personally, looking through the list of Creature Families, most of them don't actually strike me as classic "monsters".
I would just suggest limiting the scope as outlined in the Lore rules. So definitely not something as broad as "other than Humanoids, Animals and Plants".
Maybe pick 2 or 3 Creature Types (like Beasts and Aberrations) and apply Monster Lore to the Uncommon Creatures of those Types, to represent the folk legend status of monsters rarely seen.
One thing to keep in mind is that the broader your lore category the less you get to benefit from reduced DCs. With a Lore as broad as Monster Lore you could even justify increasing the DC by 2 above what the normal identify skill would use.
But also, this probably won't be horribly unbalanced. Getting the skill to auto level to legendary with advanced Lore is great, but Lores don't really have item bonuses for most of the game. And intelligence is pretty much the worst ability score, so rewarding some investment in it (as opposed to wisdom which would normally do nature and religion) seems fine.
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Is this something you would let your players take, particularly with something like the Additional Lore feat? If so, would you put limits on how it is used and if so, how?
I’d allow it,, but I wouldn’t give the “relevant Lore” reduction to DC when using it. Basically the benefit would be that it would let a PC make a check on any creature at all with a single skill.
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I wouldn't allow it. I don't think Lore skills should be broader than entire skills, and Monster Lore could be used in place of any of the six knowledge skills for creature identification.
There's also the issue of balance. If Monster Lore were legit then any character with a halfway decent INT would spend a 1st-level skill feat to get Additional Lore. Even if you were to increase the DC, it's still a high reward for next to no investment.
There's also the issue of balance. If Monster Lore were legit then any character with a halfway decent INT would spend a 1st-level skill feat to get Additional Lore. Even if you were to increase the DC, it's still a high reward for next to no investment.
Yup. Witches and Wizards definitely need more nerf'ing. Would definitely be OP to let them pay a feat to get something less powerful than Bardic Lore. [/sarcasm]
Anyway, I would allow it for things generally seen as monsters. Abberations, Undead, maybe Devils, Demons, and Daemons.
If you're spending a lot of time fighting monsters and don't really need it for other topics, this becomes quite a bit more powerful than Bardic Lore...
For that particular scenario and campaign style (ignoring all other types of knowledge that could be recalled), it becomes slightly more powerful than Bardic Lore because it can be increased past Master proficiency.
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If you're spending a lot of time fighting monsters and don't really need it for other topics, this becomes quite a bit more powerful than Bardic Lore...For that particular scenario and campaign style (ignoring all other types of knowledge that could be recalled), it becomes slightly more powerful than Bardic Lore because it can be increased past Master proficiency.
Master Monster Hunter is the best for this. But that is a level 10 class feat so it should be powerful. As opposed to Bardic Lore or Monster Lore which are cheap in comparison.
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Maybe pick 2 or 3 Creature Types (like Beasts and Aberrations) and apply Monster Lore to the Uncommon Creatures of those Types, to represent the folk legend status of monsters rarely seen.
I like this solution. Or maybe tie the "Monster Lore" to a specific region - whichever represents that PC's / NPC's Background or Homeland?
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Master Monster Hunter is the best for this. But that is a level 10 class feat so it should be powerful. As opposed to Bardic Lore or Monster Lore which are cheap in comparison.If you're spending a lot of time fighting monsters and don't really need it for other topics, this becomes quite a bit more powerful than Bardic Lore...For that particular scenario and campaign style (ignoring all other types of knowledge that could be recalled), it becomes slightly more powerful than Bardic Lore because it can be increased past Master proficiency.
You know, they might have had Master Monster Hunter in mind when they wrote this creature. Giving an NPC Monster Lore takes up a lot less space than giving it an ability that says it can use nature for all monsters. And since NPCs don't have to follow PC rules the Lore being too broad doesn't really matter.
You get Legendary when Bardic Lore hits expert, and get the increases at 3 and 7. It's much better in that style of game.
And that is still only a 4 point difference at most. Which is a pretty large difference - for a pretty small impact on a primarily combat-centered game.
Reminds me of Amhadl's Law. In a complex system, if you want to have significant improvements, improve the most significant parts. A drastic increase in a minor section is still going to be a minor improvement overall.