Wall of Flesh

[Atalius]

What are people's thoughts on this spell? It doesn't seem to have a lot of staying power but would it be good to use as a spell to place directly behind your enemy as your fighting infront of them? Thus not allowing your enemy to escape while the wall makes attacks with it's 'Mouth'? How do people like to use this spell.

[Bast L.]

The "ends its turn next to the wall" is a bit too weak imo. Start would be better. I think mostly everything would see this massive wall of meat with mouths or arms, and be like, "I'm getting the hell away from that!"

It sounds like an awesome spell. Reminds me of 2E AD&D's Living Wall, but that effect timing is so bad. You can't even push someone into it. They have to choose to stay there (unless you grab them).

Also, it should have all the features, not choose 1.

[Atalius]

We have a group of multiple AOO'ers and a character who can grab or trip. Might work.

[Burntgerb]

I play a bard as well - and while the concept of this gross wall of flesh is certainly visually arresting, I think it complicates combat - particularly in smaller battlespaces.

The question I put to myself was "What does this do in a novel way that would help my party?" And I simply couldn't justify taking it. I already have Calm Emotions as a Signature that I can cast that I feel would do a better job of disrupting combatants more securely. (I'll probably take wall of force at later levels.)

So, I took Synesthesia and a Heightened Charm as a Signature at 9th level and anticipate taking Shadow Siphon at 10th. Does this open me up to overloading on mental and emotion effects? Probably - but it's thematic and I'm fine with not having an answer for every possible situation.

[KrispyXIV]

Its a 2 action wall spell, when most are 3.

That alone is a huge relative benefit.

All the other weirdness is just gravy on top of a temporary barrier that fits where you need it to and restricts badguy movement.

[jplukich]

Bast L. wrote:

The "ends its turn next to the wall" is a bit too weak imo. Start would be better. I think mostly everything would see this massive wall of meat with mouths or arms, and be like, "I'm getting the hell away from that!"

It sounds like an awesome spell. Reminds me of 2E AD&D's Living Wall, but that effect timing is so bad. You can't even push someone into it. They have to choose to stay there (unless you grab them).

Also, it should have all the features, not choose 1.

The damage disincentivizes enemies from standing near it which helps with disrupting their turns and potentially with AOO's. They either choose to stay and get hurt or spend actions moving that they may not have already.

[Bast L.]

jplukich wrote:

The damage disincentivizes enemies from standing near it which helps with disrupting their turns and potentially with AOO's. They either choose to stay and get hurt or spend actions moving that they may not have already.

The damage is 1d6 + 5. So, I guess my earlier point wasn't really correct: enemies wouldn't flee from it, except for reasons of being horrified by it.

The main use, of course, is as a wall, but enemies will put a hole through that quickly (no hardness, nearly auto hit). Maybe it gets 1 turn to bite or grab them.

2 actions is better than 3, to be sure, but the range of 20 feet almost requires it, so you can move or reach spell it. I just don't think I would ever prepare this, even if it had all three abilities available, let alone choose 1, and even if it activated at the start of an enemy's turn.

Want a 5th level wall to hold back enemies? Wall of Stone or Wall of Ice (if primal). Want a weird grabbing/hurting terrain problem? Black Tentacles (if occult). Sure, this spell does both, grabbing xor hurting and wall, but it's so much worse at both, that I see it as a "never use" spell.

Which is a shame, because it's interesting sounding.

I'm trying to think of a use case, and keep imagining using it as a hidey-hole inside of a flesh-dungeon. But that only works if it lasts hours (and really, how many flesh-dungeons are there). So, can anyone think of a situation to use this in?

I guess it's a wall for divine casters.

[mogmismo]

Being followed? Cast it behind you and feed it a potion of invisibility.

[Lawrencelot]

mogmismo wrote:

Being followed? Cast it behind you and feed it a potion of invisibility.

That's right, if you choose mouth it can drink potions! This gives quite some options (though it can't move). Oh wait, never mind, it gives one more option besides invisibility, though that could still be interesting: Wall of flesh with dragon's breath.

Would a Wall of Flesh with mouths be able to consume alchemist's elixirs?

[Bast L.]

Lawrencelot wrote:

mogmismo wrote:

Being followed? Cast it behind you and feed it a potion of invisibility.

That's right, if you choose mouth it can drink potions! This gives quite some options (though it can't move). Oh wait, never mind, it gives one more option besides invisibility, though that could still be interesting: Wall of flesh with dragon's breath.

Would a Wall of Flesh with mouths be able to consume alchemist's elixirs?

I might allow it, but it's not by the book. Are you thinking Stone Body Mutagen? Giving it some hardness could help.