Hello guys, i need some help with build for duel(1vs1)
Gold for duel is 800gp, 17 level character and PFS legal materials(not 3rd party)
I want focus on DPR and survival.
One of my ideas is go ZAM4/inquisitor13 to gain ki, wis to Ac, Wis to attack , some flurry bonuses and greater bane.(Wis and Str focused build)
But i know that there are another ways to make good archety, so i want some help
Also, i know that opponent want go with Arcane Archer presige class, so i think magick is allowed
800 gp? If that's not a typo, find a way to destroy or disarm his bow to win. Make sure you have a sling as a backup in case your opponent had the same idea.
800 gp? If that's not a typo, find a way to destroy or disarm his bow to win. Make sure you have a sling as a backup in case your opponent had the same idea.
800gp because we dont use magical armor and weapon. Only if enchantment from class abilities
Destroying or disarming is dirty. I dont want play dirty in this case
OK. Make sure you have that sling in case your opponent sees honour differently though.
Hitting is going to be easy with no defensive items, unless the starting range is extreme - at least 1000'. Damage bonuses may matter more than attack bonuses. If the duel is at extreme range, make sure you get the far shot feat and some flight arrows.
Make sure you know the true seeing spell in case your enemy casts mirror image or greater invisibility or something. If your sense of honour is not offended by doing so you might want to pick up greater invisibility, it's an inquisitor spell.
We can use duff or debuff spell. Not attacking spells.
What are you think about feats and what class to choose?
Inquisitor's fine as an archery class. Not sure about ZAM though; most of its benefits you can just have via feats, and rapid shot + manyshot is better than flurry. It might be different if you were playing from low level, but this is a duel at L17.
So, feats if you do take ZAM? Point blank shot, precise shot, deadly aim, far shot and clustered shots. That leaves you at least 4 for defensive feats, or maybe feats for odd situations like lob shot or war blessing (air).
Feats if you don't? Add manyshot, rapid shot, and you might consider the overwatch style line.
Inquisitor's fine as an archery class. Not sure about ZAM though; most of its benefits you can just have via feats, and rapid shot + manyshot is better than flurry. It might be different if you were playing from low level, but this is a duel at L17.
So, feats if you do take ZAM? Point blank shot, precise shot, deadly aim, far shot and clustered shots. That leaves you at least 4 for defensive feats, or maybe feats for odd situations like lob shot or war blessing (air).
Feats if you don't? Add manyshot, rapid shot, and you might consider the overwatch style line.
I know about point black shot, deadly aim, preace shot and such classic feats. Maybe there feats that i dont know, like overwatch style.
Why you think thar full inquisitor(not multiclassing) is better?
A dip in zen archer gives you little that feats don't and you have plenty of feats by L17.
It's not that pure inquisitor gives you a lot past L13 - you could easily take a dip in medium, as even one level gives you about +3 damage, or a few levels in phantom blade spiritualist could be useful, or there are other dips - but the low level abilities of ZAM are obsolete by L17.
A dip in zen archer gives you little that feats don't and you have plenty of feats by L17.
It's not that pure inquisitor gives you a lot past L13 - you could easily take a dip in medium, as even one level gives you about +3 damage, or a few levels in phantom blade spiritualist could be useful, or there are other dips - but the low level abilities of ZAM are obsolete by L17.
Phantom Blade can be usefull as dip and a full class. If dip, they have different spell list, if full i dont know, can i use phantom blade is ranged weapon
Eldritch Archer Magus, Warpriest, any other class who can full-attack and cast spells in the same round (I'd go Magus, but that's because I know that class better).
As avr said, you're not going to have any trouble hitting the enemy's AC, and they won't have any trouble hitting you. Getting Displacement/Invisibility/Mirror Image/etc going will keep you alive (Seriously if you cast Greater Invisibility and they can't counter it's game over). Or Protection from Arrows, but that's more easily countered by Clustered Shot (which you should have as well).
I'd also take Deflect Arrows just to mess with my opponent - no manyshot for you! (Actually Deflect Arrows plus Protection from Arrows would negate a fair chunk of damage even if they do have Clustered Shot)
With such a low budget about the only thing you are going to be able to afford is your weapon. You are probably spending about 600 of your 800 gold on a 14 STR masterwork composite long bow. That leaves 200 gold for everything else. This completely changes the dynamics of the characters. If you use armor about all you cannot even afford a breast plate as that would leave you no gold to purchase arrows. That means that chain mail is the best armor you can afford. It also means that you are not using stat bosting items. This is something that needs to be considered carefully.
Zen Archer in this case is actually a very good choice. At 3rd level the Zen Archer gets WIS to hit, which means he only needs a 13 DEX to qualify for some of the archery based feats. Without this he has to split his stats between DEX and WIS. He needs a good DEX to hit, but all of his inquisitor abilities are based on WIS. Without a 16 WIS the 17th level inquisitor does not get access to his 6th level spells, and without a good DEX he cannot hit. While taking 4 levels of Zen Archer means he loses access to 6th level spells he still gets the benefit of a higher WIS.
I disagree about the extra feats not being valuable. Archery is a feat intensive combat style and by 17th level a single classed inquisitor can afford them, but that is about it. After taking the basic archery feats the single classed character has 2 spare feats. The Zen archer on the other hand has 7 more feats. He also has point blank master which the single classed character does not qualify for. Because of the low budget of the scenario some ignored feats become very valuable. Dodge for example is one of the few ways to raise your AC. Improved Critical is also very useful when you don’t have magic weapons. Those 7 extra feats are going to be a huge advantage.
Flurry of blows combined with extra attack from spending Ki gives the Zen Archer the same number of attacks as the character using rapid shot and many shot. The Zen archer will have a much better chance to hit because of higher WIS and the extra BAB from using his monk level as his BAB. The Zen Archer will probably be +15/+15/+15/+10/+5 where the single classed character will be +11/+11/+6/+1. If the first hit of the single classed character is a critical hit he will hit twice. The Zen Archer can critical on any of the shots and probably has double the chance to critical due to being able to take improved critical.
I wouldn't bother with a MW weapon. +1 to hit isn't necessary (they have low AC) and it's not worth 37% of your wealth.
I wouldn't spend much on armour either, without magic your armour is probably only stopping the last iterative attack. Chain Coat (75gp) is probably your best bet.
I agree that bonus feats would be useful, but not as useful as 6th level spells.
Depending on the point buy he may need to choose between a decent DEX or 6th level spells. Headbands are out of budget so that means he needs to have a 16 WIS to get 6th level spells. He is also going to want some STR for damage. With the Zen Archer he does not need DEX to hit or for AC.
AC may not be as bad as people think. The Zen Archer will probably have around a base AC of around 19. Judgements can boost it up to 22. Shield of faith can put that to 26. While that is not high by normal standards it is decent given the constraint of no magic items.
One feat that would be really useful in this situation is quicken spell. This will allow him to quickly buff himself. Starting out with a quickened shield of faith and getting a full attack on the first round will be very useful. The second round he can follow up with a quickened divine favor and another full attack.
AC may not be as bad as people think. The Zen Archer will probably have around a base AC of around 19. Judgements can boost it up to 22. Shield of faith can put that to 26. While that is not high by normal standards it is decent given the constraint of no magic items.
Oh, I thought we were talking Zen Archer 17 vs Inquisitor 17.
Yeah 3 levels of Zen Archer to get WIS to everything isn't a bad idea. You lose 6th level spells but still have 5th level spells. Your opponent's saves will be fairly bad, so the loss of caster level shouldn't matter too much.
Alternate idea, be an Occultist. You get a free "cloak" of resistance from Abjuration.
You can get a free "belt" of DEX from Transmutation (you can even get more "belts" of STR/CON if you take Transmutation again). You can enhance your weapon (including Bane) with Transmutation as well.
Then you can go full BAB with Trappings of the Warrior.
You can start the fight with a 45% miss chance without casting anything with Illusion (more with certain favoured class bonuses).
Less actual casting ability (no spell-combat/ferver/etc), but lots of passive bonuses.
Alternate idea, be an Occultist. You get a free "cloak" of resistance from Abjuration.
You can get a free "belt" of DEX from Transmutation (you can even get more "belts" of STR/CON if you take Transmutation again). You can enhance your weapon (including Bane) with Transmutation as well.
Then you can go full BAB with Trappings of the Warrior.
You can start the fight with a 45% miss chance without casting anything with Illusion (more with certain favoured class bonuses).
Less actual casting ability (no spell-combat/ferver/etc), but lots of passive bonuses.
Ocultist with esoteric knight good idea too. Combat feats more usefull than spellcasting is this case
Depending on the point buy he may need to choose between a decent DEX or 6th level spells. Headbands are out of budget so that means he needs to have a 16 WIS to get 6th level spells. He is also going to want some STR for damage. With the Zen Archer he does not need DEX to hit or for AC.
AC may not be as bad as people think. The Zen Archer will probably have around a base AC of around 19. Judgements can boost it up to 22. Shield of faith can put that to 26. While that is not high by normal standards it is decent given the constraint of no magic items.
One feat that would be really useful in this situation is quicken spell. This will allow him to quickly buff himself. Starting out with a quickened shield of faith and getting a full attack on the first round will be very useful. The second round he can follow up with a quickened divine favor and another full attack.
Yes, ZAM gain many ranged feats and attacks from flurry, but i want focus on damage and because of that want take Inquisitor for Bane and Greater Bane
Archer fighter can be solid with Overwatch Style line, but fighter became boring on high levels, because you take all need featt to 11 level