Hi guys,
in a few months i'll be playing a campaing with my friends and i'm taking some free time during summer break to know better pathfinder rules.
The pc I chose is a dwarven warpriest of Irori, fighting with a dwarven giant sticker, it will allow me to be tactical on the field to generate aoo, trip enemies and in the occasion of some buffs, to hit hard. We didn't meet yet for the future company, but we're all very excited so we shared info about the party composition and there will be a paladin, an inquisitor (probably ranged) and a multiclass cleric/sorcerer.
The reason behind reach is to give support as an anvil and double as hammer, stopping and dividing the enemies with reach, aoo and trip and bashing them with power attack and high strenght. For ranged fights I'll use a bow or maybe javelins (i hate dwarves with sword and bow). I hope to be able to use spells outside the combat to help the group because the class is not that useful outside that, with 2 skills point and low int and cha score.
For the moment I chose the arsenal chaplain archetype, to focus on weapon training but I'm still wondering if i'd do better to keep double blessings and sacred armour and go standard. this way I'm tempted that in somepoint I could make good use of gloves of dueling for trip and higher bonus to attack.
This is the build, I have some doubts and question which I'll list belo the stats.
Durenor
LG alignment
25 point buy
STR 17
DEX 16
CON 12 (14)
INT 10
WIS 12 (14)
CHA 08 (06 ouch)
I don't like much the fact that I have low CHA and WIS, but fortunately the warpriest allows me to dump a little these stats, skills and will saves. I'll maximize STR with objects or spells and use healing to cover up the low constitution, the group is also strong in basic healing options.
Traits: reactionary, fate's favoured, militant merchant (for perception as a class skill) and scarred as drawback. I might change this last one for ancestral weapon or glory of old for better saves.
Skills: I have to build some diplomacy at least to counter the low charisma and not being a risk for the group, the rest should be on perception, kn religion. Hardly on acrobatics.
Feats:
1- combat reflexes
1bonus- WF giant-sticker
3- dirty fighting
3- improved trip
5- power attack
6- greater trip
7- furious focus
9- lunge
9- GWF giant-sticker
then in list
divine interference
maybe shield focus and shield brace
fury' fall
felling smash
for even higher levels I'll choose when the campaign goes on and I survive.
I'm in doubt if to change something in level <10 to insert felling smash or fury's fall, or even vital strike, in exchange of power attack and furious focus. Greater trip serves to give some bonus to cmb, which is low for the warpriest and for extra aoo. Furious focus is useful to save the bab which again is 3/4 for the warpriest, but not that low considering divine favour and weapon training, especially at low to mid levels.
vital strike maybe is good considering 2d6 weapon and with access to enlarge person I could add 10,5 damage to each attack when the power attack bonus is usually around 13 points at 8th, not mentioning the second attack.
GWF is also something I might postpone a little.
there maybe need with the inquisitor to select a teamwork feat and that might be paired opportunist, absolutely in line with the build. I'd exchange that for furious focus.
tactics:
I'll be in first line with the paladin, protecting the sorcerer/cleric (hopefully the anvil) which will try to force people to enter my threatened area or go against the paladin (the hammer) and while the inquisitor will pummel casters or other mobs with ranged attacks. I'll use trip and disarm when needed to slow down the assault, reduce someone's power or when we can all exploit the aoo effect and then use power attack to deal damage.
Some questions (I swear Torag that I read so many posts but couldn't clarify these points!!):
1- the brace weapon allows to double damage on a readied action against a charging mob. Since I'm using a reach weapon and the mob is charging, I'll have an aoo when he tries to leave the 10' feet into the 5'feet. The brace property is applied only to the readied action and not to the attack of opportunity (not a readied action), is that correct?
2- If i trip a mob approaching me from 10'feet away and I succed, he falls prone on the square he did the action, so 10' feet, since I interrupted him, right?
3- The mob I'm facing was tripped at 10'feet during his turn while he spent only an action of movement to get closer to me, can he use another movement action to stand up?
4- the mob above was charging me and I tripped him, so does he finish his full round action as prone or he can crawl towards me for the rest of the movement? Can i stop him in the same way if he's charging an ally though my threatened area?
5- when a mob gets adiacent to me, I can use armour spikes to hit him without leaving both hands from the polearm, correct?
6- if I have the improved unarmed strike feat, can I hit him with both hands occupied with legs but not knees or something else?
7- with improved unarmed strike, can I take aoo against him when adiacent?
8- exchange unarmed strike in questions 5 with dwarven boulder helmet, the same applies?
9- with the vicious stomp feat, I can have a second aoo against the mob if I greater trip him prone, but only if adiacent. That feat is not useful to me with a reach weapon if I trip him at 10' feet, since I can't eat that aoo, or is there some way?
10- I can't cast a spell if I have both hands occupied, but during my turn, I can let go of one hand as a free action I can cast?
11- Provided I have shield focus and shield brace, so I can use a masterwork or mithral buckler in my other hand, I do retain the possibility to use the polearm as 2HW and being able to cast but without the bonus to ac from the buckler?
12- If I use a light shield, I can bear the polearm with the shield hand with a free action, lose the ac bonus, cast the spell, retake 2 hand control of the polearm with another free action?
13- CMB is affected by several bonuses that applies to the attack bonus, like divine favour, bonus to strenght, attack rolls, size modifications, weapon enchantment (since it's a weapon attack), feats like weapon focus, bonuses to combat maneuvres like weapon training. In fact how's different from a regular attack bonus?
14- If i have pushing assault and i'm threatening a mob which is adiacent to an ally, I hit and push him 5'feet away, is he now creating an aoo because going out of a threatened square (from my reach and the one of my ally)? the square he gets into is safe for him so valid for the feat.
15- can I combine felling smash and pushing assault? both apply when a power attack is delivered, the first with a swift action to trip him or a regular attack, the other to forego the damage in order to push him away. the mob would be prone at +5'feet distance (or more).
|
2 people marked this as a favorite.
|
1 yes 2 yes 3 if he only used his move action, he can use his standard action as a move action and that move action can be standing up. Which provoked aoo’s. 5 you can, but it can’t be used as an offhand attack during a full attack. 6 most people would say yes, again, not as an offhand attack during full attack. 7 most would say yes. 8 same as (5). 9 your rules interpretation is correct, there are ways to get longer unarmed strikes though. 10 yes
thanks for help,
anybody knows about point 14 and 15?
11)
Shield Brace doesn't work with Bucklers. That would require Unhindering Shield, which explicitly works with spellcasting.
12)
Yes. But you wouldn't lose the AC bonus.
13)
Depends on what kind of maneuver, since most don't use weapons normally. For Trip maneuvers, you can basically see the CMB bonus as a regular attack bonus but with the Size bonus inverted.
14)
Pushing Assault wrote: When you hit a creature your size or smaller with a two-handed weapon attack modified by the Power Attack feat, you can choose to push the target 5 feet directly away from you instead of dealing the extra damage from Power Attack. If you score a critical hit, you can instead push the target 10 feet directly away from you. This movement does not provoke attacks of opportunities, and the target must end this move in a safe space it can stand in. You choose which effect to apply after the attack roll has been made, but before the damage is rolled. 15)
Yup.
Why do you think shield brace doesn't work with a buckler?
baggageboy wrote: Why do you think shield brace doesn't work with a buckler? Probably because Shield Brace calls out 3 shields it works with, and buckler isn't on the list.
|
1 person marked this as a favorite.
|
That would be a very good reason.
|
1 person marked this as a favorite.
|
Amarah wrote: Durenor
LG alignment
25 point buy
STR 17
DEX 16
CON 12 (14)
INT 10
WIS 12 (14)
CHA 08 (06 ouch)
First things first: you're not a real cleric (i.e., who might care about number of uses of Channel per day), and you're a dwarf. If the proclivity of your GM's NPCs is to reflexively treat the mere appearance of your heavenly beardliness with the sort of disdain normally reserved for encountering moist chewing-gum under the desk -- then you might as well dump Cha to 5 and get your build points out of it. Warpriests have absolutely nothing contingent on the stat, and, while Diplomacy is on your class list, I rather doubt you're going to be throwing 50% of your skill points at it to become the "face" of the party.
Try this:
STR 15 (raise 4th, 12th+Manual of Gainful Exercise)
DEX 14
CON+ 18 (dwarf, 16,15,15,14,10,7 25pt array)
INT: 10
WIS+ 15 (raise 8th)
CHA- 5
--I know: everybody likes to jack their strength into the stratosphere, but it really isn't necessary if you have some other gimmick to elevate strength or attack-bonus artificially, such as rage, or, in your case, swift-Fervor'd Divine Favor.
As a front-liner caster, expect to be the priority target. Make Con your highest stat, so long as it doesn't cost inordinately (and it doesn't as a dwarf).
Dex: You need at least a 13 for Combat Reflexes, but generally not more than a 14 since the odds of securing more than two additional AoOs per turn are quite small prior to considerable additional feat investment. So, a 14 Dex is perfect for a plate-wearing character who will sometimes be Enlarged via potion-consumption. (You can also make your reach-weapon Fortuitous.)
Quote: For the moment I chose the arsenal chaplain archetype, to focus on weapon training but I'm still wondering if i'd do better to keep double blessings and sacred armour and go standard. Also check out the Divine Commander archetype; you get a full-level mount and can share Teamworks feats with the recipients being sans prerequisites.
Traits: Fate's Favored(faith), Glory of Old (regional)
Feats:
1: Combat Reflexes, Weapon Focus (from Warpriest)
3: Additional Traits: Accelerated Drinker (combat), Eyes and Ears of the City(religion)*
5: Additional Traits: Magical Lineage(magic), pick one of: [Tunnel Fighter or Zest for Battle](race)
(*Eyes and Ears of the City is better than Militant Merchant because its +1 bonus applies all the time.)
Tactics: drink an Enlarge potion as a move action, and swift-Fervor in the first round. Now you're big with a 3d6 20' polearm. You won't need Improved Trip and subsequently not need Dirty Fighting either, so that saves two feats right there.
Slim Jim wrote: Try this:
STR 15 (raise 4th, 12th+Manual of Gainful Exercise)
DEX 14
CON+ 18 (dwarf, 16,15,15,14,10,7 25pt array)
INT: 10
WIS+ 15 (raise 8th)
CHA- 5
--I know: everybody likes to jack their strength into the stratosphere, but it really isn't necessary if you have some other gimmick to elevate strength or attack-bonus artificially, such as rage, or, in your case, swift-Fervor'd Divine Favor.
As a front-liner caster, expect to be the priority target. Make Con your highest stat, so long as it doesn't cost inordinately (and it doesn't as a dwarf).
The following is a variant array option:
STR 15 (raise 4th, 12th+Manual of Gainful Exercise)
DEX 14
CON+ 16 (dwarf, 15,15,14,14,14,7 25pt array)
INT: 14
WIS+ 15 (raise 8th)
CHA- 5
-- It'll give you twice the skill points, if you think you need those.
ok, so things have changed a little from when posting and we started playing WOTR campaing.
The group is then me warpriest of Irori, a Paladin of Iomedae 2 handed longsword, Inquisitor of Iomedae ranged, Wizard universalist and Half Elven two handed elven curven blade.
We have started now and the group is quite balanced and nice to play.
I decided to go to Irori to have Law and Healing blessings and with reactionary, fate's favoured and exposed to awfulness traits with dependent as drawback.
stats are:
STR 16
DEX 14
CON 16
INT 10
WIS 16
CHA 8 (I couldn't play with less)
so, basically with the reach weapon is all fine, I managed to use the brace against a charge, I have already several aoo and I once made a mistake to attack first an enemy at 10 feet distance which then 5 feet stepped and attacked me without giving me aoo. I wish I had lunge by then or I remembered to prepare the attack instead.
Well, the problem yesterday was about a narrow fight. We were in a dungeon large enough for 1 person and I was leading the group. A demon saw me and charged, I had my aoo bu then he closed me in a corner where I couldn't 5 feet step away and attack again and I had to switchc weapons to fight.
I think this is the only situation when I can't run away and I have to rely on feat like pushing assault (if the creature size is appropriate) to save my ass. I couldn't use acrobatics because with such low int and skill points and armour it's impossible I can manage high rolls.
When I fight in open situations it's quite ok to step back, even if I don't like. How to avoid someone to get adiacent?
Also, when enlarged, how do you manage the donut hole with your primary weapon? I also use spiked armour to threaten close, but it means that I don't have the same damage to hit (and bonus to hit considering wf and gwf).
I will probably invest in a buckler to raise my ac and swift iron style (not sure yet) and most probably vital strike at 6th level (it seems nice considering mythic vital strike).
|
1 person marked this as a favorite.
|
Quote: We were in a dungeon large enough for 1 person and I was leading the group. A demon saw me and charged, I had my aoo bu then he closed me in a corner where I couldn't 5 feet step away and attack again and I had to switchc weapons to fight. That's OK; because you did your job correctly.
The job of the high-AC/high-HP dwarf is to be a blockage in the choke-point, preventing the bad guys from swamping the party and splicking a squishy in one hit. If you do any damage while choke-pointing, that's just gravy. If you whiff for five straight rounds on choke while your archery allies rain fire over your head into the enemy, and nobody else gets hurt -- you are the star MVP. Fervor away your owies, and on to the next encounter.
If you're crowded while Enlarged, take out your dwarven waraxe and chop away. (I like Quick Draw.) Remember that you can Fervor-heal as a swift-action (your warpriest is one of the few classes in the game, aside from paladin, who can do that). If you're running low, drop the Enlarge and switch to defensive-fighting for an instant +3 to +4 to AC (depending upon your dexterity/armor coefficient).
Lastly, since you are the point-man, your AC is more important than your weapon, because you're going to eat a lot more in-bound than you'll get to dish out. (And your kinfolk won't think much of you unless you return from your surface adventuring having Craft Magic Arms and Armor, with all of your gear self-made. They catch you wearing elf-made mithral, you'll be shunned.)
great, thanks for the suggestion!
tell me one, the progression for me seems like this
5th PUSHING ASSAULT (PRO helps avoid full attacks in melee, AGAINST i can melee pretty well with an earth breaker or any other magic item i find)
6th LUNGE (PRO helps with reaching someone out of range and avoid the 5feet step, AGAINST you can do similar reading the attack, plus you don't take ac penalty)
6th alternative, VITAL STRIKE (PRO, with 2d6 weapon i can deal a lot of damage, plus with mythic vital strike I can really use the feat. AGAINST, at 7th level i have accesso to Channel Vigor thanks to Irori and it doesn't apply to full attacks, cleave, aoo or whatever!)
7th level, most probably swift iron style to be able to use full plate armour.
Am I doing wrong to go for more reach improvements?
Amarah wrote: VITAL STRIKE (PRO, with 2d6 weapon i can deal a lot of damage Well, you'll do + ~7 more damage on a move+standard. I like Vital Strike, especially in mobile enlarged barbarian skirmisher builds, but i would say it's only an average feat for a warpriest normally at the head of the line.
Remember that combat is about attrition. Dishing it out is nice, but you also need to attend to your capacity for taking it. Being a high-con/high-saves dwarf helps. Having swift-healing definitely helps. But you still can't be a pincushion.... Slim Jim wrote: Lastly, since you are the point-man, your AC is more important than your weapon If you're on point, not getting hit takes priority over maximizing damage. E.g., you take your one or two giant-sticker stabs, and then the GM rolls nine d20s for the three monsters claw-claw-biting you. So, yeah: "Boring" feats like Shield Focus (which you were "maybe" thinking about at 9th) and Unhindering Shield definitely pull their weight; with those two, and a +2 buckler (as opposed to no shield at all while two-handing), you'd be relatively +4 AC toward those nine d20s, and that AC differential keeps getting bigger the more gold you can throw at the shield.
In fact, it's often better idea to upgrade your shield first until you have a better idea of what your likely long-haul dexterity is going to be, as well as give you time to decide whether or not you'll be getting a special-materials suit, or will save up for Celestial Plate.
|
