Magical Lineage and Spheres


Advice and Rules Questions


I recently learned once again about a trait. Magical Lineage.

Quote:
Benefit: Pick one spell when you choose this trait. When you apply metamagic feats to this spell that add at least 1 level to the spell, treat its actual level as 1 lower for determining the spell's final adjusted level.

I was curious since.. Obviously Spheres doesn't have explicit spells and levels, but I wondered if there was Anything this could do for sphere casters (Especially considering that Metamagic is one of the few places that you can end up paying multiple spell points for a sphere effect other than powerful combination spells)

Shadow Lodge

2 people marked this as a favorite.

Sadly it just doesn't work for a Spherecaster, and that's okay. Most of the time even if you run out of spell points you still have magic you can use, so lower the final number of a metamagic spell isn't necessary.


Dragonborn3 wrote:
Sadly it just doesn't work for a Spherecaster, and that's okay. Most of the time even if you run out of spell points you still have magic you can use, so lower the final number of a metamagic spell isn't necessary.

I guess I just get weird that

1: Even though I love spheres, I'm not really a fan of the idea that concentration takes a standard action (Although for all I know it was ALWAYS a standard action even in Vancian and I just never looked) unless you take a boon just to specialize in concentration, and even then a move action is fairly significant, especially for the gish types (which I very often tend to be), bringing on minor paranoia.
2: Like I said before, Spheres does a fairly good job of making it that you rarely spend more than 1 spell point at a time, and even among talents that do want extra spell points it's usually just 1 at a time (like Powerful Force Blasts or Dual Enhancements that last a minute per CL)

Also not really relevant to the specific topic of magical lineage but I kinda want to know what Blast Type the default destruction blast would be counted under. I'd assume it was a Force group blast (since it's basically raw magic) but also realize that some GMs might object to the strategy of taking energy focus (Default blast), grabbing Crafted Blast, and then getting Force Blast to basically keep the benefits of crafted blast without worrying about its DR drawbacks.

Shadow Lodge

It isn't force damage. It used to be, but it was changed to Bludgeoning damage because an at-will no-spell-point-cost force blast was too strong.

"Energy Focus wrote:
You may only make a destructive blast of a single energy type. You may not gain any blast type talents, except with the bonus talent gained from this drawback.

No picking the default blast for Energy Focus.

Also, yeah, Concentration is a Standard Action and to my knowledge always has been.


Paying actions is the price for not paying some of your daily resources. XD For what it's worth, Easy Focus works well with full casters who can stand in place to concentrate on one thing while hurling other spells with their standard action - and at higher levels, you actually won't run out of spell points very often.

Liberty's Edge

GM Rednal wrote:
Easy Focus works well with full casters who can stand in place to concentrate on one thing while hurling other spells with their standard action

Or mounted spell casters, which I think are a very under appreciated archtype, though they do take jping through some hoops.


Dragonborn3 wrote:

It isn't force damage. It used to be, but it was changed to Bludgeoning damage because an at-will no-spell-point-cost force blast was too strong.

I knew it was bludgeoning. The idea I had was basically grab the Default, the Crafted Blast talent (which just makes the default better) and if it was in the same blast group as Force you could get that 'just in case DR' moment.

Dragonborn3 wrote:
"Energy Focus wrote:
You may only make a destructive blast of a single energy type. You may not gain any blast type talents, except with the bonus talent gained from this drawback.

No picking the default blast for Energy Focus.

Either it was eratta'd or I'm confusing it for Shape Focus.

Dragonborn3 wrote:
Also, yeah, Concentration is a Standard Action and to my knowledge always has been.

Good to know.

GM Rednal wrote:
Paying actions is the price for not paying some of your daily resources. XD For what it's worth, Easy Focus works well with full casters who can stand in place to concentrate on one thing while hurling other spells with their standard action - and at higher levels, you actually won't run out of spell points very often.

Yeah, I mean I definitely get it, just for someone like an unmounted gish it seems like some spells just become useless (Basically anything with concentration at all) (And I'm just the type that REALLY likes gishes)

ShadowcatX wrote:
Or mounted spell casters, which I think are a very under appreciated archtype, though they do take jping through some hoops.

Through some hoops? I'd think it would be just take Conjuration. (Although I'd note that I feel like a wizard on a horse looks kinda silly)


Warriorking9001 wrote:
GM Rednal wrote:
Paying actions is the price for not paying some of your daily resources. XD For what it's worth, Easy Focus works well with full casters who can stand in place to concentrate on one thing while hurling other spells with their standard action - and at higher levels, you actually won't run out of spell points very often.
Yeah, I mean I definitely get it, just for someone like an unmounted gish it seems like some spells just become useless (Basically anything with concentration at all) (And I'm just the type that REALLY likes gishes)

You still seem not to get that anything with concentration is a basically a free spell, as you don't spend spell points. It's not "useless", you just have to spend spell points if you want to do anything else in a round.

Liberty's Edge

Warriorking9001 wrote:
ShadowcatX wrote:
Or mounted spell casters, which I think are a very under appreciated archtype, though they do take jping through some hoops.
Through some hoops? I'd think it would be just take Conjuration. (Although I'd note that I feel like a wizard on a horse looks kinda silly)

I hadn't thought of conjuration, I was thinking of various ways of gaining animal companions.


necromental wrote:
Warriorking9001 wrote:
GM Rednal wrote:
Paying actions is the price for not paying some of your daily resources. XD For what it's worth, Easy Focus works well with full casters who can stand in place to concentrate on one thing while hurling other spells with their standard action - and at higher levels, you actually won't run out of spell points very often.
Yeah, I mean I definitely get it, just for someone like an unmounted gish it seems like some spells just become useless (Basically anything with concentration at all) (And I'm just the type that REALLY likes gishes)
You still seem not to get that anything with concentration is a basically a free spell, as you don't spend spell points. It's not "useless", you just have to spend spell points if you want to do anything else in a round.

I understand that it's not useless, and that's not really what I'm saying. I'm more saying that some builds are much more affected by the concentration cost than others. Like here's an example or two.

Self Buff Gish: a standard action concentration means generally you HAVE to spend a spell point for your enhancements, alterations, aegises, fate words, time hastes, light abilities (Any that can buff you?, etc. to work and let you do other things in the same round (unless you have Familiars, Companions, etc. to help). Easy Focus helps alleviate this somewhat but still has its issues.

More I'm just.. nervous, I guess.

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