Trace Teleport into Greater Teleport


Rules Questions


Can Greater Teleport be used to teleport to a location seen through Trace Teleport? I understand that the brief glimpse of the location Trace Teleport allows is not sufficient for normal Teleport as per the description, but Greater Teleport doesn't need direct observation.

Perhaps the lack of geographic knowledge prevents the greater teleport?

Relevant text:

Trace Teleport wrote:
This glimpse lasts long enough for you to get a brief look at the area, but not long enough to scrutinize it in detail. It doesn’t come with any geographic knowledge of the location, so it is not sufficient for teleport or similar magic. You can’t retry the caster level check, even if you cast trace teleport again.
Teleport wrote:
You must have some clear idea of the location and layout of the destination. The clearer your mental image, the more likely the teleportation works. Areas of strong physical or magical energy may make teleportation more hazardous or even impossible.
Greater Teleport wrote:
This spell functions like teleport, except that there is no range limit and there is no chance you arrive off target. In addition, you need not have seen the destination, but in that case you must have at least a reliable description of the place to which you are teleporting. If you attempt to teleport with insufficient information (or with misleading information), you disappear and simply reappear in your original location. Interplanar travel is not possible.


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I would consider Greater Teleport to be a similar magic to teleport, so that tells me that no, you can't teleport, greater or otherwise, with the information from trace teleport.

Teleport says "You must have some clear idea of the location and layout of the destination. " I think that 'location and layout' are significant, in that they are two different things, both required.

The first, location, is what trace teleport calls 'geographic knowledge.' You have to know where you are going is. Not GPS level coordinates, but you have to basically know where you are going. Layout is the specifics, the room, plaza or whatever that you are going to be arriving at. You have to be familiar with the layout, and know where that layout geographically is.

Greater Teleport removes the need to know the layout as well, but doesn't change the need to know the location.


It seems like otherwise the only use for this spell is to know that a teleport took place within the area and/or have a chance to recognize the destination if the brief glimpse reveals a location you have seen before. Does that seem accurate RAW?

Edit:

Dave Justus wrote:
Greater Teleport removes the need to know the layout as well, but doesn't change the need to know the location.

Reading it again, that seems to be the case.


I think the primary purpose of the spell is to warn you if anyone arrives at, or leaves from, the area via teleport.

The secondary effect, the glimpse at the destination (or origin) point of the teleport is probably only useful if it happens to be somewhere you are already familiar with, or if you find it in the future.

Liberty's Edge

Or to spy the location with clairvoyance.
That spell says "but the locale must be known—a place familiar to you, or an obvious one", so that glimpse can be insufficient.


Diego Rossi wrote:

Or to spy the location with clairvoyance.

That spell says "but the locale must be known—a place familiar to you, or an obvious one", so that glimpse can be insufficient.

the only problem is that clairvoyance has extremely limited range as far as divination spells go. If the location is close enough for you to effectively use clairvoyance then you should already have enough information to teleport there.

as for the usefulness of the glimpse, when someone arrives it's probably enough information for you to know where they arrived relative to yourself. So, even if someone teleports in invisibly you have at least an idea of where you need to be looking/casting glitter dust.

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