Error? Untrained skills get worse as you level

[NotQuiteZombie]

The rulebook explains the following:
>untrained proficiency = level -2
>trained = level
>expert = level +1
>master = level +2
>legendary = level +3

However on page 15 of the rulebook it says the following when determining skill modifiers:
"For the rest of your character’s skills, subtract the
proficiency modifier for being untrained (your level – 2)
from the relevant ability modifier"

So as a level 2 character with +1 in Dex, but untrained in Acrobatics, my skill modifier would be:
>1-(2-2)= +1

But as a level 10 character with the same stats, my skill modifier would be:
>1-(10-2)= -7

This seems completely incorrect unless characters are expected to get worse at untrained skills as they level.

Should page 15 say "add" instead of "subtract" for the proficiency modifier? Even then the sentence isn't correct.

[TheFinish]

NotQuiteZombie wrote:

The rulebook explains the following:

>untrained proficiency = level -2
>trained = level
>expert = level +1
>master = level +2
>legendary = level +3

However on page 15 of the rulebook it says the following when determining skill modifiers:
"For the rest of your character’s skills, subtract the
proficiency modifier for being untrained (your level – 2)
from the relevant ability modifier"

So as a level 2 character with +1 in Dex, but untrained in Acrobatics, my skill modifier would be:
>1-(2-2)= +1

But as a level 10 character with the same stats, my skill modifier would be:
>1-(10-2)= -7

This seems completely incorrect unless characters are expected to get worse at untrained skills as they level.

Should page 15 say "add" instead of "subtract" for the proficiency modifier? Even then the sentence isn't correct.

Yup, this is just bad writing, and probably an oversight. The idea is that for stuff you're Untrained in, your total roll is:

+Ability Modifier+Level-2

It should probably "add" which would be correct, since the proficiency modifier is (level-2).

[Jason S]

I think that was poor wording on their part. They should fix it.

[JW Carroll]

Even if the untrained proficiency modifer is level-2 it still makes little sense. By that logic a high level rogue who has trained their Stealth all the way up to legenday is only 25% better at stealth than a character who has never trained in it at all. While I like the idea of a charavter's overall level improving their skill even when they haven't trained, I think the RAW is an invitation to inflated DCs and it makes skill based PCs like rogues and bards largely redundant. Better in my view to make the untrained proficiency bonus level/2

[Marelt Ekiran]

I would personally go further and just make the untrained proficiency bonus zero. That way, you don't have things leveling up that have no business leveling up (no level 15 barbarians who could win a violin playing contest despite never having seen a violin before).

It also works elegantly in that you can create high level NPCs who are really good at, say, oration or crafting, but don't, for some reason, also have the ability to single-handedly wipe out the King's elite forces. Just don't give them any weapon or armor proficiencies and you're set.