As a big dumb fighter, I finally want to actually help my party...

[VoodistMonk]

I have always played some sort of melee combat focused character. Always.

This game is tailored to the imagination and I want to diversify my portfolio.

That being said, I'm thinking about being an Arcane Duelist Bard for my next character.

I really appreciate the spellbreaker stuff because I hate spellcasters. And I am convinced that having Haste as a spell is better than all of the paladin auras. Plus the penetrating strike stuff is great for later levels.

Obviously going longspear, flagbearer, banner of ancient kings.

My question is if I can forget about power attack to take bard feats and just rely on arcane strike for damage...

I really am trying to branch out of my stereotypical build and I want to focus on being a really good Bard, but I need my melee like a security blanket.

So do I immediately go for grandmaster performer or power attack and Furious focus? Combat reflexes or shield focus and shield brace for a longspear and shield. Flagbearer early for even the small benefits?

I want to help my party, but I am also stubbornly attached to the melee stability of the Arcane Duelist.

I have never played a less than full BAB character so even if it's not the best Bard archetype, I need it because I am a big dumb fighter.

Please help me help my party.

I'm pretty set on grandmaster performer and discordant voice. Other than that, anything you can give me will be greatly appreciated.

[Lady-J]

would recommend base bard, its super solid and unless you know exactly what you are looking for in a bard archetype picking one up can turn a decent character into trash

reach focused bard is a very good start would recomend agaisnt power attack though as while you have baked in to hit bonuses from bard the loss to hit for the pooly scaling damage power attack gives for 3/4 bab users is not really worth it unless you plan on maxing out your to hit stat from the start(having either 20 str or 20 dex at level 1)

now depending on party comp you could also take a look at skald they are bard/barbarian hybrid and can give allies rage powers and is more martial focused imo but there is less synergy between classes with skald

[Zhangar]

VoodistMonk wrote:

I have always played some sort of melee combat focused character. Always.

This game is tailored to the imagination and I want to diversify my portfolio.

That being said, I'm thinking about being an Arcane Duelist Bard for my next character.

I really appreciate the spellbreaker stuff because I hate spellcasters. And I am convinced that having Haste as a spell is better than all of the paladin auras. Plus the penetrating strike stuff is great for later levels.

Obviously going longspear, flagbearer, banner of ancient kings.

My question is if I can forget about power attack to take bard feats and just rely on arcane strike for damage...

I really am trying to branch out of my stereotypical build and I want to focus on being a really good Bard, but I need my melee like a security blanket.

So do I immediately go for grandmaster performer or power attack and Furious focus? Combat reflexes or shield focus and shield brace for a longspear and shield. Flagbearer early for even the small benefits?

I want to help my party, but I am also stubbornly attached to the melee stability of the Arcane Duelist.

I have never played a less than full BAB character so even if it's not the best Bard archetype, I need it because I am a big dumb fighter.

Please help me help my party.

I'm pretty set on grandmaster performer and discordant voice. Other than that, anything you can give me will be greatly appreciated.

My mythic RoW campaign had an angelkin aasimar arcane duelist bard, and he was a beast even before mythic came into play. He pretty much played the character like a magus with support spells, using mirror image, dance of a hundred cuts, and other spells to stay in the thick of things. In short, he had really good melee damage, good support (because bard powers, though he usually favored melee mayhem over direct support), and had the best AC in the party for most of the campaign. (Though he was also one of the few deaths of the campaign - he tended to take his unstoppability for granted, and occasionally got shown up by a bad stroke of luck (like eating a spirited charge lance strike right through his 8 mirror images).)

Using power attack + arcane strike for increased damage is a completely valid option, since you'll be giving yourself a lot of accuracy buffs. Flagbearer early on is probably fine, since that constant +1 will be pretty nice at low levels. I don't know if I'd even care about furious focus, because, again, accuracy buffs.

I can't seem to find grandmaster performer, so no comment there. Discordant voice is damn nice, though.

[Dave Justus]

Arcane Duelist is a solid archetype, and if you want to be more melee focused than the average bard, it is perfect. My only real complaint with it is that you lose versatile performance for feats that I think are a bit situational.

Primary support characters (which is what you are talking about, with a strong secondary melee roll) are most effective when you take the rest of the party into account, although it is hard to go wrong with the Bard chassis. I would though look at the rest of the party before trying to decide whether to focus more on support or personal melee in the early levels, if it is all a bunch of strikers then early support benefits is stronger, if you are with a wizard, a cleric and a rogue you might need to up your personal combat first.

In any event, the build ideas you are looking at are all quite solid, and really you can't go wrong with a flagbearer/banner of the ancient kings bard.

[VoodistMonk]

Thanks for the replies. I am pretty certain that I will have a archery focused ranger with me in the party, but that's the only other character I know of at this time.

At which level should I expect to have the Banner of Ancient Kings?

Since Flagbearer has stipulations on how you hold the banner, which do not work with two handing a longspear, should I hold off on grabbing the feat until I have the banner of ancient kings?

Traits?
Optimistic Gambler?
Reactionary?
There's a trait for +1 initiative and +1 concentration checks, would that help a Bard? Do they cast spells that require concentration checks?

If I drop Furious Focus, I can pick up Improved Initiative nice and early. Which I probably should do.

[Grandlounge]

If you save aggressively between 7 and 8 mid way through 8 is common.

Trait reactionary, memorable, adopted(gnome) collector(sheet music or books).

Reach for the most part should limit the number of concentration check you need to make. Once you are in combat most of the casting you do should be finale spell that do not provoke.

A fun build for your consideration:

If your going longspear I have had fun with Scaled Fist 1 / arcane healer. This lets you have two attacks (crusaders flurry) with your longspear. With this I grab flagbearer at level 7, in time to get the banner.

1.5 STR + 1.5 Power attack + inspire + arcane strike + flagbearer is really good damage

Looking at the overall damage before items at level 7

Bard

2 x (1d8 +6str + 6PA + 2inspire +2AS + 1FB = 21.5)

Barbarian

2 attack one at -5 (2d6 + 9str + 6PA + 2 (assume witch hunter as it's pretty common) = 24)

You are not a barbarian but if you are putting up number that even approach that while buffing the part your doing very well.

[blahpers]

Anybody else look at the thread title and think, "When did Paizo forums adopt agile methodology...?"

[VoodistMonk]

blahpers wrote:

Anybody else look at the thread title and think, "When did Paizo forums adopt agile methodology...?"

The project management practice?