Hello folks,
I've read in some threads on the boards speak about atheism in Golarion, and one mentioned 'an atheist might see gods as overpowered beings', instead of deities.
Now, vampires recoil at the sight of strongly presented holy symbols and/or mirrors.
(Religious background?)
What if an atheist became a vampire? Would he/she ignore the holy symbol or mirror, or recoil at it anyway?
The mirror seems more like something related to their lack of shadow, or possibly a reminder of their new self.
I'm fairly certain that a holy symbol of a deity the vampire's never heard of would work in the hands of a true believer, making it a matter of either the holder's belief or the deities' belief.
If we accept I Am Legend's idea though then an atheist might not recoil from a holy symbol. Reminders of their new self (mirrors) would be as effective and reminders of their past life (family pictures?) might work also.
Given that the gods give their servants powers which can either destroy or control vampires I think there would still be recoiling - even if it was instinctive rather than from a genuine (un)piety.
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Were I an atheist vampire, I'd still recoil. Why? Because that holy symbol is likely to be followed in about one second by a burst of positive energy (which hurts) or possibly an incredible urge to do what the guy waving it says (annoying ability to command undead).
Rules-wise (just to say it and get it out of the way): the belief system of the vampire is irrelevant. They are repelled because the rules say vampires are held back by strongly presented holy symbols. Sorry, just had to get it out of the way.
Were I an atheist vampire, I'd still recoil. Why? Because that holy symbol is likely to be followed in about one second by a burst of positive energy (which hurts) or possibly an incredible urge to do what the guy waving it says (annoying ability to command undead).
The same could be said if it were an arcane caster, instead of a holy symbol waving guy/gal, waving an ominous wand, possibly followed by a scorching ray or fireball. (Which also hurts, and scales faster) Also can do command undead.
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What if an atheist became a vampire? Would he/she ignore the holy symbol or mirror, or recoil at it anyway?
Whether or not an individual in Golarion believes in or respects or ignores the gods, they exist and have power, so the atheist (or dystheist or whatever) shouldn't be any more able to ignore his races weaknesses than one that doesn't believe in the sun or one that doesn't believe in positive energy.
What if an atheist became a vampire? Would he/she ignore the holy symbol or mirror, or recoil at it anyway?Whether or not an individual in Golarion believes in or respects or ignores the gods, they exist and have power, so the atheist (or dystheist or whatever) shouldn't be any more able to ignore his races weaknesses than one that doesn't believe in the sun or one that doesn't believe in positive energy.
This is about what I think on the topic, Though I will say I like AVR's idea of an amnesiac vampire recoiling at things from their personal past as if it were a holy symbol..
Also I feel like there CAN'T be an Atheist in Goralion (without them purposely blatantly ignoring facts. Looking at the dictionary definition,
Atheist: a person who disbelieves or lacks belief in the existence of God or gods.
I feel like it would be impossible to deny that cleric had a connection to the gods in some way by them saying a prayer and summoning holy fire down. Granted I'd find it interesting to see how someone could be come Athiest and flat out deny the existence of the gods in this setting. (Almost reminds me of Darkest Dungeon where it's implied that The Light isn't actually real, and that its magic is created purely by the faith and willpower of the faithful.)
Were I an atheist vampire, I'd still recoil. Why? Because that holy symbol is likely to be followed in about one second by a burst of positive energy (which hurts) or possibly an incredible urge to do what the guy waving it says (annoying ability to command undead).The same could be said if it were an arcane caster, instead of a holy symbol waving guy/gal, waving an ominous wand, possibly followed by a scorching ray or fireball. (Which also hurts, and scales faster) Also can do command undead.
No problem with homebrew. Just way too often I find people trying to homebrew away weaknesses/problems/things they don't like on shaky justifications/rationalizations.
And yes, I'd recoil from the wand too. Fire burns, man, and I didn't become one of the elite (and rare good-looking) undead just to have my face burned off!
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What if an atheist became a vampire? Would he/she ignore the holy symbol or mirror, or recoil at it anyway?Whether or not an individual in Golarion believes in or respects or ignores the gods, they exist and have power, so the atheist (or dystheist or whatever) shouldn't be any more able to ignore his races weaknesses than one that doesn't believe in the sun or one that doesn't believe in positive energy.
This is about what I think on the topic, Though I will say I like AVR's idea of an amnesiac vampire recoiling at things from their personal past as if it were a holy symbol..
Also I feel like there CAN'T be an Atheist in Goralion (without them purposely blatantly ignoring facts. Looking at the dictionary definition,
Atheist: a person who disbelieves or lacks belief in the existence of God or gods.
I feel like it would be impossible to deny that cleric had a connection to the gods in some way by them saying a prayer and summoning holy fire down. Granted I'd find it interesting to see how someone could be come Athiest and flat out deny the existence of the gods in this setting. (Almost reminds me of Darkest Dungeon where it's implied that The Light isn't actually real, and that its magic is created purely by the faith and willpower of the faithful.)
Golorian's atheists are different from ours.
It's like Dr. Who, Curse of Fenris. An Atheist can not strongly present a holy symbol. I would not accept bluff checks for that, but it's a GM call.
Back on topic, Vampires who only recoil from things they believe in are so non standard that they should be called shampires or something.
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Golorian's atheists are different from ours.
I always thought they sounded a bit more like alatrists - folks who acknowledge deities exist but that such entities are not worthy of worship.
An athiest (or alattrist) vampire might have to react to holy symbols because whatever is animating their body now is repelled by whatever forces are behind the symbol the same way two magnets with the same polarity might repel one another.
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Hello folks,
I've read in some threads on the boards speak about atheism in Golarion, and one mentioned 'an atheist might see gods as overpowered beings', instead of deities.
Now, vampires recoil at the sight of strongly presented holy symbols and/or mirrors.
(Religious background?)
What if an atheist became a vampire? Would he/she ignore the holy symbol or mirror, or recoil at it anyway?
The vampire is repelled based on the faith of the one presenting the holy symbol, not the faith (or lack thereof) of the vampire. I recall an old X-Men comic where Kitty Pryde tried to repel a vampire with a crucifix, which did nothing, but the vampire burned when it accidentally touched her Star of David, as she's Jewish, which is where her actual faith laid.
A GM once threw me a bone and let an atheist character of mine repel a vampire by presenting a science textbook to a vampire. That was hilarious.
Golorian's atheists are different from ours.I always thought they sounded a bit more like alatrists - folks who acknowledge deities exist but that such entities are not worthy of worship.
THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU.
I have been trying to find that word for literally YEARS.
Thanks for the replies.
Indagare's one is very interesting, and would probably be best suited, then.