Markov Spiked Chain
|
What count as "class abilities"?
Familiar, AC, and Phantom abilities are all granted by your class, so it seems like they'd count. But arguably aren't from the companion's "class" but from yours. It seems fairly cut and dry, but I want to check before I built a character around it.
I'm specifically asking about:
In addition, when you heal creatures other than yourself using class abilities, feats, spells, and spell-completion or spell-trigger magic items, you restore 1 additional hit point.
Which seems intended to be pretty inclusive.
Would a Life Shaman's Spirit Animal ability effectively give Fast Healing 2?
Would an Involutionist Spiritualist with Life Spirit and Life Link heal 6 with Life Link if the Spiritualist had the trait?
What if the Phantom had the trait (from Extra Traits feat)? I'm guessing the Phantom is the one who needs it.
Would an Eidolon with the Shared Sacrifice Evolution heal an extra point if the Summoner had this trait?
What if the Eidolon had it?
Grandlounge
|
Technically, I would say yes. This would fall in the unintended consequences. That said according to leveling basically everything is a class ability.
When adding new levels of an existing class or adding levels of a new class (see Multiclassing, below), make sure to take the following steps in order. First, select your new class level. You must be able to qualify for this level before any of the following adjustments are made. Second, apply any ability score increases due to gaining a level. Third, integrate all of the level’s class abilities and then roll for additional hit points. Finally, add new skills and feats. For more information on when you gain new feats and ability score increases,
Would a Life Shaman's Spirit Animal ability effectively give Fast Healing 2?
I would say no. The traits says, "when you heal creatures" not "when creatures are healed" so it sounds to me like you have to do something active.
I would say life link works.
A phantom with it would not as a phantom has no class abilities and would be the one doing the healing. A phantom would be both a character and a class feature but would need to be a character with class features to make this work.
Eidolon would fall into the the same category as above for me.
* these are my best guess at a weird set of rule interactions.
Murdock Mudeater
|
What count as "class abilities"?
Familiar, AC, and Phantom abilities are all granted by your class, so it seems like they'd count. But arguably aren't from the companion's "class" but from yours. It seems fairly cut and dry, but I want to check before I built a character around it.I'm specifically asking about:
Scarred by War trait wrote:In addition, when you heal creatures other than yourself using class abilities, feats, spells, and spell-completion or spell-trigger magic items, you restore 1 additional hit point.Which seems intended to be pretty inclusive.
I think they are class abilities, but if the familiar/phantom/eidolon is doing it, then it doesn't qualify for the trait.
Trait says: "when you heal creatures other than yourself using..."
Even if the familiar is your class ability, the familiar is healing the creature, not you. So it wouldn't qualify for the trait. Still a pretty awesome trait.
Markov Spiked Chain
|
@Azurespark, part of the question was whether the familiar/eidolon/phantom needs the trait, or what happens if it has the trait?
Say an Involutionist Life Phantom takes Extra Traits as a feat, and chooses Scarred by War.
"When you heal..." The Phantom has the trait, and is healing with Life Link.
"...a creature other than yourself..." the phantom isn't the one being healed.
"...using class abilities..." that's the definition that's not crystal clear. Life Link is a class ability, the Phantom gets it from a class ability, but I'm not sure if there's meant to be a further restriction there?
@Murdock, for the familiar, the question would be whether you giving the familiar Fast Healing through Spirit Animal counts as "you healing" which is kind of vague. Maybe the familiar gets the ability to heal itself? If I cast Infernal Healing on someone else, would they get the bonus?
| Azurespark |
"...using class abilities..." that's the definition that's not crystal clear. Life Link is a class ability, the Phantom gets it from a class ability, but I'm not sure if there's meant to be a further restriction there?
Sorry, could you tell me how a phantom gets the life link ability? The only one I see with that ability, is the summoner, and it wouldn't trigger the trait in question. But if it has the trait, and heals someone else with a class ability or spell, then yes they would benefit from the trait.
@Murdock, for the familiar, the question would be whether you giving the familiar Fast Healing through Spirit Animal counts as "you healing" which is kind of vague. Maybe the familiar gets the ability to heal itself? If I cast Infernal Healing on someone else, would they get the bonus?
I don't think the animal gaining fast healing only because you choose it as your spirit animal would trigger the trait. But casting infernal healing would, because you are healing another creature with a spell.
Murdock Mudeater
|
I don't think the animal gaining fast healing only because you choose it as your spirit animal would trigger the trait. But casting infernal healing would, because you are healing another creature with a spell.
If you are using the familiar to deliever touch spells that you cast, yeah, that could work. If the spell is being cast by the familiar, then no, because the familiar is casting the spell.
Regarding fast healing, no, I don't think it applies. I agree with grandlounge. I don't think this is intended (or written) to transform fast healing 1 into fast healing 2. In the case of fast healing, you are granting fast healing to the creature, but fast healing is an ability where the creature heals itself. Granting fast healing is not you healing them.
As an aside, a trait is supposed to be worth half a feat. What you are describing is worth easily a feat and maybe more. I think if you persue this on the rules forums, the only likely outcome is to get your trait nerfed....An outcome I'd rather not see, since it's a very good trait as is with only adding 1 HP to cure spells.
Markov Spiked Chain
|
@Azurespark, the Involutionist Spiritualist gives the phantom a Shaman Hex. And looks awesome, which is why I started down this road. :)