I think its gonna be one of those RAW Hard no
RaI depends on what DM says situations.
Well maybe holding but certainly not wielding.
Action economy wise it isn't much different from a handy haversack. He will need to drop where we is in his main hand as a free, swap the wand/net over as a free, but then his main weapon is on the ground so he needs to use a move to pick it up...
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
It's historically sound. Soldiers using shields used to carry things in their shield hands. Two or three throwing spears was common, as were torches or lanterns. The scots developed a fighting style where a long dagger was held in the shield hand and used simultaneously with the shield.
Most relevant to you is probably the Retarius gladiator, who used a trident and a net. Both were used in one and two handed styles, simultaneously.
...Most relevant to you is probably the Retarius gladiator, who used a trident and a net. Both were used in one and two handed styles, simultaneously.
Citation?
I guess the thing to keep in mind is this:
In the real-world, sure, it makes perfect sense to be able to hold two small objects in one hand. People do it all the time.
In game, allowing a PC to hold two items in one hand can require the GM to make a lot of tricky judgment calls on just how big or heavy the two items are. There will be obvious "sure" cases and obvious "no way" cases, but a lot of stuff in between. In some groups, GM discretion on this sort of thing is cool, but in others it can lead to annoying in-game arguments.
Don't want to get too carried away with the rules, lest your character be left with the inability to pick up handfuls of pebbles or nuts or something.
...(can't use it without dropping both hands items clearly)...
Nothing that says you need both hands to use a net so you'd only have to drop the wand not empty both hands.
A 6lb net with its 10' of trailing rope isn't really like a light shield which straps to your forearm and allows you to hold an object. It also needs to be folded in a certain way to be used and can entangle a creature one size larger. So I'm not convinced it's obvious you should be able to hold both. A net is a lot of clutter, unlike say a javelin, torch or dagger which are basically tubes.
...Most relevant to you is probably the Retarius gladiator, who used a trident and a net. Both were used in one and two handed styles, simultaneously.Citation?
Roman history? They kept pretty detailed records of training techniques, as well as poetic descriptions of matches. It's hard to say exactly how they were used, but combat scholars have done pretty impressive recreations. There's a ton of them on youtube (though most are badly filmed and badly performed). There's also some very cool Retarius fights in the Spartacus TV show.
Roman history? They kept pretty detailed records of training techniques, as well as poetic descriptions of matches. It's hard to say exactly how they were used, but combat scholars have done pretty impressive recreations. There's a ton of them on youtube (though most are badly filmed and badly performed). There's also some very cool Retarius fights in the Spartacus TV show.
I was sort of angling for something more specific as I studied the Roman era and it's archaeology at University. But thankyou anyway.
This could be one of those differences between hold and carry. You can hold one item but carry as many as makes sense.
The first time I posted the link didn't take. I just fixed it.
Wikipedia's entry on the Retarius fighting style is pretty detailed, with lots of supporting links.
This could be one of those differences between wield and carry. You can hold one item but carry as many as makes sense.
Slight fix, for the sake of game terminology accuracy.
Other than that, yeah, you're completely right.
..Nothing that says you need both hands to use a net so you'd only have to drop the wand not empty both hands.Well...
"Normal: A net is a two-handed ranged weapon."
Yet no mention of two hands in the weapon description in either the CRB or the UE? We tend to only play Core so I hadn't read that feat before. How strange! Worth a FAQ maybe? though the UE has so many weapons that need clarifying it might take a while.
Not really finding much on this subject and DM is also not too sure. Can you hold two items in one hand if it makes sense being able to hold them both. I'm wanting to be able to hold a net (can't use it without dropping both hands items clearly) and then be gripping a wand as well (also persumably can't use unless shifted to main hand) while wielding something in your main hand?
I'd say holding, yes, as long as the items have a decent shape or size... but using those items is a completely different thing.
I see no problem on holding a wand and hauling a net with a couple fingers (same as you sometimes hold a plastic bag and your house keys because your other hand has even more plastic bags)... but trying to open the g~~@@~n door of your house this way may be difficult.
So, hold yes, but normally you won't be able to "use" the held items, you would need a "dedicated hand" for that.
Of course, if "holding" is enough to "use" or "activate" an item (for example, holding a lit torch or something that only needs to be in contact with your hand or skin, or whatever...) then those should work normally
A 6lb net with its 10' of trailing rope isn't really like a light shield which straps to your forearm and allows you to hold an object. It also needs to be folded in a certain way to be used and can entangle a creature one size larger. So I'm not convinced it's obvious you should be able to hold both. A net is a lot of clutter, unlike say a javelin, torch or dagger which are basically tubes.
Functionally speaking, there's very little difference between the way a net was used as an offhand weapon by roman gladiators and the way a cloak was used as an offhand weapon by fencers.
They were both one handed weapons that were primarily defensive in nature, used to catch weapons, distract, bind up and snag opponents. The main difference is that nets sometimes get thrown (with one hand), and sometimes had a trailing rope.
It's another excellent example of ways the system does not model how weapons were actually used at all. Personally, I recommend house-ruling nets to be one handed. Same with spears and tridents. Putting a weapon's intended, actual use behind a feat tax is pretty silly.
Tridents are one handed which makes a net being 2H even more bizarre.
Hoplites would be equally handicapped as their 7' dorys would render them unable to hold a shield (at least in core).