So I post a lot, half of my entertainment from the game is building a character since I rarely get to play. I typically make a PFS once a month if very lucky. I currently have a level 8 archer inq and a level 3 swash/investigator. I like the generalist route but finding the investigator is taking a long time to come online and really I made him to be a back up face...but finding I'm not a big fan of talking in character :P
So I'm trying to make a character that would be solid throughout the game, preferably with some input out of combat. Since I have the other two I'm leaning towards a big weapon user (Think Guts, Cloud or Orson from record of lodoss).. Trying to avoid 2+ int unless int is a main factor. Thoughts right now is a straight occultist (lead blades for the win) I like the vibe but kinda feel dull. Was thinking about just doing a barbarian but raging is soso to me. Even thought about bringing back my idea of a skald/bloodrager. Ideas would be welcomed. Even tinkering with a full caster...always like the reach cleric (with summoning) but always felt like the 2+ int was too hard of a hit
Herald caller clerics get 4 base skill points and are obviously into summoning. If they worship Shelyn they get to use a glaive, which is a big reach weapon, otherwise they could use a long spear for reach.
If you really want skill points though an empiricist investigator is probably the answer. An inspired longspear is a solid enough big weapon too.
Yeah doing the empiricist with a dip in inspired swash...using longarm he has made himself a reach rapier user :) Big thing I'm aiming for is something different than the others
Well, after level 5, fighters can spend a feat to grab advanced weapon training and stop being a 2+ class.
The interesting thing here is the list of weapon groups that give diplomacy. The notable ones are: hammers, heavy blades, and polearms.
So all of the nice 2 handed weapons.
Right, missed that character above.
Strong silent type with a big weapon, not a face, no rage, some out of combat stuff, for PFS.
A ranger could work for you. The guide archetype avoids having to deal with having the wrong favored enemy which I rather like. The two-handed weapon style has pushing assault as a 2nd level option which could be interesting with a reach weapon. They have a number of minor out of combat abilities besides base 6 skill points. It should play quite differently to an inquisitor or a swashigator.
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Ranger or slayer work fine. The Headsman's Blade is kinda nifty, still trying to come up with a neat character around it.
Ranger or slayer work fine. The Headsman's Blade is kinda nifty, still trying to come up with a neat character around it.
Interesting. You'd want at least one level of slayer, 1d6 sneak attack and you'd almost have to have invisibility that you could activate as a swift or move action, or hide in plain sight. Slayer 1 / (Ninja or Eldritch Scoundrel) X perhaps? Or Velvet Blade Slayer 7 / Ninja 2 / VBS +X. A Slayer with at least one level of Shadowdancer could work too.
Hmm slayer might be fun, was looking at doing str based two weapon fighting. Second weapon would be expensive but still.
For a Str-based TWF ranger or slayer, a double weapon is probably a good choice: allows switching between using one end as a two-handed weapon or both ends as a light and one-handed weapon (without needing other feats or magic to store/retrieve one of the "weapons"), can hold the double weapon in one hand to have a "free hand" for other actions (again, without needing other feats or magic), counts as a single weapon for feats, and some of the double weapons have characteristics that may be useful (meteor hammer can be used with reach as a two-handed weapon or without reach as a double weapon, quarterstaff has the Quarterstaff Master feat chain and can be made into a spell-trigger item, orc double-axe is treated as a martial weapon for half-orcs, etc.). The drawback of double weapons is that they seldom have "good" critical threat ranges/multipliers (other than one of the ends of the gnomish hook-hammer being x4), lagging behind the "best" weapons for DPR.
For a Str-based TWF ranger or slayer, a double weapon is probably a good choice: allows switching between using one end as a two-handed weapon or both ends as a light and one-handed weapon (without needing other feats or magic to store/retrieve one of the "weapons"), can hold the double weapon in one hand to have a "free hand" for other actions (again, without needing other feats or magic), counts as a single weapon for feats, and some of the double weapons have characteristics that may be useful (meteor hammer can be used with reach as a two-handed weapon or without reach as a double weapon, quarterstaff has the Quarterstaff Master feat chain and can be made into a spell-trigger item, orc double-axe is treated as a martial weapon for half-orcs, etc.). The drawback of double weapons is that they seldom have "good" critical threat ranges/multipliers (other than one of the ends of the gnomish hook-hammer being x4), lagging behind the "best" weapons for DPR.
The choice for ranger TWF weapons each have their pros and cons:
1. Two light weapons
+simple, common, easily found in loot.
+can use weapon focus
+can have good stats (such as kukri)
-can't get a free hand (unless cestus)
-can't two hand
2. Double weapons
+can go 2 handed or two weapon as needed.
+can hold it in one hand when you need to do other things.
+can use weapon focus
-usually poor stats.
-often weird weapons, hard to find
3. Using a cestus and a 1 handed weapon
+can 2 handed the 1 handed weapon, or separate for TWF
+can hold things
+can have decent stats (cestus has 19-20/x2, and you can grab a scimitar
+the one handed weapon can be something common.
-can't take specific feats like weapon focus on improved critical. Or at the least, it costs twice as much.
I'm a big fan of in game pets and would think that having one could give you a little more flexibility in regards to skills and combat abilities. An Evangelist Cleric with the Animal domain could be a pretty good jack of all trades who fills in whatever the party needs in a particular scenario (two-handed weapon, buff, heal, meat shields). Preaching about your deity could even add a (potentially amusing and or annoying) roleplaying angle.
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Ranger or slayer work fine. The Headsman's Blade is kinda nifty, still trying to come up with a neat character around it.Interesting. You'd want at least one level of slayer, 1d6 sneak attack and you'd almost have to have invisibility that you could activate as a swift or move action, or hide in plain sight. Slayer 1 / (Ninja or Eldritch Scoundrel) X perhaps? Or Velvet Blade Slayer 7 / Ninja 2 / VBS +X. A Slayer with at least one level of Shadowdancer could work too.
Assassinate requires sneak attack and your target can't recognize you as an enemy. The most straightforward method to me seems to be to go invisible before the rest of the party kicks in the door. While they face the enemy from the front you sneak through their lines and attack from behind.
I've been thinking about doing it in PFS, a regular Ring of Invisibility should be affordable around level 9.
Mainly, I wanted to reach Slayer 1 to take the actual Assassinate talent.
A Evangelist cleric is pretty nice but it always comes down to the 2+ int. Also my inquisitor/archer took the feather domain :)
Forgot about the fact that the twf kinda kills your offhand for grabbing things or if you have the ability to cast a spell...not to mention the added cost of having to purchase another weapon.
Headsman blade is pretty cool but nervous of the 1x per day.
Kinda tinkering with two ideas right now:
Occultist...mainly a greatsword with lead blades he would be at 3D6...trying to remember if there was something bad about taking the reliquarian.
Another option is the bloodrager dip at one and skald the rest of the way...basically with his raging mouse on his shoulder by level 3 he would get +8 str and con while using his raging song (half orc and amplified rage) he would break the rule and be semi sociable but he sure would be hurting things.
You could probably turn the 'raging mouse' into a capable combat critter with a few feats like Mauler's Endurance and Undersized Mount. Depending on how the rules for Muleback Cords and encumbrance interact you might even be able to fly around on a hawk or owl.
You seem to value skill ranks a lot. Is there anything in particular you're concerned about there?
I've said it before, and I'll say it again... Strength Patron Witch + Eldritch Knight. Divine Favor to buff like a Battle Cleric. Loads of casting. Option of using Artful Dodge to go TWF with INT. Loads of skill-points. Very interesting non-combat Hex uses like Tongues and Feral Speech. Armor covered by Arcane Armor Training and/or Shielded Mage. Awesome Witch-Warrior flavor.
I basically play mainly PFS and rarely so I pretty much rarely see the same party twice, So I like the idea to cover as many options as I can. Kinda thinking a scorpion, +4 init is pretty nice. I'm still tinkering...want some options mainly.
@Badbird maybe I'm missing something I've tried to make that character a couple times but doesn't click
Well, you can start Barbarian/Bloodrager, Fighter or Swashbuckler 1 depending on what style of combat and feats you're going for, then take 5 to 6 levels of Witch (or up to 8 if going for Synergist pounce), then go EK. You almost certainly take Arcane Armor Training and/or Shielded Mage if you're Strength-based.
Beyond that it's pretty open; Strength Patron Witch combat buffs make combat quite effective and don't take that much to use. Hexes are generally just utility. DEX-based can run with Swashbuckler rapier or two-handed elven curved blade, or even archery/melee. STR-based can go two-hander, or two-weapon, or two-weapon with a shield, or two-weapon with sword/unarmed/claw. There's also full-on natural attacks or Vermin Shape. DEX or STR can be feat intensive, or Swashbucklery, or Raging. You can split stats to have high INT for spellcasting, or just focus on buffed combat and ugility. Your familiar can potentially go Mauler Archetype and contribute to battle; you can even ride it with Undersized Mount.
Maybe the most strange and potent trick is to take 8 levels of Synergist Witch and Improved Familiar: Silvanshee, and have flying pounce attacks when merging with your familiar. Great with two weapons.
Forgot about the fact that the twf kinda kills your offhand for grabbing things or if you have the ability to cast a spell...not to mention the added cost of having to purchase another weapon.
There are several types of TWF that keep your off-hand free enough to cast. My favourite is using a light (spiked) shield. Sure, it isn't the greatest possible weapon (although if you take the feats for it, it becomes pretty scary) but you can cast spells, and your defense is surprisingly good. Plus, sword and shield is to me one of the iconic ranger styles - I know most people think of Drizzt, but who taught HIM how to be a ranger, and how did he fight, eh?
As for the headman's blade, the assassination attack is a gimmick, but for a slayer (or a sanctified slayer inquisitor) looking for a two-hander the weapon is just great. Do note that the enhancement bonus increases against any studied target, to me this is the main draw.
Missed that +2 for a studied target, that does make it more appealing. Sword and shield would be fun to do.. tough call between slayer or ranger...but str based two weapon..add studied and sneak attack.. My archer inquisitor took that archetype with a bow it is really nasty.
@Badbird...I was tinkering with the one level of fighter and then witch...just felt like the hit/ac/hp was pretty low...maybe I'm just paranoid when it comes to melee or maybe I missed some critical things (didnt delve into feats like I should have) Also feels like there will be a heck of a wind up to get it online.
Using level 8 as a comparison without magic items (but with "most likely on" abilities) I need to go back in on the witch/full caster and tinker with the slayer/ranger...dont seem to run into many wilderness people in pfs. Skald right now is really nice atm at level 8 he would be hitting +14/+14/+9 at 2d4+16 (18-20) along with fast healing 4... he would have/give allies +3 to saves and +2 damage against spellcasters..at 9 he would get another rage power and everyone would get dr 1/-
For Ranger, the Guide Ranger Archetype grants a nice alternative to Favored Enemy - sort of like Favored Enemy as a Paladin Smite. Takes the random out and grants a reliable bonus to shred with two weapons when you want to.
@Badbird...I was tinkering with the one level of fighter and then witch...just felt like the hit/ac/hp was pretty low...maybe I'm just paranoid when it comes to melee or maybe I missed some critical things (didnt delve into feats like I should have) Also feels like there will be a heck of a wind up to get it online.
Well level 1 is just martial, and by level 3 you're ready to start buffing with +2 attack and damage from Divine Favor. Mage Armor works until you upgrade to Arcane Armor Training, or it works for a long time if you're DEX. By level 4, you're able to cast False Life for hours, and maybe Ironskin for minutes if you have a chance. Arcane Strike can be a handy bonus (depending on how your build is going to work later with swift actions). The spell Ill Omen is a great no-save from level 1 on (later you can horribly abuse Quickened Ill Omen with the right build to curse while fighting).
Starting with a level of Urban Bloodrager means you have Rage that doesn't lower AC; you can use it for STR or for DEX. If you aren't going with a feat-intensive build, then you can afford the Extra Rage and possibly Mad Magic to cast while raging (though casting is usually over when rage starts anyhow). A DEX build can use Urban Bloodrager for DEX (or for STR until DEX damage comes online).
Starting with a level of Fighter gives you the feats to quickly pick up a fighting style. Take a level of Unarmed Fighter and you can grab Improved Unarmed and Dragon Style plus Two-weapon Fighting (and Artful Dodge for TWF if you need it). Then you grab the Nails Hex and Arcane Strike, and by level 3 you're buffing with +2 attack and +3 damage on single attacks with a weapon in two hands and weapon/dragon/claw full attacks.
Overall, a classic elven curved blade DEX-based character is probably simplest to get going, but there's lots of good options.