Bruno the Battler, a human, is hit with a Baleful Polymorph spell. He misses both saving throws and turns into a fish with all the permanent changes including having the CHA, INT, and WIS of the fish.
Bruno the Flounder dies soon thereafter.
A druid comrade of Bruno's casts Reincarnate on him.
What happens??
Does Bruno the Flounder still count as a humanoid (albeit with a permanent effect upon him) or is he now a flounder that might come back as sea bass, halibut, crab, or some such?
If he does come back as a humanoid, say an elf, is he now an elf with the CHA, INT, and WIS of a fish, or does he go back to his human mental stats?
I understand that Reincarnate gives Bruno a new body for which "all physical ills and afflictions are repaired". I don't know whether or not Baleful Polymorph counts as a "physical ill" or "affliction". (My guess is that it does, but I'd like to be sure).
Or the answer might be held in: the spell "creates an entirely new young adult body for the soul to inhabit FROM THE NATURAL ELEMENTS AT HAND" [emphasis mine]. So are the elements at hand fish remains because that's what they are now, or are they considered still human remains with a permanent magic effect on them that does not change their true essence?
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Fun question, but it is the first.
A pholymorph spell never change your type, so Bruno is still a human.
Reincarnate remove the pholymorph effect too, as that is an effect that affect someone physical form and you are creating an entirely new form. the mental damage stay.
Note that the "natural elements at hand" aren't necessarily the dead body. You only need a small portion of it. If you are reincarnating someone and have only a finger it work perfectly. The spell use the organic and inorganic matter in the area to create a new body, not the previous creature remains.
Thanks, Diego. The not changing of type is a piece I was missing.
But I'm not sure I'm tracking what you're saying about "the mental damage stay".
So he does come back as a humanoid, but he continues to have the mental faculties of a fish?
As for the remains, even if he lost a finger before being polymorphed, Reincarnate reads "the portion receiving the spell must have been part of the creature's body at the time of death", so the only remains available at the time of death are fish parts.
(I didn't want to overly complicate the questions, but in the game the group elected to EAT Bruno the Flounder and use the reincarnate on the flounder bones.)
I can't remember the exact mechanical reaction but doesn't the baleful polymorph dispell after the target dies, so if you kill a mouse when it dies it turns back into its original form, dead? But I've seen it ruled both ways and I don't think there's a FAQ about it.
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Well reincarnate has flavor text about reincarnated losing some of their memories(they only recall "majority" of their past life), so maybe when he comes back he'll be confused about whether his past life was human or fish? xP Like he still remembers everything, but remembers being a fish for some reason
I can't remember the exact mechanical reaction but doesn't the baleful polymorph dispell after the target dies, so if you kill a mouse when it dies it turns back into its original form, dead? But I've seen it ruled both ways and I don't think there's a FAQ about it.
Nope, this doesn't happen. It happens for lycanthropes, and for someone using the 3.5 version of the polymorph spell.
Ah 3.5 of course. I'm guessing that's why some GMs run it that way; legacy.
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Thanks, Diego. The not changing of type is a piece I was missing.
But I'm not sure I'm tracking what you're saying about "the mental damage stay".
So he does come back as a humanoid, but he continues to have the mental faculties of a fish?
As for the remains, even if he lost a finger before being polymorphed, Reincarnate reads "the portion receiving the spell must have been part of the creature's body at the time of death", so the only remains available at the time of death are fish parts.
(I didn't want to overly complicate the questions, but in the game the group elected to EAT Bruno the Flounder and use the reincarnate on the flounder bones.)
The finger example was to explain how little material you need from the old body. For Bruno it can be a fin or even some scale. But you sill get a full sized creature, so the new body isn't made by parts of the old body. Reading the spell I don't feel that it use any part of the "dead creature touched" that is its target.
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Reincarnate say: "all physical ills and afflictions are repaired." Having your psyche damaged and your mental faculties changed in those of a fish isn't a physical ill.
As I read it, reincarnate will heal the damage from mummy rot and probably remove it (it is both a disease and a curse, so that is questionable), give you back any lost body part, remove physical addictions, and several other nice things, but it will not cure pure mental damage unless it is a direct effect of a disease.
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Edit:
I see I still have some baggage from previous editions of the game.
I was sure that the spell said that the damage stay even if the target of baleful polymorph is turned back to normal. But now that text is missing. So simply dispelling baleful polymorph would cure it.