Hello Paizo Community
My gaming group started playing Skull and Shackles. We are on the second book,Minor spoilers, we have our own ship now and have started to be real pirates. Here in lies the problem we started to run across. I am the Captain and I am Chaotic Good. Only one more member of my party is CG too. The rest are a form of neutral. I wanted to set up rules of us being pirates. So we all agreed no taking of slaves to be sold, since spoiler we were pretty much slaves in the start of the campaign. Second was no raiding coastal towns. Which I felt was wrong as a CG player. But was not popular among my crew. I said we can raid any ships on the sea cuz they know the risks when they set sail. But do the people along the coast also know the risks of living there? I was saying but there are women and children in coastal towns. Where as the other members said but we are pirates. That is the first question would a CG person raid coastal towns even though the risk to civilian women and child be high?
Then our Gm threw us a curve ball. We raided a ship and it was full of slavers and down right scum. But we didn't know that till they surrendered. Most of the crew wanted to kill them but I wanted to turn them in to the law or back into the towns they raided. Which my party said they would hang us too for being pirates. I couldn't really just turn my back and let them be killed by my crew cuz they laid down their arms and gave up. We ended up leaving them on an island that was in the middle of nowhere with very lil food or water. As a CG captain could I have ordered them executed? That is my second question?
This session had lots of yelling and fighting back and forth. Which is great role playing but it started to get where the players where going to have to fight each other. Should I just change my Alignment to ensure we can embrace the full range of pirate fun?
This is one of the reason why I prefer Pathfinder over any other role playing game. The level of thought that I am putting into this game is way more than I have ever with any other game. Well written stories that push us to what it means to be Good or Evil. Please put your opinions down because I am writing this three weeks after we played mentioned game and everyday this crosses my mind.
Thank you Paizo for ruining my life
Love always
Captain William Wavewalker
So...my advice would have been (if you had asked before the campaign started) to have everyone either be neutral or evil, not good. Skull and Shackles lends itself best to neutral or evil parties, not good. You don't see a lot of good pirates in fantasy. And if you wanted a good party for the game, it would have been wise to get everyone on board with that.
When I played S&S and everyone was either CN, NN, or CE.
For what it's worth, deserting someone on an island is basically a death sentence. So despite you thinking it's not as bad as killing them yourself, it's actually probably worse as they start to starve to death and then start to kill each other over their ever diminishing resources.
You're the Captain aren't you? I was DMing a game with a NG Captain-PC and a LE PC. The Captain said we don't kill that, they didn't kill that.
You're the Captain aren't you? I was DMing a game with a NG Captain-PC and a LE PC. The Captain said we don't kill that, they didn't kill that.
The in character problem is that him being captain only exist because they other players agree to it, and if their characters start disliking that too much they would probably mutiny.
Well consider that real pirates were democratic before any other Europeans and the captain is voted into office by the other crew, so if the crew is unhappy, they vote the captain out and vote in a new captain. As a captain, you cannot truly force your crew to your alignment point of view, if they don't agree with it. Of course, you might not be running your pirate band like true pirates, and not allow voting...
One option would be to start having this life harden you and change to CN. Or at least have CN tendencies.
As a CG character, it would be appropriate to execute slavers. Slavery is evil, and as a CG captain it's your duty to rid the world of this evil yourself. Turning them into a town's authority would be the lawful thing to do.
If you look on yourself as a vigilante, ridding the world of evil is the right thing to do. It might make you not so welcome by other pirates, but if you're good enough, they'll fear you.
Figure out what your character would do, and accept alignment shifts as needed. If that requires a new deity, Besmara is a good choice.
You're the Captain aren't you? I was DMing a game with a NG Captain-PC and a LE PC. The Captain said we don't kill that, they didn't kill that.The in character problem is that him being captain only exist because they other players agree to it, and if their characters start disliking that too much they would probably mutiny.
Ok, the thing is that usually a pirate captain owns the ship and the others work for him, and his word goes. At least thats what it was in my campaign.
That said from personal experience, having spend a year arguing with the neutral party of &^(*^%&%^$^ with my lawful good cleric I really find it tiring and annoying. But if you like the roleplay keep the alignment even if you lose the captains position, if it tires you and you can, switch alignments, or roll a new character.
And you can embrace quite a bit of pirate fun, if your DM doesn't throw such stuff your way continuously.
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HAHAHAHAHA! They're pirates. Who lawfully owns the ship means little to them. The captain maintains his position by being elected and being strong enough and smart enough that his men want to follow him.
If his men don't like the captain or what the captain does, they mutiny.
Just like what happened in the first book of S&S.
Thank you all for the feed back. In the long run it will be easier to change my alignment. I did like the role playing up to a point then it sorta just drags the game down and we spend two hours yelling each other points back and forth.The other members just get bored of that. I found it to be a very good topic to talk about. I know that in the inner sea pirates the Andoran have pirates and that is what I was trying to sorta base my guy after.
Thank you all for the feed back. In the long run it will be easier to change my alignment. I did like the role playing up to a point then it sorta just drags the game down and we spend two hours yelling each other points back and forth.The other members just get bored of that. I found it to be a very good topic to talk about. I know that in the inner sea pirates the Andoran have pirates and that is what I was trying to sorta base my guy after.
So, it's worth noting that those aren't actually pirates. They're privateers with the backing of Andoran.
Which basically means that Andoran says they can steal from anyone who isn't with Andoran. Effectively it's a privately owned warship for the government to steal from trade vessels of other governments. It is similar to being a pirate, but not the same.
In S&S you do not have the backing of a government, and so you're not a privateer.
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Also for what it's worth, my group made a modified article of agreement (much like pirates would actually have) that you may want for your own use, here is an except:
The Articles of Agreement
Every crew member has a vote in affairs of moment; has equal title to the fresh provisions, or strong liquors, at any time seized, and may use them at pleasure, unless a scarcity (not an uncommon thing among them) makes it necessary, for the good of all, to vote a retrenchment.
That every crew member shall obey his commander in all respects, as if the ship was their own, and as if they received monthly wages.
The fund of all payments under the articles is the stock of what is gotten by the expedition, following the same law as other pirates, that is, No prey, no pay.
That no crew member shall open, or declare to any person or persons, who they are, or what designs they are upon; and any persons so offending shall be punished with immediate death as determined by the Captain and the Majority of the Company
In the prizes taken, it is severely prohibited to every one to usurp anything, in particular to themselves. Yea, they make a solemn oath to each other not to abscond, or conceal the least thing they find amongst the prey. If afterwards any one is found unfaithful, who has contravened the said oath, they are subject to punishment as determined by the Captain and the Majority of the Company.
Persons that shall be found Guilty of Cowardice in the time of engagements, shall suffer what Punishment the Captain and the Majority of the Company shall think fit.
No crew member shall hide his abilities from the crew, e.g. A sailor who can perform magic shall use his abilities on behalf of the ship.
That no person shall go on shore till the ship is off the ground, and in readiness to put to sea.
The lights and candles to be put out at sunset: if any of the crew, after that hour still remained inclined for drinking, they were to do it on the open deck.
No striking one another on board, every quarrel is to be ended on shore, using what arms they posses. The Quartermaster of the ship, when the parties will not come to any reconciliation, accompanies them on shore with what assistance he thinks proper, and turns the disputants back to back, at so many paces distance; at the word of command, they turn and engage immediately. The victor is declared as whomever reduces the other to a weakened state first. (¼ HP remaining or helpless condition for 3 rounds)
If any person strike another while these articles are in force he shall receive thirty stripes lacking one on their bare back, or a punishment deemed appropriate by the Captain and the majority.
That person that shall snap his Arms, or smoke Tobacco in the Hold, without a Cap to his Pipe, or carry any flame that produce heat, shall suffer the same Punishment as in the former Article.
If any person shall offer to run away, or keep any Secret from the Company, he shall be marooned with one Bottle of Water, and one Knife.
No person is permitted to gamble for money, valuables, provisions, or alcohol aboard ship.
That person that shall not keep his Arms clean, fit for an Engagement, or neglect his Business, shall be cut off from his Share, and suffer such other Punishment as the Captain and the majority of Company shall think fit.
Any person that shall be guilty of Drunkenness in time of Engagement shall suffer what Punishment the Captain and Majority of the Company shall think fit. The requirement of sobriety may be waived in advance by the Captain if such person can demonstrate increased usefulness through the consumption of liquor.No sailor is to bring aboard a husband, wife, child, person of ill virtue, or any passenger unbeknownst to the Captain. Both sailor and passenger face marooning. If at any time you meet with a prudent Woman, that Man that offers to meddle with her, without her Consent, shall suffer present Death.
A standard compensation is provided for maimed and mutilated men of the company. Any crew member who loses a limb in service to the ship shall be entitled to a casting of regenerate. If such a casting is not made available by the time the ship next leaves port, the member is entitled to 910 gp for its loss, and may remain aboard for as long as they think they are fit.
At any time any crew member may call a Vote of No Confidence against the Captain or Quartermaster. If the Majority of the Company agrees the offending person is removed from their position. If the Majority of the Company does not agree the Officer may try them for Mutiny, subject to the vote of the Majority of the Company.Any person who shall offend against any of these articles shall be punished with death, or in such other manner as the ship's Captain and the Majority of the Company shall think proper.
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Being a Good pirate is entirely reasonable. Being a pirate involves stealing stuff, but that's not Evil inherently, and it doesn't necessitate anything Evil per se. Many pirates do stuff that makes them not Good, but it's not a requirement.
To answer your actual questions:
1. Depends on how you do it. I mean, raiding in the 'run around killing people who try and stop you' sense is indeed probably out. Sneaking into port and doing something a bit more subtle might be fine, though.
2. Killing people who are actually guilty of crimes worthy of death is seldom Evil. Breaking your word is Chaotic. Thus a CG character can absolutely kill people under those circumstances. Marooning them is also an excellent alternative for the more squeamish, however.
3. Change your Alignment if you want. Or don't. CG piracy doesn't strike me as much more restrictive or less fun than the CN variety.
CG Piracy isn't more restrictive, however it does require that everyone be on board with the idea if the CG character is going to try and impose their morality on non-Good characters by being the captain in charge. Otherwise you end up in a situation like this one, where the non-Good PC crew is arguing with the Good-captains decisions.
Either that, or it would require the captain to compromise what they think should be done at times in order to keep their crew happy. Because happy pirate crews don't mutiny.
My group had lots of CN in it.
Depending on your class you may be able to persuade the neutral crew to follow your alignment. Pirates are notorious for being superstitious. If your character is a divine class worshiping a good god you could use that to get the crew behind your alignment. A cleric or other divine caster of Cayden Cailean would actually make a decent pirate captain.
Either that, or it would require the captain to compromise what they think should be done at times in order to keep their crew happy. Because happy pirate crews don't mutiny.
That's the overall point. A crew that isn't happy mutinies, or if they're particularly nice they might wait until you reach port and just find another ship to crew. It's not as though the Shackles doesn't have a lot of ships available for able bodied crewman.
Which leads to a narrative problem, in that splitting the party into multiple groups for an extended duration is bad.
The best thing would have been for everyone to be on-board with the same idea of "piracy" and now it may be a bit to let to do that. Unless you're character is willing to have "a descent into evil" (or at least a descent out of good).
CG Piracy isn't more restrictive, however it does require that everyone be on board with the idea if the CG character is going to try and impose their morality on non-Good characters by being the captain in charge. Otherwise you end up in a situation like this one, where the non-Good PC crew is arguing with the Good-captains decisions.
Either that, or it would require the captain to compromise what they think should be done at times in order to keep their crew happy. Because happy pirate crews don't mutiny.
Never would have thought about the whole sneaking in and raiding. Thank you for your time and input. I think that I will keep up the CG fight.
-Never give up Never Surrender!