Elemental Ascetic armor question. PFS

[benaji]

I want to take Elemental Ascetic for the free action blast damage for my natural attacks. I do not want FOB and obviously that wouldnt work with aromor but need to know if the form infusion can be used while in armor.

"At 1st level, an elemental ascetic gains Improved Unarmed Strike as a bonus feat. He gains the kinetic fist form infusion and it costs 0 points of burn instead of 1 point of burn. "

"Like a monk, he can use this ability only when unarmored, not using a shield, and unencumbered."

The second doesn't sound like it applies to the first but I'd like a PFS reading.

[James Risner]

Im not following your question.

here are the rules

It's like FOB, are you asking if it can be done with armor?

[benaji]

James Risner wrote:

Im not following your question.

here are the rules

It's like FOB, are you asking if it can be done with armor?

I'm asking if this:

Like a monk, he can use this ability only when unarmored, not using a shield, and unencumbered.

Applies to this:
At 1st level, an elemental ascetic gains Improved Unarmed Strike as a bonus feat. He gains the kinetic fist form infusion and it costs 0 points of burn instead of 1 point of burn.

It's says "like a monk" but a monk keeps ius with armor and and doesn't have a blast.

I don't care about FOB

[Chess Pwn]

FOB only cares about the armor, nothing else about the ability does. you have a 0 cost kinetic fist.

[James Risner]

The name of the ability is Elemental Flurry. It's a Flurry of Blows. All the restrictions of FoB come along. We have a prime example by the Flurry of Maneuvers ability that was argued didn't carry the FoB restrictions.

So if you want to use the fist, you need to make a FoB with Elemental Flurry ability.

[Menacing Shade of mauve]

Armor restriction only applies to FOB.

[James Risner]

I'm not sure how you use a weapon that is used with a full attack as a flurry of blows any other way?

[benaji]

James Risner wrote:

I'm not sure how you use a weapon that is used with a full attack as a flurry of blows any other way?

Kinetic fist is a none action attack. You can add it to any unarmed strike.

"You can use this form infusion as part of an attack action, a charge action, or a full-attack action to add damage to each of your natural attacks and unarmed strikes until the beginning of your next turn"

[Menacing Shade of mauve]

James Risner wrote:

The name of the ability is Elemental Flurry. It's a Flurry of Blows. All the restrictions of FoB come along. We have a prime example by the Flurry of Maneuvers ability that was argued didn't carry the FoB restrictions.

So if you want to use the fist, you need to make a FoB with Elemental Flurry ability.

James please. Replace =/= Modify. An ability that replaces another inherits nothing from the replaced ability.

Flurry of Maneuvers was never armor-restricted until it was errataed. We could all see that the ability to use it in armor was almost certainly unintentional, but the rules unambiguously allowed it.

James Risner wrote:

The name of the ability is Elemental Flurry. It's a Flurry of Blows.

It is:

*Bonus IUS.
*Kinetic Fist infusion at 0 burn.
*The option to make a flurry of blow given certain conditions are met. Which affirms that the conditions can be met without making a flurry of blows.
*Limitations to flurry of blows: "like a monk...this ability" must necessarily refer to an ability that a Monk would have, which is the FOB, not the Kinetic Fist.
*Restrictions on Kinetic Blast
*Notes that this is an altered Kinetic Blast and also replaces Elemental Overflow.

[James Risner]

Menacing Shade of mauve wrote:

Flurry of Maneuvers was never armor-restricted until it was errataed.

James Risner wrote:

The name of the ability is Elemental Flurry. It's a Flurry of Blows.

I played a Flurry of Maneuver Monk to 11th level and I can't count the times a GM said "That is flurry, how are you wearing Full Plate". At the time the forums and I were both confident it wasn't Flurry of Blows and didn't have to deal with the restrictions.

I learned from that, they tend to write things and if they become an issue they will FAQ or Errata them.

I believe if you build a character around Elemental Flurry, you will be unhappy the day you need to rebuild your 11th level character because you ignore those saying "it is restricted by armor because it is flurry."

I can't prove it is Flurry of Blows restricted. I just believe it is and wouldn't build a character without assuming in the build it is Flurry of Blows.

[Menacing Shade of mauve]

Whoever wrote the archetype probably used formatting, which was then edited out to save space. Just put in the obvious paragraph breaks back in, and the ability becomes clear.

Like this:

Elemental Flurry (Su): At 1st level, an elemental ascetic gains Improved Unarmed Strike as a bonus feat. He gains the kinetic fist form infusion and it costs 0 points of burn instead of 1 point of burn.

When using the kinetic fist form infusion with a full attack, he can make a flurry of blows as the monk class feature. He must use only his fists to make this flurry, no matter what other abilities he possesses. Like a monk, he can use this ability only when unarmored, not using a shield, and unencumbered.

He can’t use his kinetic blast without a form infusion, nor can he ever use his kinetic blast with the chain, extended range, extreme range, foe throw, flurry of blasts, many throw, or snake form infusions, or with any other form infusion that requires a ranged attack roll or ranged touch attack roll.

This ability alters kinetic blast and replaces elemental overflow.

[Mark Seifter]

James Risner wrote:

I'm not sure how you use a weapon that is used with a full attack as a flurry of blows any other way?

I think the OP doesn't care about using the flurry of blows and just wants the free 1d6 extra damage and the option of 1 burn (or gather) to add a substance infusion. I agree with menacing shades of mauve that I would let those aspects work in armor; the flurry part, like a monk, goes away.

[James Risner]

Mark Seifter wrote:

James Risner wrote:

I'm not sure how you use a weapon that is used with a full attack as a flurry of blows any other way?

I think the OP doesn't care about using the flurry of blows and just wants the free 1d6 extra damage and the option of 1 burn (or gather) to add a substance infusion. I agree with menacing shades of mauve that I would let those aspects work in armor; the flurry part, like a monk, goes away.

+1

Thumbs up, good enough for me!