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I've always been fond of martial arts, and that's why in RPGs I've been known to play monk-type characters more than once. One of my favorite martial arts is the Brazilian art of Capoeria (YouTube a Capoeria player if you haven't seen one before, it's awesome.)
Now, I was trying to figure out how to build one in PFS, and I couldn't really come up with much, so I was hoping someone could provide some ideas?
Of course, I know I could just play a monk with acrobatics and 'say' that he kicks people a lot, but I was wondering if there were some styles, archetypes, or feats out there that could make it more than just me 'saying' stuff at the table.
Options I know of:
1) Monk: something I'm not too up on, as Pathfinder monks tend to be much more 'shaolin' types. All meditative and mystic and stuff.
2) Unchained monk. A little better, all the 'style strike' abilities they get like flying kick and roundhouse kick could be Capoeria-ey.
3)Brawler: so the reduction in mysticism appeals to me, but I'm not super fond of the idea of relying on armor.
Any thoughts?
I would do brawler or unchained..pick up combat reflexes, dirty fighting, improved trip, greater trip and vicious stomp...to me that is capoeria (trip them with your feet...get a attack of opp and when they fall prone get a attack of opp)
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I would do brawler or unchained..pick up combat reflexes, dirty fighting, improved trip, greater trip and vicious stomp...to me that is capoeria (trip them with your feet...get a attack of opp and when they fall prone get a attack of opp)
So it would look something like:
Human BrawlerStr:16
Dex: 16
Con: 14
Int: 10
Wis: 12
Chr: 8
Level 1: improved trip, combat expertise (qualify through brawler's cunning)
Level 2: combat reflexes
Level 3: vicious stomp (Maneuver training-trip)
Level 4:
Level 5: power attack, monkey style (mainly for the 'stand up as a swift action')
Level 6:
Level 7: toughness?
Level 8: treater trip
Get myself a mithral +X brawling chain shirt, amulet of the mighty fist, and eventually a +2 str/dex belt.
I just thought I'd put it out there that capoeira was invented by slaves. The whole premise of the "dancing" martial art was to disguise martial training from their captives. That's something you might want to add in to your backstory.
Also there's Perform: Dance and probably Bluff in there.
I've had some friends who got really into capoeira, and a lot of the stories they told of the "masters" were not just of someone beating their opponent in a fight, but humiliating them. And I mean literally dropping the opponents' pants and making them look like a fool rather than actually engaging in a fist (or foot) fight.
Something like the Dirty Trick maneuver might be the way to go.
It sounds like a fun character to build/play, so keep us posted
Dirty fighting might still be better than combat expertise...depends on your style...ac might help but dirty fighting allows you to get +4 to trip while flanking...oh forgot lunge might be nice too. Tiger style, Iron will, Fury's fall and pummeling style are all pretty nice. pick out some nice feats for martial flexibility...maybe branch into some other tactic too perhaps disarm...
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I just thought I'd put it out there that capoeira was invented by slaves. The whole premise of the "dancing" martial art was to disguise martial training from their captives. That's something you might want to add in to your backstory.
Also there's Perform: Dance and probably Bluff in there.I've had some friends who got really into capoeira, and a lot of the stories they told of the "masters" were not just of someone beating their opponent in a fight, but humiliating them. And I mean literally dropping the opponents' pants and making them look like a fool rather than actually engaging in a fist (or foot) fight.
Something like the Dirty Trick maneuver might be the way to go.It sounds like a fun character to build/play, so keep us posted
I actually knew about the slave bit.
I'm still forming the backstory, but I had the idea that he (or she) was a former Mwangi Slave. The story would be that his/her tribe was taken as slaves by Chelliax long ago, and when they pulled out (due to their empire shrinking) the Aspis stepped in and kept things right on going. Her tribe invented (pathfinder version of capoeria) and eventually managed a minor slave revolt. She found another pathfinder who took her in, and now she's out to free slavery (obviously, liberty's edge faction.)
If I go the dirty trick route, I don't think I'll have enough feats for the tripping route, which seems the way to go (one of the capoeria moves, I don't know the name but it's the one where they jump into the air and land on an opponent with both feet) looks a hell of a lot like vicious stomp to me.
Hmmmm, dirty trick build though . . .
What you could do is always pick up some slack from martial flexibility...for example worry about conditional feats until you need them or fill up chains a little bit...toughness and monkey style might need to be put in the back burner..power attack...is debatable..I'm the type who would rather keep it though... so now you would have room for improved dirty trick and maybe greater...pick up superior when you can or use MF when you really think you will need it..honestly superior would be better for MF so you can choose what you need when you need it. Reason i mention losing toughness and monkey style is that how often would you really need to get up from prone and if they are on the ground how often will you get hit? I still like the idea of lunge but still (he probably might want to keep a dagger or something as a back up weapon just in case)
Janni Style was made for this, basically.
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I've had some friends who got really into capoeira, and a lot of the stories they told of the "masters" were not just of someone beating their opponent in a fight, but humiliating them. And I mean literally dropping the opponents' pants and making them look like a fool rather than actually engaging in a fist (or foot) fight.
I saw that happen once.
It was at a big gathering of Capoeristas in Golden Gate Park. There were people from all over the place coming together to play and train. A guy, who was quite skilled, was being kind of a jerk in the circle. Basically he'd push the movement tempo, do things to deliberately trip people up, and wouldn't leave the circle after he'd played for a while. He wasn't hurting anyone, but he was being an obvious jerk to people less skilled than he was.
The Mestre who joined the circle was a skinny, dark skinned guy who looked like he was about 60, had one of the biggest grins I've ever seen, and was clearly drunk.
He joined the circle with Jerkface and started to move with him, and somehow managed to essentially stay behind him most of the time. Then he started reaching out and tapping Jerkface on the back of the head whenever he had the chance. It didn't really look like he was trying to. It's just the the opportunity just kept coming up.
So Jerkface pushed the tempo, and the Mestre kept up. Eventually they were both moving way faster than the music, and Mestre was playing the back of Jerkface's head like a bongo.
Finally jerk face just stopped dancing altogether and walked out of the circle looking like he was about to fall over from exhaustion.
I've never seen someone beaten at their own game so hard in my life, or deserved it so much.
/threadjack
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Janni style, flavor wise, looks like exactly what I need. Plus Janni Tempest nets you a +4 bonus to trip attempts if you have hit the opponent before, which means:
Flurry: Hit->Trip->Itteratives (all with +4 to hit from prone)
Janni Rush is much less useful (essentially lets you vital strike on a charge, but only on a charge) and I'm not fond of it.
Capoeria Character Concept
Female Human Brawler
Str: 16
Dex: 16
Con: 14
Int: 10
Wis: 12
Chr: 8
Level 1: Improved trip, Dirty Fighting and/or Combat Expertise
Level 2: Combat reflexes
Level 3: Vicious stomp (Maneuver training-trip)
Level 4:
Level 5: Weapon Focus (unarmed), Janni style
Level 6:
Level 7: Janni Tempest
Level 8: Greater trip
Level 9: Weapon Spec (unarmed)
Level 11: Toughness? Power Attack?
Gear and stats by level 7:
+2 cloak of resist
Amulet of the mighty fists +1
+1 brawling darkleaf lamallar leather armor
+2 Belt of Str/Dex
Dusty Rose Ioun Stone stocketed into wayfinder
+1 Ring of deflection
To hit: +16/+11 (+14/+14/+9 Flurry) d8+7
AC: 21 (wow that's low)
CMB to trip: +20 (+24 if I hit first!), CMD: 27 (31 vs. trip)
Hmmm, seems to be that the big gap is armor and per-hit damage. Even if I get to hit five times on a trip. I suppose I could flexibility weapon specialization and greater trip until I hit the levels to pick them up.
As someone else said, if I go up against creatures I can't trip (Huge sized, or slimes or oozes) I basically just have to rely on brawler's flurry to do d8+7 damage per hit.
Any suggestions?
Armor will probably be low, but dont forget that a opponent on the ground will provoke if standing up, is -4 to hit you lying down and you are +4 to hit him. Personally I'm not a big fan of Janni dirty trick I think might offer more. Power attack might help a bit too(+12/+12/7 flurry) but now 1D8+11...with dirty fighting you can give up flanking to get +4 for maneuvers checks. Dirty tricks can also offer some options when tripping isn't enough. A couple potions of enlarge can help with the huge issue...dirty trick should work on them... for slime and such...eh how often do you really run into them? It will suck but just saying. Maybe a oil of shield or a wand if you can get someone willing to cast it on you (to gain +4 AC)
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I'd go with an unchained monk instead of brawler. Flying kick and spin kick are both very thematic, as is leg sweep. Ki doesn't have to be mystical if you don't RP that way. Just pick more subtle ki powers.
Another option is to be an unarmed swashbuckler. Snake Style, Boar Style, or hamatulatsu can give you piercing unarmed strikes, and several deeds have a capoeira feel.
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I'd go with an unchained monk instead of brawler. Flying kick and spin kick are both very thematic, as is leg sweep. Ki doesn't have to be mystical if you don't RP that way. Just pick more subtle ki powers.
Another option is to be an unarmed swashbuckler. Snake Style, Boar Style, or hamatulatsu can give you piercing unarmed strikes, and several deeds have a capoeira feel.
I thought about that, even tried to work up a build, but there are a few issues:
1) Based on the build I'm going for, they are super MAD
2) They don't provide enough feats for the build I'm going for
3)I feel like a typical Capoeria player is more chaotic than the lawfully-oriented Monks.