Could I take spell perfection as 17th level sorcerer and pick to use it with summon monster IX?
I will learn (and cast) that spell on 18th level.
Or should I choose other spell and then retrain it?
I would say no because it is not (yet) a spell that you have the ability to cast. Moreover, I'd rule that what you have to retrain is the feat not just the spell (I.e. It will cost 5 pp, not 2).
Furthermore, I would read Spell Perfection's limit that "the total modified level of the spell does not use a spell slot above 9th level" means that it's useless for a level 9 spell like Summon Monster 9. I suppose you could argue that spell perfection doesn't modify the spell slot level so it doesn't apply, but in that case the language in the feat doesn't appear to mean anything at all.
Benefit: Pick one spell which you have the ability to cast. Whenever you cast that spell you may apply any one metamagic feat you have to that spell without affecting its level or casting time, as long as the total modified level of the spell does not use a spell slot above 9th level. In addition, if you have other feats which allow you to apply a set numerical bonus to any aspect of this spell (such as Spell Focus, Spell Penetration, Weapon Focus [ray], and so on), double the bonus granted by that feat when applied to this spell.
If you can't cast it, you can't pick it. You will have to choose another spell and retrain later.
As Jeraa quoted, the answer is a definite no.
Also, you cannot put any metamagic feats on a 9th level spell that increase the spell level (merciful metamagic and other +0 ones are fine).
Also, you cannot put any metamagic feats on a 9th level spell that increase the spell level (merciful metamagic and other +0 ones are fine).
This is not completely accurate.
Why do you think greater metamagic rods exist? A greater rod of quicken spell would raise the spell level of any spell cast with it above 9th level.
Spell perfection allows you to add a metamagic without increasing the spell slot cost, but has a specific restriction about raising the effective level over level 9. So it is not useful to use Spell Perfection in conjunction with 9th level spells.
But you statement was so broad that I wanted to make sure you understood that there is no general rule that no 9th level spell can have metamagic applied, it's just only possible (to my knowledge) using Greater Rods of metamagic.
I said metamagic feats, not metamagic. Rods are not feats.
I am looking forward for getting twice bonuses for augment and superior summoning. I know I cannot use any (except merciful) metamagic feat.
So I will retrain whole feat.
Thank you guys.
Rules wise I agree with the consensus above.
That being said, in my games I wouldn't have an issue with allowing you to take the feat and not choose a spell for it until the next level, so you might check and see how flexible your GM is.
I said metamagic feats, not metamagic. Rods are not feats.
Yes, but rods reference the feat for how the function in the general metamagic rod description and each specific rod's description. I didn't want anyone to accidentally infer from your statement that you couldn't use a Greater Rod of Quicken on a 9th level spell.
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I said metamagic feats, not metamagic. Rods are not feats.Yes, but rods reference the feat for how the function in the general metamagic rod description and each specific rod's description. I didn't want anyone to accidentally infer from your statement that you couldn't use a Greater Rod of Quicken on a 9th level spell.
That's actually a very good point Claxon. Sometimes I forget that I'm not always talking to experts on the game and not everybody will make that distinction. It seems obvious to me, but I asked my roommate about it and he gave me a look that said "Only a nerd would know that".
Thanks for the clarification!
I said metamagic feats, not metamagic. Rods are not feats.Yes, but rods reference the feat for how the function in the general metamagic rod description and each specific rod's description. I didn't want anyone to accidentally infer from your statement that you couldn't use a Greater Rod of Quicken on a 9th level spell.That's actually a very good point Claxon. Sometimes I forget that I'm not always talking to experts on the game and not everybody will make that distinction. It seems obvious to me, but I asked my roommate about it and he gave me a look that said "Only a nerd would know that".
Thanks for the clarification!
Yeah, I spend a lot of time in the advice and rules forums and consider myself to be fairly well versed in the rules (although expertise is difficult because there are so many rules) but sometime I try to pull back and think about things as though I wasn't so well versed and how it could be interpreted by others.
Glad to help you see things from a different perspective.
