So, I've just been getting back into Pathfinder by way of PFS, and my first character in years is a Swashbuckler, a class which oozes cool and seems on spec to be mechanically capable.
But I find myself with a million ideas of how to take it, pulled in a lot of directions, and I feel as though I am doing it very wrong somehow. He's just acquired enough XP to hit level 2, and as soon as I next sit down at a table with him, my ability to change things goes away, so... Is this horrible? If yes, how can I fix it, and if no, what are some good ways to proceed from here?
Traits:
Irrepressible (Cha instead of Wis for Will vs. Charm and Compulsion)
Fencer (+1 to Attacks of Opportunity with daggers/swords/etc.)
Feats:
Weapon Finesse (Rapier) - Class
Weapon Focus (Rapier) - Class
Fencing Grace - Level 1
Combat Reflexes - Human
I've gone back and forth with stats 6 or 7 times now - Do I suck it up with a 10 Str and walk a tight-rope with Encumberence while giving up on the notion of Power Attack, do I split Int/Cha as 14's or go 16 Cha for the extra bonuses to class features, do I multiclass, do I run away from Inspired Blade (which I took for the cool factor, in addition to +1 Panache and a free feat I very much wanted...)
Yeah, you could say I have some problems with indecision.
Honestly, Cha 16 isn't really necessary. Drop it down to 14, and you can afford to bring your Wis to 8, Int to 12, and Str to 13, so your Will Save goes up, you get more Skills, your carrying capacity goes up, and you can even afford to get Power Attack if you want. If you're really in love with such a high Cha, drop it to a 15 and bump you Into to 12 and Str to 13, and put your 4th level Ability Score point into Cha.
It's also important to know where you fit in your group. Are you planning to fill any holes in combat/skills/socializing? What roles are you trying to fill?
The 7 wisdom is crippling. No only will you have terrible will saves, you also will have a horrible perception, which is the most important skill in the game. You need to have at minimum at 10 there. You can lower CHA to compensate.
Honestly, Cha 16 isn't really necessary. Drop it down to 14, and you can afford to bring your Wis to 8, Int to 12, and Str to 13, so your Will Save goes up, you get more Skills, your carrying capacity goes up, and you can even afford to get Power Attack if you want. If you're really in love with such a high Cha, drop it to a 15 and bump you Into to 12 and Str to 13, and put your 4th level Ability Score point into Cha.
It's also important to know where you fit in your group. Are you planning to fill any holes in combat/skills/socializing? What roles are you trying to fill?
Apart from additional Panache/Class Features, the Cha was meant to allow me to play Face (heavily into Diplomacy and such.) However, I don't think a 14 over a 16 is going to hurt that part all that much. The 1 smaller Panache pool is the concern there, but that may be mitigated by things like a Plume of Panache, or obviously by ticking Int up to 12.
My general plan as it stood was to put the level 4 stat in Str to allow for Power Attack.
The general consensus then seems to be more Wis is needed - do people think it's worthwhile to drop to a pool of 3 Panache and go to 13 Str, 10 Int, 10 Wis, 14 Cha? Or 11 Str, 12 Int, 10 Wis, 14 Cha (and sidestep the Power Attack concept?)
Edit: Tricky thing with PFS is that it can be hard to nail down a role, as what shows up to a mission may vary wildly from one game to the next.
Power Attack isn't quite as good with a one-handed weapon. You should be doing fine with damage with Fencing Grace. Don't worry about how small your Panache Pool is, just take Extra Panache at level 3. Of those 2 spreads, go Str 11, Int 12, Wis 10, Cha 14.
Give up the notion of power attack. You're a Dex based, one-handed, finesse weapon class. Focus of nabbing Fencing Grace instead, and working on your ability to crit as with an Inspired Blade crits are the only way you can regain panache. Also some Swashes get a lot of mileage out of the Parry and Riposte Deed, which required more attacks of opportunity, so it's something to look into.
But I do agree with Imbicatus that the low Will might cause problems. Swashes don't have great Will anyway, so it leaves you vulnerable, even with Charmed Life. You mitigated the chance you'd kill your friends with the Cha to will talent, but you are still taking the risk that you're going to spend a lot of time sleeping/blinded/confused/scared/etc. If you are willing to take the risk then that's fine, but if you want to avoid it you may need to get that will up somehow.
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If you don't mind grabbing another book, Piranha Strike may work better for your build than Power Attack. It also means you don't need a 13 strength, although the carrying capacity is nice.
I agree that Wisdom of less than 10 is a very bad idea. The Con is a little low for a front liner as well.
Power Attack isn't quite as good with a one-handed weapon. You should be doing fine with damage with Fencing Grace. Don't worry about how small your Panache Pool is, just take Extra Panache at level 3. Of those 2 spreads, go Str 11, Int 12, Wis 10, Cha 14.
Fair point on Power Attack, it is a lot less efficient for a one-hand, especially giving up as much as would be required to get it. Str 11 should be enough to keep me from having to walk on egg shells to balance weight for the moment.
'Sani wrote:
You mitigated the chance you'd kill your friends with the Cha to will talent, but you are still taking the risk that you're going to spend a lot of time sleeping/blinded/confused/scared/etc. If you are willing to take the risk then that's fine, but if you want to avoid it you may need to get that will up somehow.
Well, fortunately Sleep and Confusion are Compulsion effects, but the point is well-taken. Iron Will may be a worthwhile investment, perhaps? Or...
'Imbicatus wrote:
If you plan on keep CHA up, Steadfast Personality will help with the will save, even though it locks you out of using charmed life on will saves.
That's also another route that could work out, the only reason I wasn't looking at it before is that it's relatively meaningless with a Wis penalty. It would also free up the trait slot from Irrepressible (which creates a whole indecision tree unto itself, but that's another matter.)
If you don't mind grabbing another book, Piranha Strike may work better for your build than Power Attack. It also means you don't need a 13 strength, although the carrying capacity is nice.
I agree that Wisdom of less than 10 is a very bad idea. The Con is a little low for a front liner as well.
Drop the Charisma a little bit, invest in Wisdom.
Sadly, Piranha Strike only works with light weapons which the Rapier, paradoxically, is not. That was what I was planning to go for when I first devised this build, then I noticed it was impossible, which set off this crazy chain of reworks over the past week.
You still get an extra panache point even if you have INT 7, with inspired blade.
Putting it to 12 will get you an extra skill point and extra +1 on INT skill checks, nothing more to panache though.
This is true, which would feed a few more skill ranks to the face role, but with that in mind, would it be more worth-while to go Int 10 and Wis 12? Or possibly play the musical carrying capacity game and go with Str, Int, and Wis 10 to sneak in a Con 14?
If you don't mind grabbing another book, Piranha Strike may work better for your build than Power Attack. It also means you don't need a 13 strength, although the carrying capacity is nice.
I agree that Wisdom of less than 10 is a very bad idea. The Con is a little low for a front liner as well.
Drop the Charisma a little bit, invest in Wisdom.
Piranha Strike only works with light weapons. The rapier is a one handed martial weapon, not a light weapon so that does not work. If he is going for piranha strike than the kukri is the weapon to use, but you need slashing grace instead of fencing grace.
Is there a particular reason that you want to use the Inspired Blade Archetype? With a 10 int, you are giving up more panache recharge opportunities for no benefit.
Remember Piranha strike does not work with a Rapier. (It is not a light weapon)
A 7 wisdom is crippling to your already low will save, and you'll burn through Charmed Life brutally quick.
It's more of a boring statblock, but you might want the following:
10/18/12/8/10/16 or 13/18/12/8/10/14 if you want the power attack.
You can use the Human Favored Class Bonus to get that extra panache (or feat for extra panache), and the human skill point will make up for the lost Int.
Is there a particular reason that you want to use the Inspired Blade Archetype? With a 10 int, you are giving up more panache recharge opportunities for no benefit.
The flavor (fits the rogueish thing I have going nicely), the extra point in the pool, and the free feat that was a stepping stone to Fencing Grace mostly.
Might want to think about 10/(18)/10/14/10/14 as well then. Buy potions/wand/pearl of power 2nd level for an emergency hit point bump from Bear's Endurance.
Or 13/(16)/12/14/10/14 for Power Attack availability.
STR 12 / DEX (18) / CON 14 / INT 7 / WIS 12 / CHA 14
You are within one point of gaining power attack, allowing you to take it at mid level if desired either by putting a level up point to it or by getting a belt. Human is giving you a bonus skill point to make up for the skill loss by dumping int, and you are still getting one extra panache from inspired blade. You can have fencing grace at first level.
STR 12 / DEX (18) / CON 14 / INT 7 / WIS 12 / CHA 14
You are within one point of gaining power attack, allowing you to take it at mid level if desired either by putting a level up point to it or by getting a belt. Human is giving you a bonus skill point to make up for the skill loss by dumping int, and you are still getting one extra panache from inspired blade. You can have fencing grace at first level.
That's not a bad idea, but I think I'd rather have 2 more skill points/level than earlier access to Power Attack early on. If I get a +2 belt of Dex/Str later I can still pick up Power Attack using the 8th level stat point.
What I'm looking at right now is probably:
Str 10 / Dex 18 / Con 13 / Int 10 / Wis 12 / Cha 14
This allows me to take Con at 4, keeps my Skill progression robust, gives me a positive Will save, as well as no negatives to Knowledge: Local (which is a surprisingly useful skill in PFS scenarios.)
So, quick thought - with my current Panache pool dropped from 4 to 3, is it worthwhile to swap Combat Reflexes out for something else, as my current Panache really can't support more than one Parry per turn anyway? (It honestly couldn't support it before either, but there were theoretical situations in which it might be necessary.)
