FAQ: Unchained Rogue Finesse Training + Two-Weapon Rend

[Secret Wizard]

Does Finesse Training allow an UnRogue to deal 1.5x DEX on the rend attack?

[DinosaursOnIce]

Well there is this:
Unchained FAQ

Though I suppose Two-Weapon Rend is a little different and doesn't strictly fit under any of the answers. So...

FAQ'ed!

[Chess Pwn]

They said no, it uses str still.

[graywulfe]

Chess Pwn wrote:

They said no, it uses str still.

Links or it didn't happen... :P

[Claxon]

Chess Pwn wrote:

They said no, it uses str still.

So what TWF feats are actually worth taking as a rogue?

Two Weapon Fighting
Improved Two Weapon Fighting
Maybe Greater Two Weapon Fighting

Double Slice doesn't work for Dex
Two Weapon rend doesn't work for Dex

Well, at least the rogue doesn't need to waste his feats on such a large feat tree anymore.

[Imbicatus]

Two Weapon Feint. This is why you go TWF on a Unchained Rogue.

[Claxon]

Sorry, I did forget about that.

Two Weapon Feint leading into Improved Two Weapon Feint

Though technically Improved Two Weapon Feint still doesn't actually require Two Weapon Feint, lol.

Edit: Never mind, they did in fact errata that.

So TWF rogue build would be:
Two Weapon Fighting
Improved Two Weapon Fighting
Two Weapon Feint
Improved Two Weapon Feint

[Secret Wizard]

TwFeint is a trap IMHO. I'd rather Circling Mongoose since it works against non humanoid creatures.

You go TWF on a Rogue because of your high static damage and more chances to land a Debilitating Injury.

[Secret Wizard]

Chess Pwn wrote:

They said no, it uses str still.

Not quite.

The FAQ only applies to modifying what's added to a roll.

A Rend is technically another hit with the same Weapon.

[Chess Pwn]

Rend isn't a hit, it's extra damage.

[Secret Wizard]

It's not just +damage, it's weapon damage roll+damage. That enters the reign of Finesse Training. It's ambiguous enough to merit an FAQ.

[Claxon]

Circling Mongoose isn't bad, but is a rather long feat chain.

[Imbicatus]

It also doesn't scale that much better than Feint. Yes some creatures creatures are outright immune, and a lot of them have a hefty penalty. But the ones that are immune to feint usually have next to impossible CMDs for tumbling anyway.

[Secret Wizard]

I'd rather not get in a discussion about Circling Mongoose on this thread.

But let me just say that because a delicious sandwich needs effort to be made doesn't mean it's not delicious.

[Imbicatus]

It's a cool trick no doubt. But it's more investment than feint, and it has another segment of monster population it can't be used on. Not to mention it falls into the special full round action, not an attack or full attack rules quagmire.