impact on amulett of mighty fists for unarmed strike

[Baumfluch]

hi all,

this one is about the Impact weapon ability:

Ultimate Eq. wrote:

Impact

Price +2 bonus; Aura moderate transmutation; CL 9th; Weight —

This special ability can only be placed on melee weapons that are not light weapons. An impact weapon delivers a potent kinetic jolt when it strikes, dealing damage as if the weapon were one size category larger. In addition, any bull rush combat maneuver the wielder attempts while wielding the weapon gains a bonus equal to the weapon's enhancement bonus; this includes all bull rush attempts, not only those in which a weapon is used, such as Bull Rush Strike, Shield Slam, or Unseat.

i wonder if i can put it on Amulett of mighty fists and use it with Monks unarmed strikes.

i can put any special weapon ability on the Amulett, that "can be applied to unarmed attacks"

unarmed strike says:

CRB wrote:

Unarmed strikes count as light weapons (for purposes of two-weapon attack penalties and so on).

the Addition makes me wonder if im allowed to make them "impacting" with the Amulett or if they are considered light weapons also for purposes of enhancements.

thx

[Trekkie90909]

nope, they're light weapons.

[lemeres]

I do believe that the impact property counts under "and so on".

They are light. No impact. Just get someone to cast lead blades if you want increased damage dice that badly. Or strong jaw. Which ever.

[ElMustacho]

Or growing.

[Vuliperre Reignhart]

Natural attacks are light attacks, so impact doesn't work on them.

Why would you want to get impact/leadblade/whatever on a natural attack anyway? For all the best natural attack builds, that's just making the difference between 1d3+15ish damage and 1d4+15ish damage!

[alexd1976]

Vuliperre Reignhart wrote:

Natural attacks are light attacks, so impact doesn't work on them.

Why would you want to get impact/leadblade/whatever on a natural attack anyway? For all the best natural attack builds, that's just making the difference between 1d3+15ish damage and 1d4+15ish damage!

Monks, Warpriests and Brawlers... Higher base damage.

[lemeres]

alexd1976 wrote:

Vuliperre Reignhart wrote:

Natural attacks are light attacks, so impact doesn't work on them.

Why would you want to get impact/leadblade/whatever on a natural attack anyway? For all the best natural attack builds, that's just making the difference between 1d3+15ish damage and 1d4+15ish damage!

Monks, Warpriests and Brawlers... Higher base damage.

Also druids, and anyone that can turn into large animals/monsters with a lot of natural attacks, as well as eidolons. A lot of them have attacks with damage dice 1d8 or above. They would get a nice boost to their DPR from that.

[Imbicatus]

Unfortunately, not legal. Strong Jaw is better anyway, with a two-size bump.

[Gisher]

From the wording of the Esoteric Magus' Arcane Pool ability (and the entire design of the class), I think it might be intended to be an exception to the restriction on using Impact with unarmed strikes.

Occult Adventures wrote:

At 5th level, he can use these bonuses to add any of the following weapon special abilities to his weapons or unarmed strikes: defending, flaming, flaming burst, frost, icy burst, impact, shock, shocking burst, speed, or thundering.

I'm not clear on that, though.

[Imbicatus]

Specific trumps General. The Esoteric Magus can use their arcane pool to add impact to unarmed strikes, because it explicitly says it can. You cannot add impact to an amulet of mighty fists, because the general rule says no light weapons, and the amulet doesn't have an exception.

[Lilith Knight]

That's a specifically called out exception. Though i'm not sure why you'd apply it when you can SET YOUR FIST ON FIRE. I know fire is the most protected against damage type but fiery hands is just such a classic.

[Gisher]

Imbicatus wrote:

Specific trumps General. The Esoteric Magus can use their arcane pool to add impact to unarmed strikes, because it explicitly says it can. You cannot add impact to an amulet of mighty fists, because the general rule says no light weapons, and the amulet doesn't have an exception.

Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that the a Esoteric's ability would have any bearing on the Amulet issue. I should have made that clear. I thought that issue was pretty well settled.

But do you think this is actually an exception? It says he can add Impact to "his weapons or unarmed strikes." With this phrase grouping those categories together, it seems to me that the same rules would have apply to both weapons and unarmed strikes. So I see two possible scenarios.

(1) The Esoteric Magus can't apply Impact to any light weapons.
Arcane Pool allows a standard magus to apply the Keen special ability to his weapons, but he is still restricted to slashing or piercing weapons. In the same way, an Esoteric Magus has the ability to apply Impact to his weapons, but not to light weapons. So he could add Impact to a spear, but not a dagger or his unarmed strikes.

Ordinarily I would read it that way, but given the huge focus on unarmed strikes for this class it seems odd that the designers deliberately added an ability to A.P. that can't be used with unarmed strikes.

(2) The Esoteric Magus can apply Impact to any weapons.
The Esoteric Magus is a specialist in close-quarters combat and can apply Impact even to his light weapons and unarmed strikes.

This fits the image that I have for the class, but I'm reluctant to make such an interpretation without wording that clearly makes Impact an exception to the way A.P. applies to Keen, Vorpal, etc.