Unchained Elven Reach Rogue

[Joe M.]

Ahoy, fellow Pathfinders!

Looking for feedback on a new character I'm starting to draft, one centered around a few newish rules elements that have recently caught my eye. I may want to play this guy in PFS, so let's stick to PFS rules and plan to level 11.

1. <Elven Branched Spear>, Melee Tactics Toolbox

2. <Unchained Rogue>, Pathfinder Unchained

3. <Phalanx Formation>, Melee Tactics Toolbox

The Elven Branched Spear is *great*! A finesseable reach weapon? Yes please! The +2 on AOOs provoked by movement through threatened squares is just gravy. Combine that with Unchained Rogue's Dex-to-damage and you've got an interesting reach melee rogue.

Elf, dipping one level in <Vanguard Slayer> for martial weapon proficiency and a few other nice things. Lvl 1 Rogue, Lvl 2 Slayer, everything else Rogue.

Figure I'll go with something like this for the stats: Str 12 Dex 19 Con 13 Int 12 Wis 12 Cha 07

I haven't given much thought to the feat or talent build out yet. Figure I need to grab Combat Reflexes, Phalanx Formation, Power Attack, Weapon Focus (perhaps via Weapon Training talent) ... But haven't done any more planning than that.

Suggestions welcome! I'll come back and update as I work, but it'll be pretty slow over the next few days.

01 [b] Weapon Finesse, [f] Combat Reflexes
03 [f] ..., [rt] ...
04 [ft] Elven Branched Spear
05 [f] ..., [rt] ...
06 [re] ...
07 [f] ..., [rt] ...
09 [f] ..., [rt] ...
11 [re] ..., [f] ..., [rt] ...

[graystone]

If you take 1/2 elf instead of elf, you can take the Ancestral Arms racial trait and get the feat for proficiency in the Elven Branched Spear at 1st.

[Joe M.]

True, thanks. Or I could always go Human and drop the feat on EWP. In either case I could skip the Slayer level. Here's what I get out of 1 level in Slayer:

+1 BAB
+2 Fort/Ref
Martial weapons (which gives the Spear)
Medium armor
+1 Init (via Vanguard)
Studied target +1 (move, or imm w/sneak attack)

Is it worth it? Elf+Slayer actually seems like a pretty good choice here. What are the advantages to Human or Half-elf in the trade-out?

[LoneKnave]

How about a level or two of Urban barbarian instead? While Slayer is pretty nice, with a low level investment I think Barb is better. It especially has better action economy, as entering rage is free, applies to all your attacks, gives you some extra AoOs on top of giving more to-hit than the studied target.

That said, 2-4 levels of bounty hunter Slayer could be quite amazing, if you want to try your hand at dirty tricks.

[Joe M.]

Thanks for the suggestion! I'll look into it. I've been thinking, though. I may not need more than 4 levels of Rogue after all. I think what attracted me to the idea here is the 1.5x Dex-to-damage from EBS plus Finesse Training. Only need 3 levels of Rogue for that but may as well go in for the 4th for Debilitating Injury, another talent, and uncanny dodge.

So that opens up a lot of room for the build. Want it to feel like an Elven Battle Rogue. A bit of sneak attack but not the focus, trapfinding ...

What to do with the rest of the levels? Fighter? Paladin? Ranger? Slayer? Oracle (Battle? Life?) ...

[Joe M.]

Going that route, I'd probably want Half-Elf for two favored classes and Ranger, Slayer, or Inquisitor for the 6+ skill points to maintain rogueish flavor. Need to look into archetypes.

[Joe M.]

Three possible builds. Might do a DPR comparison later. They all look pretty good, they all get the flavor I'm going for. The Inquisitor build is likely going to be the best. It gets pretty much everything the others do, and then gets bane and spells on top of that. The Slayer build is nice pretty much just for the higher base attack. They all would be fine, though.

My main concern is that I haven't been able to fit in a good way to get sneak attack other than flanking. Is it worth the investment to get Shatter Defenses?

My other concern is that I'm just not feeling inspired with some of these feat and talent choices, especially for the Slayer/Rogue. Any suggestions?

(1) Elf Unchained Rogue 10/Vanguard Slayer 1

Lvl 1 Rogue, Lvl 2 Slayer, all else Rogue

Str 13 Dex 18 Con 13 Int 14 Wis 12 Cha 7

01 Combat Reflexes, (b) Weapon Finesse
03 Phalanx Formation, (rt) Trap Spotter
04 Dex +1 (= 19)
05 Power Attack, (rt) Weapon Focus
06 (re) Acrobatics
07 Toughness, (rt) Resiliency
08 Dex +1 (= 20)
09 Dodge, (rt) Combat Trick: Furious Focus
11 Extra Rogue Talent, (rt) Defensive Roll, (rt) Opportunist

Advantages: more purely a Rogue, access to advanced rogue talents

(2) Half-Elf Slayer 7/Unchained Rogue 4

Lvl 1–4 Rogue, all else Slayer

Str 14 Dex 18 Con 14 Int 12 Wis 12 Cha 7

01 Combat Reflexes, (b) Weapon Finesse, (b) Exotic Weapon Prof
02 (rt) Trap Spotter
03 Phalanx Formation
04 Dex +1 (= 19), (rt) Resiliency
05 Power Attack
06 (st) Weapon Focus
07 Iron Will
08 (st) Combat Style: Furious Focus
09 Dodge
10 (st) Combat Trick: Improved Critical
11 Lunge(?)

Advantages: studied target, higher Con makes room for Iron Will, higher BAB

(3) Half-Elf Sanctified Slayer Inquisitor 7/Rogue 4

Lvl 1–4 Rogue, all else Inquisitor

Str 14 Dex 18 Con 14 Int 12 Wis 12 Cha 7

01 Combat Reflexes, (b) Weapon Finesse, (b) Exotic Weapon Prof
02 (rt) Trap Spotter
03 Phalanx Formation
04 Dex +1 (= 19), (rt) Resiliency
05 Power Attack
07 Weapon Focus, (tf) Outflank
08 Dex +1 (= 20)
09 Furious Focus
10 (tf) Escape Route
11 Lunge (?) or Dodge (?)

Advantages: spells, better saves (+6/+6/+6 at lvl 11), teamwork feats, studied target, bane