I know all the classic advice: talk it over, be mature, etc... So this is partially a rant as well ask looking for others opinions.
I'm running a game where one of my players made a seriously dick move to another player, and if it weren't for GM intervention combined with some luck, the character would have been killed due to the dick move.
Here's the party:
Android Cryptic (basically a better utility rogue)
Android Psion (basically a wizard)
Elan Wilder (basically a sorcerer)
Human Bloodrager (basically a ball of death)
Here's the scenario:
Players are on a platform/outside entryway at the front door to an enemy head quarters they're about to assault. The headquarters is set deep into the side of a cliff with the front door at the cliff face (and the cliff looming large overhead). There is a large turret trap over the large front doors, and shoots at anyone who steps onto the platform and doesn't say the correct paraphrase. The cryptic scales the wall and gets above the turret to disarm it, while the Psion and the Wilder are hiding just off the platform. (Meanwhile the Bloodrager is off scene working on something else, so he's out of this scenario).
Due to some lucky and unlucky rolls, the Cryptic manages to disarm the trap, but also fall off the wall and land directly in front of the doors. I had planned for the bad guy just inside to the doors to charge out after so many rounds of hearing what is going on. The group ends up dawdling for a few rounds, which is perfect for my single half-giant barbarian guard to hear the crash, walk to the doors, open them, and sees someone to attack.
And so, he charges, and gets a really good hit that takes about 90%!of the cryptic's HP. The players are appropriately scared. The scenarios is now set up to the barbarian enemy is standing right next to the Cryptic at the front door, while the Psion and Wilder are just off the platform, but still in spell range.
Here's where it gets interesting. The Psion player declares to the group that he can possibly save the cryptic. He could either cast Grease on the half-giant barbarian and if he's successfull, everyone could get away - and at the very least it would make it so the barbarian could not charge next round while the Cryptic got away. He then declares that he's casting skate (basically expeditious retreat) on himself and the wilder and they abandon the cryptic to the barbarian.
The cryptic player was pissed.
On the cryptic's turn, he declares that he's running as fast as he can to get away (I make my AoO roll and get a crit). This is where GM intervention came in: I told the player that I know what I rolled, and I would allow him to change his mind on the run action and instead take a withdraw action to avoid the AoO. He chose that. However, because of all this, it meant that the barbarian was still in charging range, and he charged the next round. This time, the cryptic got lucky and the barbarian did minimal damage, leaving the cryptic unconscious but alive (this part was not GM intervention, he actually got lucky).
Enter scene with the Bloodrager, and he comes in and saves the cryptic distracting the barbarian and eventually killing him. Then the wilder shows back up after running away to use some potions to bring the cryptic back to consciousness. The Psion shows back up and does nothing.
At this point, the Psion player and Wilder player both leave the game for the day, as they had a ore planned event and had to leave early. The other two players and I hung out and they ranted about how much of a dick move that was and how phased they were that the Psion player did this. And how it's not the first time that he has run away to abandon another character to death (to be fair, though, in both other events where he has done this, nothing else could be done to save them and trying would have led to more PC deaths).
The cryptic player is seriously thinking about making a new character, an Enforcer, so he can play a "modern day" soldier who believes that cowardice and desertion would grant the death penalty on the spot.
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Do not allow anyone to respond to a dick move with a dick move of their own. Unless you'd enjoy a cascade of dickery...
Do not allow anyone to respond to a dick move with a dick move of their own. Unless you'd enjoy a cascade of dickery...
I'd go with this to an extent. Don't make new characters for no other reason than to be a dick back, but that doesn't mean you have to be happy about what happened. Realistically if the Psion spends most of his time leaving allies to die instead of helping he shouldn't be surprised if his allies don't go out of their way to help him if it is inconvenient for them. Don't be actively spiteful though.
Fair points. I sent this link to the player this all happened to. We'll see if he wants to join in the conversation.
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I'm a fan of using GM fiat to disallow dick moves in the first place.
Assuming of course, it's a "normal" game. Professional adventurers trust one another to have each others' backs. If a player can't roleplay that while still roleplaying your character's "unique" individualism/chaotic alignment, then that player needs to grow up.
OTOH if the campaign is deliberately set up as a betray-before-you're-betrayed kind of a game, naturally that's a tiger of a different stripe.
Not a betrayal game. Normal adventurers-save-the-day game. In fact, we're playing an AP.
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Some players may not like hearing "No, you may not decide to take that course of action." from the GM.
But constraints about what sorts of things you may decide to do are already programmed in. For example, since you're running an AP, the players already don't get to decide to toss the AP and follow whatever tangent strikes their whim. You can maintain the illusion that they may by clarifying "Ok, fine. You go chase that, and your character is NPCd. The party is following the plot instead. Make a new character if you wanna join in on the continuing adventures."
Its all another clause in the social contract between players of the game. "Don't be Dicks to each other" is something that can, and imo should, be included.
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If there's been two other occasions where a party member was absolutely boned and running away then was fine, why wouldn't the Psion be entirely justified in seeing a Barbarian-critted skillmonkey at said Barbarian's feet and booking it? How was he to know that this particular dying teammate was obviously salvageable when the others were not?
Did he have any indication that the Bloodrager was on his way back? Depending on how low-level this game is, two full-casters and a grievously injured rogue-type is not a good match against a Half-Giant Barbarian. If the Barb makes his save, he's still within move-attack range of the Rogue.
We don't know what spells either of the casters had besides the proposed Grease and Skate. Not enough info to condemn the Psion, imo.
They were full up. First encounter of the day. Whole party is level 4 (actually made it to level 5 as of this fight). I'm not sure what the psions total power list is, but he does summon a lot. The wilder is more of a blaster character.
As for the other two times:
They were fighting a BBEG (level 2). It killed the alchemist, had the rogue unconscious. The Psion cast skate on himself and started to run, and then the cryptic sacrificed himself to prevent the BBEG from taking chase. The cryptic was later brought back to life, and through a bit of luck the rogue was rescued. The alchemist player brought in a wilder next. The rogue player decided rogues suck and brought in a Bloodrager.
The other was them fighting a BBEG and minions (Made it to level 4 right before this fight started); the cryptic got knocked unconscious. The entire party was low on resources. The Psion cast skate on himself and booked it, leaving the rest of the party to decide whether to try to rescue the unconscious cryptic or just run. They ended up running as well, and the unconscious cryptic was captured.
So, basically, when the chips are down and its "save the world" time, this guy bails on everyone. Using them to get there, share in the loot and prestige, but being a coward when it's time to stand up and do right.
Now, I love me my thematic characters that may seem unusual/odd/sacred/dim, but what's he's doing isn't that. If anything by alignment, it's Evil, I'd say Neutral, leaning Chaotic, based on the consistent selfish behaviour with no regard to the deaths of the people he's with. At Best, I'd say NN if he's doing things that counter these blatantly selfish acts.
Hey I'm the afore mentioned ball of death. The Psion plays this same type of character in every game we've ever played. He always leaves everyone to die. To his credit though, it was actually me that suggested grease, then explained how it would stop him from charging. He just completely disregarded the advice. Also he did finally come back and heal the cryptic after the whole table was visibly upset, but was a reeeeeeal dick about it. Pointing at the half giant's blood and exclaiming "hey look, grease." to the cryptic after the battle. If it were just his character, fine, but it's not. He's just playing himself in real life.
Please allow for my players to correct me.... I could have sworn it was the Psion who said it. It is one of his favorite spells.
As for the grease; it's the same spell, just the psion's version of it. Ectoplasmitc Sheen
Pointing at the half giant's blood and exclaiming "hey look, grease." to the cryptic after the battle.
I do not remember this at all.
To be fair, I am also running this game while having two children underfoot (and in my arms, and climbing up me, and needing diapers changed) and cooking dinner - which actually my wife does most of the time for game...
To me, running sounds like a perfectly reasonable response to seeing a giant one-hit someone for 90% of their HP. At that point, the cryptic is more-or-less out of the fight, the bloodrager isn't there, so it's half the party vs a wrecking ball of a monster.
In my mind, a "seriously dick move" is something that actively screws over another player. In this case, he wasn't actively hurting the other guy (it's not like he cast Stinking Cloud or something, and the cryptic failed while the giant saved.) He just did the perfectly reasonable thing, realized they were outmatched, and ran.
Especially because they were both androids, you can't really expect them to put things like "loyalty" and "courage" above "analyze the situation and make the most logical move."
Hey all, this is the cryptic player. It was one of those situations that my hammer needed the psion anvil, and the anvil cut and run. We weren't screwed at all, the Wilder ended up destroying the half giant in two rounds. Both my character and the Wilder have huge damage potential, more so the Wilder being able to deal upwards of 50 damage per cast of mind thrust. I think the way i'm gonna play it is that my cryptic no longer trusts the psion to have his back, and he won't be taking the risks that he normally would, especially if it's something the psion suggests that could endanger my cryptic, unless there is literally no other way. Then, if the psion endangers the party again, my cryptic will either go back to town and I'd roll a new character (the enforcer or a barbarian) or I'd ask the psion player to reroll, I can't imagine my cryptic would want to be in a party with someone he doesn't trust.
I think that's a good way to handle this.