Spellstrike (Su)
At 2nd level, whenever a magus casts a spell with a range of “touch” from the magus spell list, he can deliver the spell through any weapon he is wielding as part of a melee attack. Instead of the free melee touch attack normally allowed to deliver the spell, a magus can make one free melee attack with his weapon (at his highest base attack bonus) as part of casting this spell. If successful, this melee attack deals its normal damage as well as the effects of the spell. If the magus makes this attack in concert with spell combat, this melee attack takes all the penalties accrued by spell combat melee attacks. This attack uses the weapon’s critical range (20, 19–20, or 18–20 and modified by the keen weapon property or similar effects), but the spell effect only deals ×2 damage on a successful critical hit, while the weapon damage uses its own critical modifier.
Blood Casting (Su)
At 4th level, the bloodrager gains the ability to cast spells even while bloodraging. He can also cast these spells defensively and can make concentration checks for these spells while bloodraging.While bloodraging, he can cast and concentrate on only his bloodrager spells (see below); spells from other classes cannot be cast during this state.
With those bolded parts in mind, can I spellstrike with Bloodrager spells as long as they are also on the Magus spell list?
For example, Shocking Grasp is on both spell lists, so could I use the bloodragers shocking grasp to spell strike a foe while in bloodrage?
Shocking Grasp is on both spell lists, so could I use the bloodragers shocking grasp to spell strike a foe while in bloodrage?RAW? Yes. But it wouldn't work in the closest version of "other way round".
If you learn a spell as a magus, you may not cast it using Blood Casting ***even if that spell is on the Bloodrager spell list***.
Why? Your bolding:
he can cast and concentrate on only his bloodrager spells (see below); spells from other classes cannot be cast during this state"Your bloodrager spells" are the spells you learned as a blood rager.
The magus ability doesn't say anything about which class allowed you to **learn** the spell, or which class's spell casting you are employing during spell strike. The condition put on spellstrike is that the spell is on the magus class list, not that you learned it as a magus, nor that you are casting it using magus spell slots.
Ok so as long as I actualy have the spel known for the bloodrager class I can spell strike with it. Awesome, that's all I needed to know thanks a ton sir.ma'am.
No
Can you explain you're view on why not since I have also a yes and an explanation on why yes?
Actually with the magus the spell also has to be a spell prepared with your magus slots if you want to use it with spellstrike.
Actually with the magus the spell also has to be a spell prepared with your magus slots if you want to use it with spellstrike.
ok that entry also use the vague "Spell List" term so it doesn't reall state that it has to be prepped useing the magus slots, witch is brought up a bit further down that thread.
Hmm after reading on I see that this is actualy an ongoing issue.
Wraithstrike is wrong.
Wraithstrike is attempting to apply the answer to ONE question to a DIFFERENT question.
The question being asked in that other thread is this:
The spell combat description says, "...cast any spell from the magus spell list..."My question is that literally any spell for the magus spell list? Or any spell my magus has prepared that day?
That question is quite different from your question about a situation. I'll summarize your situation like this:
IN a case where you know a spell, you prepared a spell, you have the ability to cast the spell any round you choose, it's on the magus spell list, you have enough magus levels to spell strike...does the spell strike go off if the spell slots you happened to use to prepare that spell that is on the magus list are spell slots not actually provided by magus levels?
But to that other thread's original question "...literally any spell for the magus spell list? Or any spell my magus has prepared that day?
SKR provides the answer:
"... and can also cast any spell from the magus spell list with a casting time of 1 standard action."
The above text refers to magus spells that magus has prepared with his magus class spell slots. It does NOT allow you to just pick any magus spell and cast it.
It has to be a magus spell you know.
It has to be a magus spell you have prepared.
YOUR question is more accurately summarized and answered not by SKR, who, wraithstrike believes, has negated the opportunity to spell strike with bloodrager spells that are also on the class list...
YOUR question is more accurately summarized and answered by seebs who rebuts that (mis-)interpretation of Reynolds statement by clarifying it thusly:
...
Sean K Reynolds said:
"... and can also cast any spell from the magus spell list with a casting time of 1 standard action."
The above text refers to magus spells that magus has prepared with his magus
Oooohh I see. I didn't actually read the beginning of the thread just from where he linked and a onward. I can also see where Wraithstrike may have confused my question, kind of why I put in an example. I figured the spell I spell strike would have to be on both spell lists to work, I'm not trying to use it with spells a Magus wouldn't normally have access to.
I am saying that if a spell is on both list it still has to be specifically prepared as a magus spell. You cant expend a bloodrager slot to empower spell combat. If I am misunderstanding feel free to explain again.
I am saying that if a spell is on both list it still has to be specifically prepared as a magus spell. You cant expend a bloodrager slot to empower spell combat. If I am misunderstanding feel free to explain again.
Well first off I wasn't intending to insult you by saying you may have misunderstood, sorry I guess. The misunderstanding you are making is that I'm talking about Spell Combat, where as I am talking about Spell Strike, these are 2 separate abilities.
I am saying that if a spell is on both list it still has to be specifically prepared as a magus spell. You cant expend a bloodrager slot to empower spell combat. If I am misunderstanding feel free to explain again.Well first off I wasn't intending to insult you by saying you may have misunderstood, sorry I guess. The misunderstanding you are making is that I'm talking about Spell Combat, where as I am talking about Spell Strike, these are 2 separate abilities.
I dont consider me misunderstanding to be an insult so if I do misunderstand that is fine. :)
With that said my beleif also extends to spell strike. I am not home right now and I dont like doing rules research on my phone so I will watch from the sidelines for now.
Based on the oddly rude designers input that supports the "NO" opinion and based on all the other rules in the books that support the "YES" opinion, I think the Devs need to reread the material they wrote.
In all Honesty I'm starting to hate this game and it's lack of rules clarity. I think I'm going to go with a better written system with less BS that seems to be intent on shunning those who want to create anything outside of what the Devs think you should make. I mean really all this number crunching is stupid, I'm sick of playing a tabletop video game that's full of bugs and stupid rules.
All that aside thanks for the replays this forum has been pretty helpful in the past. Good luck forum goers.
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I always thought it was fairly common sense that you use the classes abilities with the features it gives you.
The class allows you to use a feature in conjunction with its spell list. Seems straight forward to figure that only the spells that are readied as that class are usable for that feature.
Spells memorized as a magus are the ones usable for spell combat and spellstrike. Spells memorized from another class do not transfer over.
I always thought it was fairly common sense that you use the classes abilities with the features it gives you.
The class allows you to use a feature in conjunction with its spell list. Seems straight forward to figure that only the spells that are readied as that class are usable for that feature.
Spells memorized as a magus are the ones usable for spell combat and spellstrike. Spells memorized from another class do not transfer over.
Except that the wording of things like scrolls, wands and other magic items indicates otherwise. also sure this would make perfect sense if it were a reoccurring thing but then you get classes like the Spellslinger whose class abilities allow you to use spells from ANY spell casting class, so the idea of basing it off of other common similarities is a no go.
This is the thing that pisses me off about this system, the exact same wording means two different things depending on where you read it. How the hell is anyone supposed to figure that out on their own?This kind of bad editing or bad writing or what ever is going on with them is unacceptable. They keep coming out with all this new material and they can't/wont bother to make the old material make any damn sense. Each PHB should come with a tablet like device that only goes to these forums because the only way to be able to understand half of the rules is to sit on these forums for up to an hour per rule, it's ridiculous!
I've already begun speaking with my group about abandoning all pathfinder products in favor of a better system, so far everyone is on board, pretty excited about the change actualy.
I always thought it was fairly common sense that you use the classes abilities with the features it gives you.
The class allows you to use a feature in conjunction with its spell list. Seems straight forward to figure that only the spells that are readied as that class are usable for that feature.
Spells memorized as a magus are the ones usable for spell combat and spellstrike. Spells memorized from another class do not transfer over.
Except that the wording of things like scrolls, wands and other magic items indicates otherwise. also sure this would make perfect sense if it were a reoccurring thing but then you get classes like the Spellslinger whose class abilities allow you to use spells from ANY spell casting class, so the idea of basing it off of other common similarities is a no go.
This is the thing that pisses me off about this system, the exact same wording means two different things depending on where you read it. How the hell is anyone supposed to figure that out on their own?This kind of bad editing or bad writing or what ever is going on with them is unacceptable. They keep coming out with all this new material and they can't/wont bother to make the old material make any damn sense. Each PHB should come with a tablet like device that only goes to these forums because the only way to be able to understand half of the rules is to sit on these forums for up to an hour per rule, it's ridiculous!
I've already begun speaking with my group about abandoning all pathfinder products in favor of a better system, so far everyone is on board, pretty excited about the change actualy.
What is a spellslinger? Is it an archetype of a magus?
What is a spellslinger? Is it an archetype of a magus?I always thought it was fairly common sense that you use the classes abilities with the features it gives you.
The class allows you to use a feature in conjunction with its spell list. Seems straight forward to figure that only the spells that are readied as that class are usable for that feature.
Spells memorized as a magus are the ones usable for spell combat and spellstrike. Spells memorized from another class do not transfer over.
Except that the wording of things like scrolls, wands and other magic items indicates otherwise. also sure this would make perfect sense if it were a reoccurring thing but then you get classes like the Spellslinger whose class abilities allow you to use spells from ANY spell casting class, so the idea of basing it off of other common similarities is a no go.
This is the thing that pisses me off about this system, the exact same wording means two different things depending on where you read it. How the hell is anyone supposed to figure that out on their own?This kind of bad editing or bad writing or what ever is going on with them is unacceptable. They keep coming out with all this new material and they can't/wont bother to make the old material make any damn sense. Each PHB should come with a tablet like device that only goes to these forums because the only way to be able to understand half of the rules is to sit on these forums for up to an hour per rule, it's ridiculous!
I've already begun speaking with my group about abandoning all pathfinder products in favor of a better system, so far everyone is on board, pretty excited about the change actualy.
Pretty sure you're feigning ignorance for some reason as I know you have been a part of this community for a long time now but just in case you have some how miraculously overlooked this calss all this time HERE is the link anyway.
I remember now. I just keep forgetting the name of it. It is one of those archetypes I don't really care too much for.
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I always thought it was fairly common sense that you use the classes abilities with the features it gives you.
The class allows you to use a feature in conjunction with its spell list. Seems straight forward to figure that only the spells that are readied as that class are usable for that feature.
Spells memorized as a magus are the ones usable for spell combat and spellstrike. Spells memorized from another class do not transfer over.
Except that the wording of things like scrolls, wands and other magic items indicates otherwise. also sure this would make perfect sense if it were a reoccurring thing but then you get classes like the Spellslinger whose class abilities allow you to use spells from ANY spell casting class, so the idea of basing it off of other common similarities is a no go.
This is the thing that pisses me off about this system, the exact same wording means two different things depending on where you read it. How the hell is anyone supposed to figure that out on their own?This kind of bad editing or bad writing or what ever is going on with them is unacceptable. They keep coming out with all this new material and they can't/wont bother to make the old material make any damn sense. Each PHB should come with a tablet like device that only goes to these forums because the only way to be able to understand half of the rules is to sit on these forums for up to an hour per rule, it's ridiculous!
I've already begun speaking with my group about abandoning all pathfinder products in favor of a better system, so far everyone is on board, pretty excited about the change actualy.
What wording in things like scrolls, wands and other magic items indicates that as a standard class features can use other class features to power them?
What about the spellslinger allows what you are looking for?
To me it takes a deliberate misreading of the rules to come up with the idea that you can use things like Bloodrager spells to power Magus abilities just because the spells you are using the spells that are on the base base list.
This is the misinformaion that comes with RAW.
I am not sure your total problem with the system, you keep talking about editing, but taking a step back and not, even accidentally, trying to twist the system, goes a long way to not having issues.
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Pretty sure you're feigning ignorance for some reason as I know you have been a part of this community for a long time now but just in case you have some how miraculously overlooked this calss all this time...What is a spellslinger? Is it an archetype of a magus?I always thought it was fairly common sense that you use the classes abilities with the features it gives you.
The class allows you to use a feature in conjunction with its spell list. Seems straight forward to figure that only the spells that are readied as that class are usable for that feature.
Spells memorized as a magus are the ones usable for spell combat and spellstrike. Spells memorized from another class do not transfer over.
Except that the wording of things like scrolls, wands and other magic items indicates otherwise. also sure this would make perfect sense if it were a reoccurring thing but then you get classes like the Spellslinger whose class abilities allow you to use spells from ANY spell casting class, so the idea of basing it off of other common similarities is a no go.
This is the thing that pisses me off about this system, the exact same wording means two different things depending on where you read it. How the hell is anyone supposed to figure that out on their own?This kind of bad editing or bad writing or what ever is going on with them is unacceptable. They keep coming out with all this new material and they can't/wont bother to make the old material make any damn sense. Each PHB should come with a tablet like device that only goes to these forums because the only way to be able to understand half of the rules is to sit on these forums for up to an hour per rule, it's ridiculous!
I've already begun speaking with my group about abandoning all pathfinder products in favor of a better system, so far everyone is on board, pretty excited about the change actualy.
You should move on guy. I have been around for a while myself I own that book and I didnt know that archtype.
Don't attribute to malice...
Generally speaking, it seems to me that the vast majority of answers for these questions that the dev's respond to reinforce the concept of 'the classes powers are meant to be used with the class itself" and when that general assumption alters they explicitly call it out in a class write up.
That said I agree with wraithstrike. I think the intent is to use the Magus abilities with Magus spells used from Magus spell slots.
Even if an identical spell is on another list, I don't think the intent was to allow that magic to be used with the Magus abilities.
Owner - D20 Hobbies
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from the magus spell list
While bloodraging, he can cast and concentrate on only his bloodrager spells (see below)
"from the X spell list" is short hand for:
1) Exists on your X spell list as modified by abilities that add spells to your list.2) You have prepared in your X class spell slots.
3) You are using the effect with a spell cast from X class.