How would power attack interact with the greater power attack? While duel wielding.
Would back hand swing deal double my strength? With 2 falchions?
How would you build this this guy?
How would power attack interact with the greater power attack? While duel wielding.
Would back hand swing deal double my strength? With 2 falchions?
How would you build this this guy?
At 3rd level, when a two-handed fighter makes a single attack (with the attack action or a charge) with a two-handed weapon, he adds double his Strength bonus on damage rolls.
At 2nd level, a titan mauler may choose to wield a two-handed melee weapon in one hand with a –2 penalty on attack rolls while doing so. The weapon must be appropriately sized for her, and it is treated as one-handed when determining the effect of Power Attack, Strength bonus to damage, and the like.
At 3rd level, a titan mauler becomes skilled in the use of massive weapons looted from her titanic foes. The attack roll penalty for using weapons too large for her size is reduced by 1, and this reduction increases by 1 for every three levels beyond 3rd (to a minimum of 0).
You must actually be able to WIELD a Large Two-Handed weapon (which you can't using Titan Mauler) in order for Massive Weapons to work with Two-Handers - it only works with Large One-Handed weapons like a Large Longsword or a Large Bastardsword.
You can go 2 levels of Titan Mauler and 3 levels of Two-Handed Fighter in order to get the effects of Overhand Chop added to your Two-Handed Weapon that you're wielding in just one hand because Overhand Chop DOES NOT SAY that you must be wielding a Two-Handed Weapon in 2 Hands; just that you must be using a Two-Handed Weapon PERIOD.
But all that is is a 2x Str on a Charge, or 2x Str on a Vital Strike. The Vital Strike route seems pretty god-awful compared to a Full Attack, and your +2 to Charge is negated by your -2 to wield a Two-Handed Weapon in one hand.
On top of that, your Power Attack bonus is only +4 to damage vs -2 to hit, meaning mathematically it's the same as if you'd never added Power Attack in the first place (every +1 accuracy is worth +2 damage, so Power Attack with one-handed attacks is a zero-sum gain in damage statistically).
If you Two-Handed the Greatsword, you'd be getting +6 to damage, and only a loss of -2 to Hit. Thus you have a net gain of damage compared to attacking WITHOUT Power Attack.
You're better off just going straight Two-Handed style as an Invulnerable Rager: you get +2 to Attack on a Charge, your Power Attack is +3 damage for every -1 to-hit, and you get more rounds of Rage.
How would power attack interact with the greater power attack? While duel wielding.
Would back hand swing deal double my strength? With 2 falchions?
How would you build this this guy?
Oh, wait, you mean TWO-WEAPON WARRIOR.
That's a horse of a different color - a lame, mentally deficient, one-legged horse of a sickening brown-green color.
You wouldn't. It doesn't work that way. And it's an awful, awful, HORRIBLE idea.
Let me explain:
At 2nd level, a titan mauler may choose to wield a two-handed melee weapon in one hand with a –2 penalty on attack rolls while doing so. The weapon must be appropriately sized for her, and it is treated as one-handed when determining the effect of Power Attack, Strength bonus to damage, and the like.
At 5th level, a two-weapon warrior gains a +1 bonus on attack and damage rolls when making a full-attack with two weapons or a double weapon. This bonus increases by +1 for every four levels after 5th.
At 11th level, the attack penalties for fighting with two weapons are reduced by –1 for a two-weapon warrior. Alternatively, he may use a one-handed weapon in his off-hand, treating it as if it were a light weapon with the normal light weapon penalties.
So...
You are using a Medium-Sized Two-Handed Weapon in one hand. That's a -2 to Attack for a Flachion. So you're swinging at BAB -2 with just one.
OH, but WAIT.
You're also using Two-Weapon Fighting, assuming you have the Two-Weapon Fighting feat, with a non-Light weapon in your Offhand.
Meaning you're Attacking at BAB -6. Meaning you FINALLY attack at -0/-0/-5 at 6th level.
That's fantastic. And by fantastic, I mean stupid.
At 7th Level, you FINALLY get a +1 when swinging with both weapons, meaning your Full Attack Action is +2/+2/-3/-3 if you have ITWF.
It isn't until you hit lv13(!!!) that you FINALLY make a Full Attack at +11/+11/+6/+6/+1/+1 (because you're getting +2 to Attack when making a Full Attack, and you can FINALLY treat that Two-Handed-Handed Weapon that you're treating as a One-Handed Weapon as a Light Weapon in your Offhand (assuming a liberal reading by the DM, and not sticking to a "One-Handed only in regards to damage" reading, since the ONLY examples given are Power Attack and Strength Bonuses before the "and the like"). You're STILL losing -2 due to the size penalty from Jotungrip, though, meaning you're never making a full attack at full BAB unless you also take Weapon Focus and Greater Weapon Focus (which you probably should, anyway)
In other words, you are going to absolutely SUCK for the first 12 levels of your career, and only be okay once you hit lv13.
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If you're starting at lv15+, then go for it, but if you're starting much lower or playing PFS, it's just a bad, bad idea that will mean you'll never hit except on a Critical (and never EVER be able to confirm due to the massive penalties to attack).
If you're playing a home game, just ask your DM if you can buy Strongarm Bracers (D&D 3.5, Magic Item Compendium, pg. 139), and take Oversized Two-Wepaon Fighting (D&D 3.5, Complete Warrior).
How would power attack interact with the greater power attack? While duel wielding.
Would back hand swing deal double my strength? With 2 falchions?
How would you build this this guy?
At 3rd level, when a two-handed fighter makes a single attack (with the attack action or a charge) with a two-handed weapon, he adds double his Strength bonus on damage rolls.At 2nd level, a titan mauler may choose to wield a two-handed melee weapon in one hand with a –2 penalty on attack rolls while doing so. The weapon must be appropriately sized for her, and it is treated as one-handed when determining the effect of Power Attack, Strength bonus to damage, and the like.At 3rd level, a titan mauler becomes skilled in the use of massive weapons looted from her titanic foes. The attack roll penalty for using weapons too large for her size is reduced by 1, and this reduction increases by 1 for every three levels beyond 3rd (to a minimum of 0).You must actually be able to WIELD a Large Two-Handed weapon (which you can't using Titan Mauler) in order for Massive Weapons to work with Two-Handers - it only works with Large One-Handed weapons like a Large Longsword or a Large Bastardsword.
On top of that, your Power Attack bonus is only +4 to damage vs -2 to hit, meaning mathematically it's the same as if you'd never added Power Attack in the...
Where dose it say I have to use large bastard swords and not a great sword.
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I am going to point out two Titan Mauler FAQs, that may clear things up:
Barbarian--Titan Mauler: Does the Jotungrip class feature (page 30) allow the Titan Mauler to use oversized weapons?
No. Jotungrip allows the titan mauler to use two-handed melee weapons in one hand, but only if the weapon is appropriately sized for the character. The massive weapon class feature allows her to use oversized weapons with decreased penalty, but does not allow her to use two-handed weapons of that size in one hand.
Update Page 30, in the titan mauler archetype, in the Jotungrip class feature, in the first sentence, insert the word "melee" between "two-handed" and "weapon."
Barbarian--Titan Mauler: Can a Medium titan mauler wield a Large two-handed weapon, such as a Large greatsword?
No. The "Inappropriately Sized Weapons" rule (Core Rulebook 144) says (in summary) that a creature can't wield an inappropriately-sized weapon if the size difference would increase it one or more "steps" beyond "two-handed." None of the titan mauler's abilities say the character can break the "steps" part of the "Inappropriately Sized Weapons" rule, so the character still has to follow that rule.
how would 2 levels Titan mauler barbarian for the ability to wield two handed weapons in one hand. And then 7 levels fighter two handed fighter ( back swing) ability for double strength on all attacks after first ( while wielding two handed weapons)?
Would it work?
All going two weapon fighting.
how would 2 levels Titan mauler barbarian for the ability to wield two handed weapons in one hand. And then 7 levels fighter two handed fighter ( back swing) ability for double strength on all attacks after first ( while wielding two handed weapons)?
Would it work?
All going two weapon fighting.
it calls out a two handed weapon so a great sword in each hand. Would get double strength bonus. Because it is a two handed weapon.
how would 2 levels Titan mauler barbarian for the ability to wield two handed weapons in one hand. And then 7 levels fighter two handed fighter ( back swing) ability for double strength on all attacks after first ( while wielding two handed weapons)?
Would it work?
All going two weapon fighting.
Well... I see some issues depending on RAW vs RAI and poor wording.
At 2nd level, a titan mauler may choose to wield a two-handed melee weapon in one hand with a –2 penalty on attack rolls while doing so. The weapon must be appropriately sized for her, and it is treated as one-handed when determining the effect of Power Attack, Strength bonus to damage, and the like.
1-. Jotungrip allows you to dual-wield two two-handed, that's no issue... but since you're now wielding those weapons with one hand, it states those weapons are now treated as one-handed weapons for determining changes to STR... "and the like".
2-. Your weapons are considered as ONE handed (not LIGHT) for two-weapon-fighting puprposes (namely, you'd wield a non-light offhand). This (again) points you that you're using 1H weapons.
3-. Your Backswing might not apply depending on ruling (here's the RAW/RAI collision).
Basically, per Jotungrip, your weapon is used (and should be then treated) as 1H, specifically mentioning STR-based effects. This would prevent Backswing to kick in since it requires a to use 2H weapon.
But.... your weapon "type" is still Two-Handed, even if you're wielding it with one hand. And Backswing states "when you perform attacks with two-handed weapons".
I'd say, per RAI, Backswing is intended for 2H's used with both hands (in fact, it comes from an archetype meant for that), increasing default STR bonus using weapons that way from x1.5 to x2. "Forcing RAW" to change TWF from x1/x0.5 STR to x2/x2 is a little broken, but your GM might rule Backswing applies as long as the weapon itself "fits" the "two-handed" type, no matter how you use it.
if using jotungrip you're no longer making attacks with a two-handed weapon but one-handed for class abilities.
how would 2 levels Titan mauler barbarian for the ability to wield two handed weapons in one hand. And then 7 levels fighter two handed fighter ( back swing) ability for double strength on all attacks after first ( while wielding two handed weapons)?
Would it work?
All going two weapon fighting.
Well... I see some issues depending on RAW vs RAI and poor wording.
At 2nd level, a titan mauler may choose to wield a two-handed melee weapon in one hand with a –2 penalty on attack rolls while doing so. The weapon must be appropriately sized for her, and it is treated as one-handed when determining the effect of Power Attack, Strength bonus to damage, and the like.1-. Jotungrip allows you to dual-wield two two-handed, that's no issue... but since you're now wielding those weapons with one hand, it states those weapons are now treated as one-handed weapons for determining changes to STR... "and the like".
2-. Your weapons are considered as ONE handed (not LIGHT) for two-weapon-fighting puprposes (namely, you'd wield a non-light offhand). This (again) points you that you're using 1H weapons.
3-. Your Backswing might not apply depending on ruling (here's the RAW/RAI collision).
Basically, per Jotungrip, your weapon is used (and should be then treated) as 1H, specifically mentioning STR-based effects. This would prevent Backswing to kick in since it requires a to use 2H weapon.
But.... your weapon "type" is still Two-Handed, even if you're wielding it with one hand. And Backswing states "when you perform attacks with two-handed weapons".
I'd say, per RAI, Backswing is intended for 2H's used with both hands (in fact, it comes from an archetype meant for that), increasing default STR bonus using weapons that way from x1.5 to x2. "Forcing RAW" to change TWF from x1/x0.5 STR to x2/x2 is a little broken, but your GM might rule Backswing applies as long as the weapon itself "fits" the "two-handed" type, no matter how you use it.
Thanks for the breake down. And fast reply. I was thinking the same as well. The back swing ability changes the str mod to double "ONLY" with two handed weapons. I've always wanted to play this guy but didn't know if the rules would allow. Brings a tear to my eye.
The thing you need to keep in mind is that a weapon's qualities as an item are different from their qualities when wielded. For instance, when you wield a two-handed weapon as a one-handed weapon, it still has the HP of a 2-h weapon. It takes on a virtual handedness category of 1-h for the purpose of how you wield it. So, even though the weapon itself is a 2-h weapon, you're wielding it as if it were a one-handed weapon. That overrides its quality as a 2-h weapon so you can't use it with feats/abilities that require you to wield a 2-h weapon (eg. Two-handed Fighter's abilities, Pushing Assault, Shield of Swings, etc.) but, in exchange, it does interact with feats/abilities that require you to wield a 1-h weapon (eg. Spell Combat).
So a Titan Mauler 2/Two-handed Fighter 7 wouldn't be able to use abilities like Overhand Chop or Back Swing with a weapon wielded one-handed via Jotungrip, let alone with a pair of such weapons. But at Titan Mauler 3, he would be able to use those abilities with an oversized 2-h weapon wielded via Massive Weapons. Likewise, he could use those abilities with a one-handed weapon that's one size too big for him because such a weapon is treated as 2-h, or with a light weapon that's two sizes too big. For example, a Medium character (eg. Human) wields a Large Longsword as if it were a 2-h weapon so it now qualifies for 2-h dependent abilities; same for a Huge Dagger.
On the other hand, there are some rules elements that use slightly (but importantly) different terms. When you wield a Lance while mounted or a polearm via the Choke Up weapon trick, they state you wield them "in one hand", rather than as a one-handed weapon. In these cases, they still count as 2-h weapons for all purposes save for the number of physical grasping appendages required to wield them. You'd be able to wield these weapons using one hand and free the other hand for handling a shield or mount reins or whatnot, but you wouldn't free up your attack economy to make an off-hand...
I'm a little confused so it would take 3 levels of barbarian? I don't want over sized weapons. I was 2 regular sized greate swords. Not large sized; 2d6 In each hand. They are each two handed weapons.
After my first attack all others deal double strength because they are greate swords ( two handed weapons), because I swing wide with them "because they are great swords".I think the issue is the strength mod.
It dose say "it is treated like a one handed weapon for PA and str..."
So it makes it so you can hold 1 great swords in each hand so 2 Great swords 2d6 each.
Great swords are two handed weapons.
Back swing say "when I attack with a "TWO HANDED WEAPON" I add double my strength, after my fist hit."
If I have to go 3 levels barbarian I guess I could? But then I would just go master of many styles to really pump this build up. Get tiger style line or dragon. Brute stomp looking real sexy on this build.
Backswing doesn't work with two weapon fighting. When you are swinging them they are one-handed weapons.
This was a different question I just didn't want to open a new thread.
As I said, it isn't important what kind of weapon it is. Greatswords are two-handed weapons; that only means that, by default, they are wielded as two-handed weapons. If a rules element changes its effective effort category (light/1-h/2-h), you can't also say, "but it's default effort category is still 2-h weapon so I can still gain the benefits of that too." You either use the default category or the modified category. I gave examples of rules elements that can change effort category and Oversized Weapons was one of those examples; it changes the effort category of a "1 size too big Greatsword" from "unwieldable" to "2-h". The bottom line is that there is no functional way to TWF with a pair of Greatswords and have them still count as 2-h weapons for rules elements that require you to use 2-h weapons. The absolute best you could do is TWF with a 2-h weapon and one of a very limited selection of light weapons that explicitly state they can be used for off-hand attacks even while wielding a 2-h weapon. To my knowledge, the only such weapons currently...I'm a little confused so it would take 3 levels of barbarian? I don't want over sized weapons. I was 2 regular sized greate swords. Not large sized; 2d6 In each hand. They are each two handed weapons.
After my first attack all others deal double strength because they are greate swords ( two handed weapons), because I swing wide with them "because they are great swords".
I think the issue is the strength mod.
It dose say "it is treated like a one handed weapon for PA and str..."
So it makes it so you can hold 1 great swords in each hand so 2 Great swords 2d6 each.
Great swords are two handed weapons.
Back swing say "when I attack with a "TWO HANDED WEAPON" I add double my strength, after my fist hit."
If I have to go 3 levels barbarian I guess I could? But then I would just go master of many styles to really pump this build up. Get tiger style line or dragon. Brute stomp looking real sexy on this build.
Ok thanks.