2-25: You Only Die Twice - High / low levels and playing high

[Prethen]

There's one spot in particular that I'm thinking of where lower level characters could be a bit more on guard:

Spoiler:

The Haunt that, at high tier, can deal out 100 hit points of damage on failed save, which could wipe out any within 15'.

I don't want to warn them of the particular hazard, but I would feel really bad if they happened to have the wrong characters at the wrong place and they were caught off-guard.

I was thinking of saying, prior to the adventure starting, something to the effect of "Be on guard as there could be particular areas of extreme danger to lower level characters."

A bad dice roll and character placement can be the end of the adventure.

[LilyHaze]

Isn't that trap a Harm spell? Harm can't drop a character's health below 1.

[TriOmegaZero]

LilyHaze is correct. One of the few instances where the high tier trap is less dangerous.

[DesolateHarmony]

Remember that all haunts are fear effects.

This is important for bravery and aura of courage and other effects.

[Prethen]

I don't see where it's a Harm spell:

Spoiler:

Anyone standing anywhere in the area when the haunt
manifests takes 100 points of positive energy damage, but
is healed any adverse effects currently active as per the heal
spell. A Fortitude save (DC 19) halves this damage.

I see that it mentions Heal in an "as per" sense but nothing beyond positive energy damage.

[TriOmegaZero]

Prethen wrote:

I see that it mentions Heal in an "as per" sense but nothing beyond positive energy damage.

Heal wrote:

If used against an undead creature, heal instead acts like harm.

Harm wrote:

Harm cannot reduce the target's hit points to less than 1.

'As per the heal spell' does not mean 'only for damage'. It means all effects apply.

[Prethen]

Excellent, thank you Steven. I haven't run into Heal/Harm enough to remember that. No one will die then.

[TriOmegaZero]

No problem. It trips a lot of people up.

[andreww]

This is something I regularly do when I have lower tier characters in a higher sub tier. It's always worth reminding them at the start of the risk they take. If they choose to go ahead and rush into danger then they have at least been warned.

[Quadstriker]

Steven Schopmeyer wrote:

One of the few instances where the high tier trap is less dangerous.

GOOD.

Apparently the proper way to GM this is to tell everyone they take 100 points of damage.

Then wait 45 seconds.

Then give them the good news.

[TOZ]

Mwahahahahahaha

[Dubgall]

The players are playing as a Zombie in this adventure so you are damaged by the heal spell. this is a fun adventure for the weirdness factor

[KingMidas]

Quadstriker wrote:

Apparently the proper way to GM this is to tell everyone they take 100 points of damage.

Then wait 45 seconds.

Then give them the good news.

When I played this scenario and we got here, the GM walked around the table and asked to see everyone's character sheets (writing down hit points). Then he asked us to make our saves and gave us each a very different amount of damage. Took us a second to realize that everyone who failed got taken down to 1 and we figured out it was the most painful heal spell any of our characters had ever been hit with. Good times.

[TOZ]

That's pretty good. I like my way better, of course. :)

[Jayson MF Kip]

One of my players wrote:

But I saved and he failed. Why'd I get hit for 50 but he only got hit for 38?

"Haunts are weird."

[Zan Greenshadow]

This haunt is, indeed, very weird, possibly helpful and also possibly very dangerous...and not just for negative energy-based creatures.

Creatures that receive positive energy damage are healed. However, they can be healed above their normal hit points as temp hit points (remains for 10 rounds).

Additionally, if a character receives positive energy damage equal to 2x their hit points or greater, they have to make a fortitude save or explode. Oops - too much positive energy in the form of the worst heal spell they have ever received.

See the rules for Positive Energy (Ex) that are associated with Positive Energy Elementals. I see no reason why those rules should not apply for this haunt. The damage is exactly the same type of energy damage whether it comes from an elemental or a haunt.

Unfortunately, the scenario is remiss in not clarifying exactly how this haunt works.

And, btw, this is just my GM interpretation, which may not be correct. I'd be interested to hear your perspectives.

However on a positive (energy) note, the PC has 2 chances to save - once to reduce the damage (or healing) by half and once to avoid exploding if they receive too much positive energy damage.

[Zan Greenshadow]

...and just to be clear, I am speaking in the abstract for this positive energy haunt and am aware of the impact of the Chalice in this particular scenario. ;-)

[kinevon]

Zan Greenshadow wrote:

This haunt is, indeed, very weird, possibly helpful and also possibly very dangerous...and not just for negative energy-based creatures.

Creatures that receive positive energy damage are healed. However, they can be healed above their normal hit points as temp hit points (remains for 10 rounds).

Additionally, if a character receives positive energy damage equal to 2x their hit points or greater, they have to make a fortitude save or explode. Oops - too much positive energy in the form of the worst heal spell they have ever received.

See the rules for Positive Energy (Ex) that are associated with Positive Energy Elementals. I see no reason why those rules should not apply for this haunt. The damage is exactly the same type of energy damage whether it comes from an elemental or a haunt.

Unfortunately, the scenario is remiss in not clarifying exactly how this haunt works.

And, btw, this is just my GM interpretation, which may not be correct. I'd be interested to hear your perspectives.

However on a positive (energy) note, the PC has 2 chances to save - once to reduce the damage (or healing) by half and once to avoid exploding if they receive too much positive energy damage.

First question: Are those issues with positive energy in the Heal spell write-up?

How about the general glossary?

As a side note, where do you find the write-up for a Positive Energy Elemental? I couldn't find them listed in B1-B4 or the Monster Codex...

Okay, found it on D20PFSRD, and here is the copyright info:
Positive Energy Elemental from the Tome of Horrors Complete, Copyright 2011, Necromancer Games, Inc., published and distributed by Frog God Games; Author Scott Greene.

So, third party product, so not a rules source for PFS, except for the possibility of said elemental being used in an module or scenario.

So, no, please do not pull in 3PP rules to kill PCs.

[Zan Greenshadow]

Yegads. Caught in the d20pfsrd 3PP sand trap once again, even though I thought I had learned how to avoid it long ago. ^_^ Thanks for the reminder, kinevon. I was definitely in a hurry. Wait - does that mean I lose 3 prestige? Hehe. Drat! However, that feature might come in handy when trying to heal penguins of top of televisions.