I'm relatively new to posting on the site, so I'm not positive on where I should ask this. Also, I'm new to GMing and eyeing adjustments, etc.
I'm using the race builder from the Advanced Race Guide as well as the Core Rulebook's npc creation chapter to translate a race from an old Forum roleplay from a decade ago into Pathfinder. I managed to streamline the abilities from the one example character down to a 30rp race that I am happy with. Player Characters and NPCs are now doable except for one thing: CR.
The Core Rulebook says that "a creature that posesses class levels, but does not have any racial Hit Dice, is factored in as a creature with a CR equal to it's class levels -1." My Bestiary derived monster sample stat bloc is for a 1st level Sorcerer, so this would make the CR 1/2. However, the Bestiary 4 bloc for Trox player characters says "Despite having no racial Hit Dice, trox are powerful creatures and their CR is 2 higher than a human of the same level." Since Trox and my race have similar rp values (28 vs 30), should my own race be CR 2 as well?
Because pathfinder doesn't have a level adjustment system (thank god), it is generally better to avoid monsters with high CR as player characters.
In this case, 30 RP is pretty excessive. If you post the race builder on here I am almost certain we can find ways to trim it down. <20 RP is preferable if you want them to play nicely with normal core rulebook races.
Custom races almost always suffer from 'feature bloat'. You can maintain the feel of your race without needing a lot of the superfluous bonuses you almost certainly have.
It's difficult to tell whether your race is a CR+2 race or not without actually looking at it. High CR races influence the strength of the encounter necessary to challenge your players and tend not to play nicely with the core races regardless of adjustments.
Type: Outsider (native, half-undead) [8rp]
Size: Medium [0rp]
Base Speed: Normal [0rp]
Ability Score Modifier: Flexible (+2 STR, +2 DEX) [2rp]
Language: Standard [0rp]
Subtotal = 10rp
Ability Score: Advanced Constitution +2 [4rp]
Movement: Fleet-Footed [3rp]
Senses: Darkvision 60ft. [-]
Low-Light Vision [1rp]
Weakness: Negative Energy Affinity [-]
Defense: Resist Level Drain [-]
Undead Resistance [-]
Fiendish Resistance [3rp]
Dual-Minded [1rp]
Skill & Feat: Skill Bonus (+1 Knowledge Planes, +1 Knowledge Religion) [2rp]
Offense: Bite (1d4) [2rp]
Magical: Fell Magic [3rp]
Fiendish Sorcery (Tiefling version, Infernal only) [1rp]
Total = 30rp
In the original roleplay, the character was a vampire who was later revealed to be the son of Lucifer. As one of the main characters, he was naturally far more powerful than normal humans. When I started bringing him into Pathfinder, I quickly realized that there was no Lucifer, the Nephalim were completely different from my character, Vampires were more feral, and Dhampirs and Tieflings weren't quite right; hence the creation of a new race.
Lucifer was flavour changed into Asmodeus and the 3 similsr but different types of Nephilim were changed into a group known as the Asmodeans.
The first type of Asmodean would be the Hellpyre based off my character. Kinda halfway between Dahmpirs and Tieflings. Believe it or not, the original assortment of qualities and traits totalled 51rp. I streamlined it by removing things that were his capabilities and keeping more genetic type traits that would come from the Lord of Hell and a human vampire.
Is it powerful compared to the Core Races? Yes, but it was meant to be. Is it meant to be used in a home game? It would be interesting, but no. This was just meant to view a character of mine in a DnD/Pathfinder setting. I wanted to make a race/monster to then build my old character.
I don't really understand why you even need to create a race via point-builder if you don't intend to have it as a playable race? If you want to approximate his stats for fun, just create a unique monster of equivalent hit-die and abilities.
If it's purely a mental exercise there isn't much to advise, really. The +CR is only relevant when attempting to balance encounters for a stronger party. Go nuts I guess?
*edit*
A lot of the things you have there can probably be incorporated into the class levels rather than as racial boons: specifically, the skill bonuses and extra constitution can probably just come from level ups if they are meant to represent his toughness and knowledgability. That's 6 points saved already, if you do want to bring the concept down to a playable level. As it stands this race is not viable for a standard game, but looks fine if you ended up playing a high-powered campaign where everyone was a powerful outsider.
Yes, it is mostly for fun that I even did this. I like taking my characters from roleplays and stories and then grounding them in some systems rules. I once took a team of teenagers with elemental powers and martial skills from a fantasy story of mine and built them sans powers in SoulCaliburIV. That said, half the fun is making sure that it works and fits in the system.
Hmm...Yeah, I can see losing the Con, especially being half-undead and all. I also admit that those knowledge bonuses were a pain when giving the samples their skill ranks. Didn't feel right to have them and not use them, but not really need them.
Now I'm somewhat questioning the Bite and the Fleet-Footed. Being part fiend part vampire, Bite is a no-brainer, though I could reduce it by 1rp to deal 1d3. Fleet-Footed grants a boost to Initiative as well as a 5x run speed that retains Dex bonus to AC. But would that come from his foul origins or his training...?
My first approach would be to find a race already printed that is close, and modify that. Just from a glance and going off the top of my head, the Dhampir might be close enough for you to start with. Perhaps swap some abilities around with the Tiefling?
And remember, in Pathfinder its popular to not give any single character of a given race everything the race is capable of. Look at the Tiefling, the Catfolk, and the Tengu. All can have claws, but none have them as a default, they have to trade racial abilities to get them. You might want to do that as well.
Look at the race you are building, and decide what you think every single default member of the race ever born would likely have, and then what fewer members of the race would have. The ones in the first category are your default racials. The others are your substitution abilities.
You can save massive amounts of points that way!
Type: Outsider (native, half-undead) [8rp]
Size: Medium [0rp]
Base Speed: Normal [0rp]
Ability Score Modifier: Flexible (+2 STR, +2 DEX) [2rp]
Language: Standard [0rp]
Subtotal = 10rp
Senses: Darkvision 60ft. [-]
Low-Light Vision [1rp]
Weakness: Negative Energy Affinity [-]
Defense: Resist Level Drain [-]
Undead Resistance [-]
Fiendish Resistance [3rp]
Dual-Minded [1rp]
Offense: Bite (1d3) [1rp]
Magical: Fell Magic [3rp]
Fiendish Sorcery (Tiefling version, Infernal only) [1rp]
Total = 20rp
Much more streamlined than even my original streamlining. This is why I like to ask for people's opinions about my work, so that I can experience different angles and perspectives. Thanks for the help!
But it still makes me wonder about the Trox. What is it that makes them so powerful that their CR is +2?
Trox are Large. That's why their math goes nuts.
If you took some of the superfluous traits from your race (energy resistance, dual minded, fell magic) you could have a balanced PC race.
Since it is meant to be more monstrous than typical humans, I think I'll settle with the 20rp version. Thanks a lot for your help, folks, this is definitely a lot more down to earth than 51rp or 30rp. And now I understand more about trimming the fat as well as the CR modifications of Trox and Svirfniben.
Your flavor can lead to anything you want, but typically in Pathfinder, creatures that are part undead have a constitution penalty. That's not a hard rule, but it does seem to be a theme. Ignore it if you want to.
It may not seem like much, but that is part of the reason I got rid of the advanced constitution +2 trait. I figure any further decrease to constitution is made up for by the powerful blood of Asmodeus.