Evil characters


Pathfinder First Edition General Discussion


So we are playing Way of the wicked and we've all noticed something.

While it's true we are evil we're LESS brutal than your average pathfinder group because we're outnumbered and outgunned by the good guys.

While we're unquestionably evil (necromancer, worshiper of belial, and an antipaladin are among our group) and we've performed seriously evil acts (Killing children, dogs, and enslaving others) sometimes it makes me curious how much more evil than ordinary pathfinders.

As a second point Evil feels so much fun to play since moral quandaries give way to a simple violent answer to any question that can be solved by "Kill it"

Grand Lodge

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Nothing matches the depravity of the Murder Hobo Pathfinders. Evil has goals. Pathfinders pursue prestige points.


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Terry Pratchett wrote:
Something Vimes had learned as a young guard drifted up from memory. If you have to look along the shaft of an arrow from the wrong end, if a man has you entirely at his mercy, then hope like hell that man is an evil man. Because the evil like power, power over people, and they want to see you in fear. They want you to know you're going to die. So they'll talk. They'll gloat. They'll watch you squirm. They'll put off the moment of murder like another man will put off a good cigar. So hope like hell your captor is an evil man. A good man will kill you with hardly a word.


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Undone wrote:
As a second point Evil feels so much fun to play since moral quandaries give way to a simple violent answer to any question that can be solved by "Kill it"

Violence isn't the answer, it's the question. The answer is YES!


I'd be the first to admit that it's REALLY fun to put on the black hat as a PC every once in a while. That being said, as an evil character, I tend to follow one simple bit of advice I got from a WotC villain thing for D&D. The advice was pretty much along the lines of "Yes, you can be as much of an ass to other people as you want. But you will want at least one spot where people don't think you're a vile bastard." This has somewhat colored the evil characters I've done on the few occasions I'm not the DM.

For example, back in 3.5, I played a NE Warblade. He was more or less an assassin, one who found the idea of people paying him to do something he would probably gladly do anyways fascinating. However, he also made sure to donate a good chunk of his payment to one particular orphanage. Why? Simple: That's where he grew up, and he felt that for giving him the chance to live the dream, helping them pinch together a good lifestyle for other kids like him was the least he could do.

And then there was Morkeal von Schnittner, Professor of Necromancy. No moral compass, but he did have standards. For example, he would never create intelligent undead, and actually hated them overall. This was mostly due to the fact that mindless undead are far easier to control, and thus make unquestioning servants, but still. He also never bothered with re-animating humanoids, simply because they resulted in inferior products. And most of the coin he earned adventuring went towards his department, to ensure that his students would have the supplies they needed to continue their experiments. Granted, this was only because the grant-givers started having complaints about "ethical concerns of creating undead" and "making a mockery of the natural order," as well as one or two mysteriously disappearing when they attempted to shut his department down.

But in the end... Even the good characters in the parties with these guys weren't too different in the end. Hell, the party Morkeal was in had a marvelous relationship with him, and eventually aided him with his goals. Even contributed gold at times. The Warblade's orphanage also had its fair share of contributions from the party, even if they greatly disapproved of his wholesale slaughter at times.

Shadow Lodge

Simple answer "kill it"?
That's too kind and nice . . .
Ever head of "to the pain". . That's how we'll start..
And killing sends them to Pharasma's Court first, I prefer to skip that and take them straight to Hell, or the Abyss. Can't really decide. Abaddon is also an option.
Hmm, I've got some really good ideas for my private shadow demi-plane. . .

And you shouldn't really compare evil PC's and PFS Pathfinders.
They are both motivated by evil. There's just limits on how much you can show.

Dark Archive

Yeah, your brand of evil isn't all that bad. Really evil is when you force someone's soul into a puppet you control and then make them kill everyone they love slowly, afterwards putting them back into their body and making them immortal so that they have to live with the suffering forever. Then you check up on them regularly, if they ever feel any joy, you make sure to build it up and destroy it to the point that they try to kill themselves and others for the tiny bit of power it gives them for eternity.


Helcack wrote:
Yeah, your brand of evil isn't all that bad. Really evil is when you force someone's soul into a puppet you control and then make them kill everyone they love slowly, afterwards putting them back into their body and making them immortal so that they have to live with the suffering forever. Then you check up on them regularly, if they ever feel any joy, you make sure to build it up and destroy it to the point that they try to kill themselves and others for the tiny bit of power it gives them for eternity.

I intend to buy the daemon summoning ring and make soul gem cookies which get condemned directly to hell. I assure you only murder hobos are eviler.


Helcack wrote:
Yeah, your brand of evil isn't all that bad. Really evil is when you force someone's soul into a puppet you control and then make them kill everyone they love slowly, afterwards putting them back into their body and making them immortal so that they have to live with the suffering forever. Then you check up on them regularly, if they ever feel any joy, you make sure to build it up and destroy it to the point that they try to kill themselves and others for the tiny bit of power it gives them for eternity.

I like to steal an idea I saw in Order of the Stick: Inscribe Symbol of Insanity on a rubber ball, toss it into a room full of good characters, and wait for the inevitable.

My last evil character actually got the paladin opposing him to admit it's pretty funny.


Undone wrote:

So we are playing Way of the wicked and we've all noticed something.

While it's true we are evil we're LESS brutal than your average pathfinder group because we're outnumbered and outgunned by the good guys.

While we're unquestionably evil (necromancer, worshiper of belial, and an antipaladin are among our group) and we've performed seriously evil acts (Killing children, dogs, and enslaving others) sometimes it makes me curious how much more evil than ordinary pathfinders.

As a second point Evil feels so much fun to play since moral quandaries give way to a simple violent answer to any question that can be solved by "Kill it"

Your statement regarding 'average pathfinder group' is purely anecdotal. Unless you have some hard facts and numbers to support that statement, of course, your view of an 'average group' is based solely on your personal observations.

I can state, unequivocably, that your group is FAR more evil than any I've participated in since I got out of junior high school.


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The best villains don't think they're villains.


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What's the most basic motivation for an adventurer?

Beer, Babes, and butt-loads of treasure.

That's my personal experience. Add in the fact that most adenturing parties will use very questionable means to obtain them?

Yeah, I'd rather be a card-carrying villain than a murderhobo. I've got standards after all.


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if i had a choice of playing a Murderhobo or playing a highly depraved and self centered character who actually has an in character reason to justify their self centered depravity, i would rather play the self centered character with a legitimate backstory event that led to their depravity, and it won't be something like "this highly specific race killed my parents". not that the character won't be a vagrant or won't have irrational reasons for their depravity, i'm rather play a night elf exile who follows a depraved variation of the teachings of Charles Darwin and seeks to be the best predator she can be than play another mountain dwarf in plate with an Axe and Shield


Zhayne wrote:
Undone wrote:

So we are playing Way of the wicked and we've all noticed something.

While it's true we are evil we're LESS brutal than your average pathfinder group because we're outnumbered and outgunned by the good guys.

While we're unquestionably evil (necromancer, worshiper of belial, and an antipaladin are among our group) and we've performed seriously evil acts (Killing children, dogs, and enslaving others) sometimes it makes me curious how much more evil than ordinary pathfinders.

As a second point Evil feels so much fun to play since moral quandaries give way to a simple violent answer to any question that can be solved by "Kill it"

Your statement regarding 'average pathfinder group' is purely anecdotal. Unless you have some hard facts and numbers to support that statement, of course, your view of an 'average group' is based solely on your personal observations.

I can state, unequivocably, that your group is FAR more evil than any I've participated in since I got out of junior high school.

One of the most common plot hooks in pathfinder is you are going to rob this grave... FOR SCIENCE! Regular "Good" groups tend to do horribly evil things. While I admit we're likely more evil it doesn't feel that way in game. When you kill a kid it feels evil as evil, when you kill a pair of lawful good guards just trying to get you out of somewhere you shouldn't be but have to be for your quest it's still not a pure evil act(Self defense) but it FEELS evil.

You break into everywhere while maintaining you are "Good".
You rob graves.
You kill anyone who resists.

That's the good guys.


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Undone wrote:
Zhayne wrote:
Undone wrote:

So we are playing Way of the wicked and we've all noticed something.

While it's true we are evil we're LESS brutal than your average pathfinder group because we're outnumbered and outgunned by the good guys.

While we're unquestionably evil (necromancer, worshiper of belial, and an antipaladin are among our group) and we've performed seriously evil acts (Killing children, dogs, and enslaving others) sometimes it makes me curious how much more evil than ordinary pathfinders.

As a second point Evil feels so much fun to play since moral quandaries give way to a simple violent answer to any question that can be solved by "Kill it"

Your statement regarding 'average pathfinder group' is purely anecdotal. Unless you have some hard facts and numbers to support that statement, of course, your view of an 'average group' is based solely on your personal observations.

I can state, unequivocably, that your group is FAR more evil than any I've participated in since I got out of junior high school.

One of the most common plot hooks in pathfinder is you are going to rob this grave... FOR SCIENCE! Regular "Good" groups tend to do horribly evil things. While I admit we're likely more evil it doesn't feel that way in game. When you kill a kid it feels evil as evil, when you kill a pair of lawful good guards just trying to get you out of somewhere you shouldn't be but have to be for your quest it's still not a pure evil act(Self defense) but it FEELS evil.

You break into everywhere while maintaining you are "Good".
You rob graves.
You kill anyone who resists.

That's the good guys.

sounds about right, makes it a lot harder to tell the good guys apart from a depraved tyrant like Caligula. when the heroes and the villains slaughter any resistance and even resort to murder to avoid prosecution, you really can't tell them apart

lots of PCs have been known to slaughter entire hordes of city guardsman and entire noble families as a means to silence those who would dare prosecute them.

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