Spell Combat while mounted?


Rules Questions

Grand Lodge

Under mounted combat, the PRD says: wrote:


If your mount moves more than 5 feet, you can only make a single melee attack. Essentially, you have to wait until the mount gets to your enemy before attacking, so you can't make a full attack.

Can I use Spell Combat while mounted (as a full round action) to cast a spell on myself or my mount, then have my mount move, then make a melee attack?

I suppose there's a broader question about Full Round actions, and whether this is supposed to preclude, say a two-weapon fighter from doing a full attack action, using their first attack to throw a weapon, and their second as a melee attack, or something similar.

I'm thinking about a goat-riding halfling Eldritch Scion.


Markov Spiked Chain wrote:
Under mounted combat, the PRD says: wrote:


If your mount moves more than 5 feet, you can only make a single melee attack. Essentially, you have to wait until the mount gets to your enemy before attacking, so you can't make a full attack.

Can I use Spell Combat while mounted (as a full round action) to cast a spell on myself or my mount, then have my mount move, then make a melee attack?

I suppose there's a broader question about Full Round actions, and whether this is supposed to preclude, say a two-weapon fighter from doing a full attack action, using their first attack to throw a weapon, and their second as a melee attack, or something similar.

I'm thinking about a goat-riding halfling Eldritch Scion.

This

PRD wrote:


...so you can't make a full attack.

would definitely not allow

Quote:


...a two-weapon fighter from doing a full attack action.

as two weapon fighting can only be done as a full attack.

And while spell combat is not a 'full attack action' it is so similar to it that RAI on this is certainly that you cannot use spell combat if your mount moves more than 5'.

Scarab Sages

Yeah, the FAQs and rules for Spell Combat even specifically refer to how it's essentially TWF with a spell in your off-hand. Since you couldn't TWF from the back of a mount that moved more than 5 feet, I'd be inclined to say Spell Combat is out too.

If you're going to allow it though, there are some balancing checks like the Concentration checks for casting a spell from the back of a moving mount, the necessary Ride checks, etc., so it's not going to be game-breaking either way.

Grand Lodge

PRD says wrote:
You can make a full attack with a ranged weapon while your mount is moving. Likewise, you can take move actions normally.

It's clearly not a blanket ban on the full attack action. The explanatory line about having to wait until the mount gets there shouldn't (conceptually) limit spell casting on targets that are clearly in range the whole time (self, mount), I would think.


Markov Spiked Chain wrote:
PRD says wrote:
You can make a full attack with a ranged weapon while your mount is moving. Likewise, you can take move actions normally.
It's clearly not a blanket ban on the full attack action. The explanatory line about having to wait until the mount gets there shouldn't (conceptually) limit spell casting on targets that are clearly in range the whole time (self, mount), I would think.

If your mount moves more than 5 feet, you can only make a single melee attack. The rule here is talking about melee. Spell combat is melee so it's affected by the rule. Ranged weapons are not melee, so they are exempt from this rule.


Spell combat is not necessarily melee combat but an entirely different thing altogether. My own wizard is far more likely in fact to be using a ranged touch attack, than a melee attack (even a melee touch attack) if he is even using a spell requiring an attack roll of any kind.

Then there is this (from the section on Concentration CRB, bolded parts my doing):

Vigorous motion while casting...........10 + spell level
Violent motion while casting............15 + spell level
Extremely violent motion while casting..20 + spell level

And:

Vigorous Motion: If you are riding on a moving mount, taking a bouncy ride in a wagon, on a small boat in rough water, belowdecks in a storm-tossed ship, or simply being jostled in a similar fashion, you must make a concentration check (DC 10 + the level of the spell you're casting) or lose the spell.

Violent Motion: If you are on a galloping horse, taking a very rough ride in a wagon, on a small boat in rapids or in a storm, on deck in a storm-tossed ship, or being pitched roughly about in a similar fashion, you must make a concentration check (DC 15 + the level of the spell you're casting) or lose the spell. If the motion is extremely violent, such as that caused by an earthquake, the DC is equal to 20 + the level of the spell you're casting.

And I'd tack on any damage occurring while casting i.e. Violent Motion = 15 + spell level + damage dealt (plus other mods as appropriate - Wind, Rain, Dust, Defensive Casting etc.)

And this doesn't even touch on the whether the target is in Range the whole time or even visible a certain amount of time (Did you just ride around or through the Barn, House or Inn)

Personally I'd be tempted to house rule it along the break lines of mounted combat as well i.e Move, Double Move and Run/Gallop (Vigorous, Violent and Extremely Violent).


@Kayerloth

He's not talking about spell combat as in fighting with spells.
He's talking about the magus' spell combat

Spell Combat (Ex)
At 1st level, a magus learns to cast spells and wield his weapons at the same time. This functions much like two-weapon fighting, but the off-hand weapon is a spell that is being cast. To use this ability, the magus must have one hand free (even if the spell being cast does not have somatic components), while wielding a light or one-handed melee weapon in the other hand. As a full-round action, he can make all of his attacks with his melee weapon at a –2 penalty and can also cast any spell from the magus spell list with a casting time of 1 standard action (any attack roll made as part of this spell also takes this penalty). If he casts this spell defensively, he can decide to take an additional penalty on his attack rolls, up to his Intelligence bonus, and add the same amount as a circumstance bonus on his concentration check. If the check fails, the spell is wasted, but the attacks still take the penalty. A magus can choose to cast the spell first or make the weapon attacks first, but if he has more than one attack, he cannot cast the spell between weapon attacks.

So good effort trying to help, but you're a bit off from the topic at hand. Eldritch Scion is a new magus archetype.


Ahh my bad then, please continue :)

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