I know crafting is restricted in PFS. But to what extent?
Can a PFS character craft a club, quarterstaff, stingchuck or other 0 gp item? If so, does he retain it after the scenario?
Crafting of any type is not allowed, unless it is specifically stated otherwise. An alchemist is allowed to craft alchemical items and poisons. And you are able to upgrade an arcane bonded item. But as far as I'm aware, that is all that's allowed.
http://paizo.com/paizo/faq/v5748nruor1fq
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Well. There is a scenario where you can craft a weapon. And I think there is another where you can repair some armor. And I know craft cooking and bookbinder and a few others come up from time to time. But no, aside from the exceptions stated above, you can not. However, you could just buy the items, and say in character that they are items you crafted. And as long as you derive no mechanical benefit from it, probably no one will care.
for example, one of my characters has a portable alter to groetus. Ooc, I bought it. IC, it is largely made up of items he has scavenged for abandoned shrines that he has "rededicated" to be sites of groetus worship. (including a certain former temple of groetus in the cairn lands that he has reclaimed, rededicated, and is now his temple vanity... )
This saddens me. A guy should be able to craft a zero cost item. How does it break the game if I sharpen a wooden stake? Or polish up a Varisian slugger (club)?
I shouldn't have to justify why I'd like to craft a zero go item for PFS. The question is, why is this not allowed?
I would like an official answer to this, not mere speculation.
As an aside, per crafting rules, it takes virtually no time at all to craft a zero gp item. Fearspect, your 1 wk estimate is incorrect.
What is the game mechanical difference between an item you made and one you bought for zero GP? If there is no difference, why not buy it for zero GP and say that you made it yourself?
The problem is in mechanics, rather than flavor. If you can craft weapons with a skill, then you can craft things greater than 0 gp by mechanics.
Since a player could just leave for another table somewhere else, the character sheet should not contain abilities that could mechanically be used as some sort of gold farming scheme (it is my impression that crafting referred to magical item crafting feats, I could be wrong)?
David Knott 242's answer seems to be the best compromise.
As an aside, per crafting rules, it takes virtually no time at all to craft a zero gp item. Fearspect, your 1 wk estimate is incorrect.
Actually, no it is not. By default, Craft checks are done by the week. At best, it still takes a day if you use the Progress by the Day rules.
Even if you have +1 billion in a Craft check, it still takes a minimum of 1 day to make something.
Action: Does not apply. Craft checks are made by the day or week (see above).
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Actually, no it is not. By default, Craft checks are done by the week. At best, it still takes a day if you use the Progress by the Day rules.
Even if you have +1 billion in a Craft check, it still takes a minimum of 1 day to make something.
This^. It's unreasonable to ask people at the table to wait on you as you spend minimum a day, possibly more to create your items. And I wouldn't expect an official response on this. The rule's pretty clear cut, no crafting; there's nothing to be misinterpreted there.
EDIT: Okay, did some looking and maybe it's not as clear cut as I remember. Doesn't mention craft skill but bans crafting feats. Still wouldn't expect an official response though.
I disagree. Craft check (arbitrarily say 15) X DC 12 for a simple weapon = 180 sp production a week. 180 sp is equivalent to how many 0 gp clubs? You can't answer, because it's a divide by zero. But if we were to find a close equivalent, a club studded with a penny, we could then determine that weeks production made 1800 clubs studded with pennies. 1800 / 40 hr work week = 45 CSwP an hour, or a little more than a minute each. Honestly, this is simple algebra people. There is no statement within the Craft skill as to minimum time. If you infer one, you've just put basket weavers and candle makers out of business, as they can only make one a day by that (il) logic.
But nevermind all that. It isn't relevant. Let's take the time sink argument out of it.
Much as the alchemist crafts his acid between sessions, why can a druid not craft his quarter staff, wooden stake or club between sessions?
I don't want repeated "You can't do that." I don't want "What's the difference?" Please tell me why it isn't allowed. If a tracker can tell me, "Hey, rust monsters live here. Or rust - happy hippie druids live here." WE SHOULD BE ABLE TO WEAPONIZE A STICK IN ONE MINUTE WITHOUT GIVING YOUR DM A STROKE AND BEING ASKED TO SIT AT THE TABLE OF WRONGFUN BECAUSE YOU REFUSE TO RUN THE PREORDAINED GAUNTLET OF PFS MODULE WRITING JOLLIES.
Speaking of strokes... I'm a go lie down now and pick my nails with a sliver of wood I just crafted in 10 seconds.
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ZenithTN: Please do not try and argue against the rules of the campaign.
PFS does NOT allow crafting in general. There are a few, very few, specific instances where crafting is allowed, but those are clearly spelled out and demarcated.
Crafting zero GP items is NOT in the allowed area for crafting for PFS, so it cannot be done.
So, a Druid cannot craft a club between sessions in PFS because it is disallowed by the Organized Play campaign rules.
To be honest, as a GM in a home game, if I had a player coming in with an attitude like the one demonstrated by the whining posts, "Why can't I do this?" and not accepting my statement that it is not allowed, you would get kicked from my table.
So, in the end, it isn't allowed BECAUSE the PFS OP rules say it isn't allowed. You cvan come up with your own reasons behind it, but the simplest one is the slippery slope one, where you then get the "If I can craft a club with my ranks in Craft (Weapon), why can't I craft a Greatsword? It is the same skill!"
Also note, most PFS GMs, in my experience, will let you either "pick up a club" on the way into the dungeon, or will hand wave your having purchased a zero cost item before you left town.
Items you could pick up for free, and should always have in your inventory until you can afford better:
Club or quarterstaff (B for skeletons, depending on PC strength)
Sling and sling stones (everyone should have some sort of ranged option)
Just mark it, you can always claim, if it doesn't eat up game time, that you made it yourself.
But don't be a jerk about it.
Kinevon, with respect, who are you?
I asked for an official reply, albeit in my third post.
As for slippery slope, they voided that defense when they allowed any crafting at all. PFS thinks acid, 10 gp, power component, splash weapon that benefits from an alchemists intelligence is fine to craft (and I do not disagree). I don't think it is an unreasonable bone to throw us, if they can find a minute to craft said bone club. I just don't think they thought about no cost items. So I tabled the question, only to be answered by nine undocumented, well intentioned board patrons.
I disagree. Craft check (arbitrarily say 15) X DC 12 for a simple weapon = 180 sp production a week. 180 sp is equivalent to how many 0 gp clubs? You can't answer, because it's a divide by zero. But if we were to find a close equivalent, a club studded with a penny, we could then determine that weeks production made 1800 clubs studded with pennies. 1800 / 40 hr work week = 45 CSwP an hour, or a little more than a minute each. Honestly, this is simple algebra people. There is no statement within the Craft skill as to minimum time. If you infer one, you've just put basket weavers and candle makers out of business, as they can only make one a day by that (il) logic.
Please tell me where it says the Craft skill can make more than one item at once? You can't. Because as written, you can only make one item at a time.
And there is a minimum time of 1 day, because that is all the Craft skill allows. There is no such thing as crafting by the hour, minute, or round. The minimum time is by the day. You will notice there is absolutely nothing in the skill about Progress by the Hour. The only thing you will find is Progress by the Day.
All skills have an Action section, detailing how long it takes to make a check. You will notice the Craft skill only mentions a week and a day. Not a hour, not a minute. Therefore, Craft checks take a minimum of one days time.
Does it make sense? No. But the Craft skill never has. Yet it has stayed unchanged for almost 15 years now, since 3.0 D&D. Why? Because when it comes down to it, no one cares about mundane crafting. Seriously. The game is about murder-hobos killing things for their shinies. It is not meant to simulate dung farmers or candle makers.
I know crafting is restricted in PFS. But to what extent?
Can a PFS character craft a club, quarterstaff, stingchuck or other 0 gp item? If so, does he retain it after the scenario?
I don't see any mechanical difference it would make if you bought it from a shop for zero GP or just picked something up and started whittling.
The answer to your question is "because that is the rule". Many rules are arbitrary. There is no particular reason we roll a d20 for attacks. There is no particular reason that you can't pick up the soccer ball and throw it into the net. There is no particular reason there are 3 bases in baseball. There is no particular reason a bishop may only move diagonally in chess.
When you play a game, you agree to submit yourself to the rules. It really is that simple. To require that an official justify the rules in detail to you on an individual basis is not a reasonable requirement for cooperative gameplay. You've been terribly spoiled if you're accustomed to such treatment and you're bound to be disappointed soon.
Since what you want to do can be handled by narrative alone, I think many of us are confounded why you are so unhappy with the mechanics of the situation.
Because its a rule is a horrible answer.
The thing is they don't want to say that there is X amount of time in between scenarios. Its just confusing. Because there is a variable amount of time in between scenarios, how much crafting you do is also variable and indeterminate. Without knowing that amount of time, they don't know how much money you made. Otherwise a cheeseball player (and there are a LOT of them) could just say "Oh yeah I'm an elf I spent the 100 years before this session crafting my adamantine elven curved blade ... so i get it at 1/3 the cost"
The mechanical difference is wanting a sling, club, stake, etc., when there is no store available. "Skeletons live here guys. Anyone bring a blunt weapon?" "No, but I have an axe. We could make one from yonder tree." "No way man. That's just crazy talk."
Loved your last paragraph, Jeraa.
And it IS a horrible answer, BNW.
Ah, it makes some sense in that context ZenithTN. It sounded like you were talking about downtime crafting.
Sling has zero cost. Fine. 5 minutes later one adventurer is going without a loincloth and the party has 5 slings. Problem solved.