Hey guys. Just wanted to ask the community this question... I'm mostly a GM and haven't worked with monks from a players perspective before.
I'm trying to build a powerful brawler monk who can get into big fights with a high AC and big damage and just have fun.
I've built the monk with high stats in dexterity, wisdom, and strength, and have classes him as a Flowing Qinggong Monk and Master of Many Styles. The Flowing archetype makes me dangerously evasive up close and capable of redirecting attacks against themselves, and the Qinggong will allow me to pick up helpful ki powers like Bark-Skin and stuff. The styles will allow me to get Snapping Turtle, Panther style, and maybe Tiger later or Snake.
So my evasion will probably be really high, but what do I do about damage? I like being super hard to hit in the middle of a fight, but I also want to be dishing out lots of damage, not just tripping people left and right.
The unarmed strike damage frustrates me because I can't really scale it with magic enhancement. I've never really been able to test how well it scales naturally without any enhancement, and I don't want to use weapons because deadly little hands are totally awesome. Are there ways to boost the damage over time with feats or something?
Thanks.
you need to realize two things. first you can do good damage as a monk or defense not both.
secondly the archetypes you picked dont fit thebrawler description. you really need to focus on flurry if you want to brawl.
Any suggestions? Rather then hard hitting, should I just focus on making her good at keeping people down with trips and falls, doing what little damage I can, allowing my teammates to do the real damage while I keep the enemies occupied?
I guess I'd like to know what styles, qinggong powers, feats and items go well with the flowing monk archetype. I want to be able to hold my own in the middle of fight with a lot of critters, keeping them occupied while doing what I can. I know flanking is an issue, I was also wondering if there was a way to overcome that as a monk...
Wait, I just realized you probably can't be a Monk of Many Styles and a Flowing monk might not stack... this gets complicated. :/
yeah if you want to brawl strength is your primry stat. anything that keeps flurry with a good strngth will hit hard.
if you want to do controll flowing monk or mms can be good but be aware if your teams makeup isnt right control monk can just slow the game if over all dps is low.
i have no experience with mms.
try martial artist or any monk that keeps flurry pick one combat maneuver to be good at and either dragon style or tiger style or both if a mms.
dragon style lets you do more daage and tiger can move the penalty to pa from to hit to ac.
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First thing's first; You cannot combine MoMS and Flowing. They both attempt to alter your Bonus Feats. You must pick one or the other. Qinggong I believe stacks with either of those two though. I thought this earlier today as well, and MAN it would be quite a superior Archetype combination for Monks. /sigh
I'm going to suggest to you.. a pretty weird build. It really optimizes the Monk's Movement on the Battlfield, Full Attacks, AoOs, Defenses, Control, and Damage if you wish.
I recommend Dex as a primary stat, Wis as a secondary, and Int as a tertiary.
This is a Qinggong-Flowing Monk 17, Urban Druid 1(Charm Domain), Wizard 1, and Unarmed Fighter 1.
FEATS -> Class Abilities -> Bonus Feat(format)
LvL 1 Weapon Finesse -> IUS, FoB, Redirection -> Combat Reflexes
LvL 2 xxxx -> Evasion -> Unbalancing Counter
LvL 3 Punishing Kick -> Improved Unarmed Strike(Fighter) -> Snake Style
LvL 4 xxxx -> Aura, Channel Positive Energy 1d6, Domains, Orisons(Cleric) -> xxxx
LvL 5 Stunning Fist -> Arcane Bond, Arcane School, Cantrips, Scribe Scroll(Wizard) -> xxxx
LvL 6 xxxx -> Flowing Dodge, maneuver Training, Still Mind -> xxxx
LvL 7 Snake Sidewind -> Ki Pool(Magic), Barkskin -> xxxx
LvL 8 xxxx -> Elusive Target(Basic), Ki Stand -> xxxx
LvL 9 Snake Fang -> xxxx -> Improved Trip
LvL 10 xxxx -> Ki Pool(Cold Iron/Silver), Power Attack -> xxxx
LvL 11 Dimensional Agility -> xxxx -> xxxx
LvL 12 xxxx -> Improved Evasion -> xxxx
LvL 13 Dimensional Assault -> Ki Pool(Lawful) -> Improved Reposition
LvL 14 xxxx -> Elusive Target(Advanced) -> xxxx
LvL 15 Dimensional Dervish -> Abundant Step -> xxxx
LvL 16 xxxx -> Diamond Soul -> xxxx
LvL 17 Dimensional Savant -> xxxx -> Ki Throw
LvL 18 xxxx -> Volley -> xxxx
LvL 19 Outflank -> Ki Pool(Adamantite) -> xxxx
LvL 20 xxxx -> Diamond Body, Quivering Palm -> xxxx
Feel free to ask questions! This is still a work in progress for me.
I played a Monk in a homebrew game, about 3 and a half years ago. I started as 16 14 14 10 14 10 (Human, 20 pt buy playing with people who either dont optimize well, or possibly a learning disability) I focused all my points in strength and used the Temple sword and was the weapon master Archetype.
at lvl 10 the char had str 18(20 with belt) dex 14 (16 from the same belt) con 14 wis 14 (16 with headband) this char was made before the current rules with an heirloom weapon so
Heirloom Temple sword +2 +16 1d8 +9 (+14 1d8+15 pa)
Flurried for +17/17/12/12/7 and could also Grapple and Trip. This character was made before i had a real understanding of rhe rules and they have added alot of new stuff for monks since (in addition to heirloom weapon no longer being stupidly strong)
IF i were to do a gets in and brawls character, i would look at Martial artist and then pick a combat style depending on wether i wanted better stunning fists or punching harder.
I'd either play a Martial Artist, a Master of Many Styles 2/Brawler (Fighter Archetype) X, or a Brawler (Advanced Class Guide playtest class).
Wow. Raijin, your Monk is so crazy! I love it. Thanks for the advice guys.
I've decided flowing monk is not what I want. My monk's theme has changed now to a more fire/tiger themed guarded brawler who can both boost AC while dishing out the occasional hard hit. I couldn't combine mm with flowing, so decided instead to do a monk of the four winds with mm and qinggong. I now am going for an efreeti fire style build combined with the crane style and focusing on a careful balance between hard hitting fire attacks with true strike and high AC with crane style and barkskin. I think that about gets me to where I'm going, and I'm pretty powerful at the early levels. Any style suggestions after I get the crane and efreeti styles mostly done?
I never thought of the Qinggong Flowing Monk/Druid hybrid. Sounds pretty boss.
Any more suggestions are welcomed. Thanks for you help guys.
Is there a viable build for a Monk of the Four Winds? I really liked thematically a Monk who uses fists of fire, who eventually adopts the aspect of the tiger... :/
Perhaps rather then grab MOM I just be a Master of the Four Winds, and pick up the Crane Style Feat manually early on, then also add in the Qinggong monk part for the barkskin and other cool abilities. That way I continue to maintain my Flurry of Blows, but also get the strong fire strikes, and the evasive abilities of the crane style.
The thing ive said recently in a few posts about is this. Any monk can be viable (well, honestly the one with the healing power that whipes you out of existance perthaps not so much) The key thing is to understand what the class can actually DO, accept what it cannot do and not try to do two many things at once.
So first decice, are you going to be a mystic unhttable wuxia guy that twists people by their pinkies so your much burlier friend can pummel them. Or are you going to smash face. Do not try to do both Unhittable and face smashing.
The role of these two that you choose basically determines your stats. If you want to smash face as a monk then STRENGTH is your primary stat i emphasise this because alot of people do not seem to grasp this.
You currently cannot make bruce lee, so do not try. The class is not and was never designed for this.
But a monk can easily finish any paizo AP without having to dump any stats bellow 8 with no problems provided you have good tactics and a clear idea of how to apply the niche you want to do.
Alright. Thanks Mojorat. I think I want to smash face. Is there a way to do that with the elemental fists of the Monk of the Four Winds, cause I just wanted to make a fire monk for the roleplaying aspects of it. It fitted into this big story idea I had. There's my GM side coming out. Could I naturally pick up some feats/qinggong powers to compliment a Monk of the Four Winds that would help me smash face?
Perhaps I'll just build a straight up Monk of the Four Winds Qinggong and pick the Efreeti style feats as I go along... Simple and easy, and I can punch people with fire, which is at least pretty cool, if not as effective as stunning fist.
Alright. Thanks Mojorat. I think I want to smash face. Is there a way to do that with the elemental fists of the Monk of the Four Winds, cause I just wanted to make a fire monk for the roleplaying aspects of it. It fitted into this big story idea I had. There's my GM side coming out. Could I naturally pick up some feats/qinggong powers to compliment a Monk of the Four Winds that would help me smash face?
Perhaps I'll just build a straight up Monk of the Four Winds Qinggong and pick the Efreeti style feats as I go along... Simple and easy, and I can punch people with fire, which is at least pretty cool, if not as effective as stunning fist.
First, as a caveat The last monk i played was before a number of the new options. Secondly, the group i play with 50% of the people are not good at the game (Not being mean, simply one is not a gamer and the other likely has a learning disability) this means I can base how well I expect my character to do based on published materials and know the DM wont be upping the power level to challenge a god wizard.
Basically, everything I say needs to be adjusted based on how Well You know your own group.
Really, i dont think monk of the four winds will play too different from a normal Monk in fact, it has a /better/ power in elemental fist in that its more universally useful and less things are resistant.
The last monk I played I did 14 14 14 10 14 10 as my stats then applied all my stat boosts to strength and human bonus to strength.
If you have the best offensive gear your level allows, Your offense should be totally Fine. However, you need to use Maneuvers for your defense. Monks easily qualify for imp grapple and imp trip.
After that, its just understanding where to place your character and When to smash face, when to pinky lock the bad guy or trip him. If you have to move use a combat maneuver, if you can safely full attack then flurry.
even if your monk does not have the best AC, you have some of the best saves in the game and mobility. Working in conjunction with allies means you can easily debilitate enemy squishies.
The highlight for the monk char i already referenced was puting an enemy cleric in a pinky lock after our party witch dispelled his any life shield. I then just choked him out.
When your higher level and your movement starts to hit 50 or 60 feet, you can do things like ready to walk in front of wizards when they cast a spell, then kick them in the hards with the AOO (i realize with four winds it will be less nard kicking an dmore flaming kicks but it holds hte same)
There is one area i cant give too much advice on, though i'll broach it because the potential looks interesting with four winds.
Some of the style feats, seem to offer options like blowing elemental fist or stunning fist to do cones and such. It looks interesting for an idea and might give you more combat options. But ive never actually used it in a game and I dont know if the damage is worth the investment. However you can for example get your wisdom added to any elemental damaged used when your in one of the stances.
Without having her be a monk of the four winds how am I supposed to get the elemental fists feat till way later? Its not free from the prerequisites in the Master of the Many styles path. Maybe I should just ask my GM if I can have it...
Again, I've decided I just want to smash face but with fire fists. The only way it seems to get elemental fists early on is to be a Monk of the Four Winds.
Oh, and its a her. ;) Got a really cool backstory all worked out.
Again, thanks for the help guys. I'm doing a lot of research on my own but its great having the second and third opinions. This will be the first time I've played in a while rather than be a GM. Also, I will be starting out on level 1.
Wait a minute, I think you could combine: Monk of the Four Winds, Master of Many styles, Monk of the Sacred Mountain, and Drunken Master all into one... O_o
I need to look into that.
Thanks Mojorat. That was kinda along the lines I was thinking. And I have really smart group of people to play with. They are super clever at figuring the best way to handle just about any situation. I've been their GM for sometime and they almost always think of some way to get out of a situation neither I nor the books thought of. Its a lot of fun.
I gotta look into this 4 archetype thing I mentioned above though, probably not viable, but it still sounds super ridiculously cool.
Without having her be a monk of the four winds how am I supposed to get the elemental fists feat till way later? Its not free from the prerequisites in the Master of the Many styles path. Maybe I should just ask my GM if I can have it...
Again, I've decided I just want to smash face but with fire fists. The only way it seems to get elemental fists early on is to be a Monk of the Four Winds.
Oh, and its a her. ;) Got a really cool backstory all worked out.
Again, thanks for the help guys. I'm doing a lot of research on my own but its great having the second and third opinions. This will be the first time I've played in a while rather than be a GM. Also, I will be starting out on level 1.
Wait a minute, I think you could combine: Monk of the Four Winds, Master of Many styles, Monk of the Sacred Mountain, and Drunken Master all into one... O_o
I need to look into that.
Well as i said, the 'elemental fist to do fancy stuff' bit was just theory craft for me i hadnt looked deeply into the mechanics. That i know of the only way to get the stuff needing elemental fist earlier is either be monk of the four winds or a master of many styles.
the problem with MOMS is if you want to smash face with it i think you really have to do dragon style and tiger style.
Yeah. OK, i'm now considering just going with the Qinggong Monk of the Four Winds, and maybe combining it with Monk of the Sacred Mountain for the extra big AC defense. I can get my fire in, keep my flurry of blows, eventually get the efreeti style feats by taking them naturally, and still have higher AC, a natural Toughness feat, and a constant plus 1 to my AC, which is even higher if I stay put. Basically I can get in to the middle of the fight, and then just stand my ground blasting fire attacks in all directions with flurry of blows. Between high Wisdom, a monk vow, and the extra ki feat, I should have enough ki to still use my time stop ability at the 12 level occasionally, while not having to become a Drunken Master. The Drunkeness doesn't really fit the character, and I want some of those abilities to be open to replace with Qinggong powers.
I think I finally found something I'm happy with. Thanks for all the help guys.
lol. thanks XMorsX. ;)
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The main thing to keep in mind about the build I posted, is it's more about VERY good control. The defense with it is optimal as well, though the damage may or may not keep up with that of let's say... a Fighter built around dpr. Read through the Flowing Monk's abilities very carefully, and look at the feats again.
You have stuns available, dazes, trips, repositions, flat-footing opponents, taking half to zero damage even if you do get hit with your high AC, returning spells to their owner ;), etc. The nice thing, is all of the attack options can be done as part of your Flurry or AoO :) The most important thing, is flat-footing everything and making a daze as a touch attack. This is where Snake Fang comes in, and why it's so important you get that early on. Every time an opponent misses(high ac) you, you get to make an AoO against them. If it hits, you do your damage and they are flat-footed. This really takes advantage of the No Action AoO system. You are not literally the best friend to any class with the Sneak Attack ability(or other precision damage) or anyone that suffers a low attack rating(ironically, yourself included). It REALLY brings a lot to the group, and makes you look hella cool.
If you want my Monk/Druid Flowing/Qinggong/Plant build, let me know. It's... a little intense :)
If you do take the Ginggong monk archetype, there's two or three awesome powers to use. You can sacrifice the ability of your choice for either True Strike and/or Scorching Ray (replacing a power that's available for replacing if you still have it after MoFW) as per the fourth level powers granted by Qinggong, Dragon's Breath/Silk to Steel/Spider Step as 8th level powers as you have abilities to replace them for, Battlemind Link is an interesting teamwork-themed spell as a 12th level power, though at 12th level your party might not need that particular bonus at such a point. As per the 14th level power of the Qinggong powers, BLOOD. CROW. STRIKE. The ability to do your unarmed strike damage through Fob out to 100+ feet away WITHOUT being a Zen Archer? That's freaking sweet for a melee focused monk. That said, the spell of Blood Crow Strike does require one round to cast it, but it can still be a really effective spell to have usable for your monks at any level, well, except maybe the Zen Archer who can hit that range with his arrows... Then again, I think wind wall blocks arrows, so even Zen Archers could occasionally benefit from Blood Crow Strike too.
Cold Ice Strike as a 12th level power could be useful for you as well, since it uses a swift action to cast you could do your FoB for however many attacks you get at 12th level, then cast a Swift Ice Strike on top of that for some extra damage as a ranged attack.
I won't get too much further with my recommendations, as much of them will depend on just how many abilities you have available to sacrifice for the Qinggong powers. I hope these suggestion I've made help you.
As per the 14th level power of the Qinggong powers, BLOOD. CROW. STRIKE. The ability to do your unarmed strike damage through Fob out to 100+ feet away WITHOUT being a Zen Archer? That's freaking sweet for a melee focused monk. That said, the spell of Blood Crow Strike does require one round to cast it, but it can still be a really effective spell to have usable for your monks at any level, well, except maybe the Zen Archer who can hit that range with his arrows... Then again, I think wind wall blocks arrows, so even Zen Archers could occasionally benefit from Blood Crow Strike too.
To be fair, Blood Crow Strike is instantaneous so you FOREVER get to attack them. It doesn't say till end of round.
But no one reads it by RAW, everyone goes by RAI.
Face Smashing Monk build:
Str>dex=con>wis>int>con
Weapon master Fighter 3/ Weapon Adept/Maneuver Master Monk 17
You're too MAD to keep up a good AC without armor so don't even try. Use a mithral breastplate. You can't use flurry of blows so you give that up for a free maneuver attempt every round (I like dirty trick since it is versatile and scales better than trip once you start fighting things with multiple legs)
Weapon training, Gloves of dueling, brawling armor and the bonus feats from weapon adept give you solid bonuses to hit and damage your unarmed strikes and maneuvers.
You can be Str based and pick up dragon style for extra damage or get an agile AOMF and be dex based. Dex based you can pick up the TWF feats and snake style to load up on attacks. I'd also suggest picking up a scaling caster level if possible to get arcane strike for even more damage per strike.
Hey guys. Just wanted to ask the community this question... I'm mostly a GM and haven't worked with monks from a players perspective before.
I'm trying to build a powerful brawler monk who can get into big fights with a high AC and big damage and just have fun.
I've built the monk with high stats in dexterity, wisdom, and strength, and have classes him as a Flowing Qinggong Monk and Master of Many Styles. The Flowing archetype makes me dangerously evasive up close and capable of redirecting attacks against themselves, and the Qinggong will allow me to pick up helpful ki powers like Bark-Skin and stuff. The styles will allow me to get Snapping Turtle, Panther style, and maybe Tiger later or Snake.
So my evasion will probably be really high, but what do I do about damage? I like being super hard to hit in the middle of a fight, but I also want to be dishing out lots of damage, not just tripping people left and right.
The unarmed strike damage frustrates me because I can't really scale it with magic enhancement. I've never really been able to test how well it scales naturally without any enhancement, and I don't want to use weapons because deadly little hands are totally awesome. Are there ways to boost the damage over time with feats or something?
Thanks.
The closest thing to what you want - short of using the new Brawler class instead - is to go for dexterity-focussed built. Get Weapon Finesse and Agile Maneuvers, along with Improved Grapple, and at early levels you can get by grappling a lot of encounters. At the earliest opportunity get an agile amulet of mighty fists, and you will have dex-to-damage as well as to hit with your unarmed strikes.
Do not go master of many styles, it's not so hot because you give up flurry. Instead pick one good style (in the example above, Snake Style works best) and stick with it.
Unarmed strike damage is a red herring unless you can get some buffs like strong jaw and enlarge person on you. Then it can be good, but really the biggest effects on damage are from static bonuses and threat range, and yes, your attacks lack both. However there are one or two things you can do: deliquescent gloves are good, and the sohei build can get a decent boost from weapon training.
At the end of the day, the monk is a weak class (even according to the developers) and it needs a boost. Take a look at my play-tested changes here for some house-rules that bring the monk uop to par if you like.
I'm happy with my fire monk now, but If I wanted to build just a super evasive monk who just cannot take a hit, (so the idea is that he acts as a distraction, tripping and disarming while the other teammates do damage) would snake style be better, or crane style. I would naturally take the Flowing monk Archetype, but then which styles would best fit a super evasive monk. I was thinking he would be untouchable, and good at totally disarming/disabling his opponents.
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I'm happy with my fire monk now, but If I wanted to build just a super evasive monk who just cannot take a hit, (so the idea is that he acts as a distraction, tripping and disarming while the other teammates do damage) would snake style be better, or crane style. I would naturally take the Flowing monk Archetype, but then which styles would best fit a super evasive monk. I was thinking he would be untouchable, and good at totally disarming/disabling his opponents.
That is what the entire build I posted is CENTERED around. Snake Fang is absolutely CRUCIAL to that build. Crane Style is "Meh" at best after the Errata.
Think about it, you can do Trip/Disarm/Sunder in place of an AoO. You can also use Stunning Fist, Punishing Kick, Dazing Touch(if you take the urban druid level with the charm domain I mentioned) via Conductive AoMF, etc. ALL in place of an AoO. What does Snake Fang constantly deliver? AoO EVERY time someone Misses you in melee. Every.Time. Also keep in mind, they become Flat-Footed on top of ANY of that :D!!
The higher your dex, the more attacks you can do. The more attacks, the more things you can do with those attacks. You can switch freely between control and damage - as a Monk was meant to be. Even if they do hit you, after you inflict awful status ailments on them, you now get to use Elusive Target to nullify that damage anyways :) It's a really AWESOME build that took me a year to really pin down(though I started pathfinder a year ago) and get this close to perfection. It screams more Monk than anything.
I would recommend Snake Style/Sidewind/Fang for any and every melee dex/finesse build ever. It's really just tough to fit into any build that is unsure how often it'll be put to use due to their AC - Then tack on the fact that it takes 3 feats to get and the prerequisites... Ouch. though, most Martial classes dip MoMS 1 level to get Snake Style and Snake Fang then go elsewhere.
Wow! Raijin. That's freaken crazy. I had looked at your build earlier but it was kinda hard to pick up on all that. That's awesome! Yeah, didn't realize that a snake build with high enough Sense Motive essentially makes you untouchable, kinda forgot about how you actual role a d20 to avoid the hits ;)
I might forgo the damage parts of the build, because I was thinking of making a thief monk who focuses on never actually doing damage (vow of peace) to his enemies (leave that to the allies) but merely disables them, and runs about wildly stealing stuff, and stealthy creeping about when not fighting.
I wonder if I could substitute some steal feats in there instead... besides tripping and disarming/stunning opponents, I want to be lifting stuff off them constantly, weakening them by removing especially any magical wands or necklaces.
Also, I was thinking of making him a half-elf for that fee skill focus feat at the beginning. a +3 to sense motive would be awesome once he has snake style at level 3.
wow, a lot of those feats you picked I never knew existed. That dimensional savant stuff is sick! Thanks man. I'm definitely using this... but maybe with a few changes. Unfortunately, I really value role playing, and will often sacrifice some optimization for that personality factor. ;)
Actiually, I might forgo the flowing Monk Archtype altogether for MoMS if I don't intend on ever striking opponents for damage to often. A huge part of being a flowing monk is making AoOs, and I don't need my flurry of blows if I'm focusing purely on desables, and I can keep my stunning fist feat If I don't get the flowing archetype.
This would be for a purely disabling, stealing, and untouchable Monk, who pretty much just doesn't do actiual damage at all.
Yeah! with MoMS I could combine Snake style with Mantis Style to both avoid all damage and make my stunning fist more effective. Add that with all the dexterity bonuses by taking Agile Manuvers, and the Qinggong powers, I'll be hard to hit and very good at disables.
Wait.... the snake style dodge only works once per turn... hhhmmmm...
And the free attempts at trip for flowing Monks are very appealing...
I'll have to work on this...
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Of course Contagion, alter as you wish. It is most definitely a great build involving a good bit of system mastery of Pathfinder. I'm all about some Monk.
The Sense motive in the build isn't even a necessity as your defenses, for the most part, will be high enough to rarely be hit(on an 18-20 d20 roll) if you grow your character right. For the most part, you'd have to roll an 18-20 to get your AC any higher than it already is :)
That's fine if you forgo the damage parts of the build as they aren't super necessary, but can be VERY helpful in certain situations. In fact, a Vital Strike build would go great with this(though the feat space is rough, but you don't need the Dimensional feats if you're giving up your Flurry, and that would give you the feat space needed for Vital Strike, Improved VS and Greater VS). I'm not sure you'll be able to fit in greater VS though due to the BAB not quite reaching 16+.
Anyways.
If you mean Rogue when you say Thief, Flowing would work even better because you'd nearly always deal your sneak attack damage(because your foes would end up flatfooted from your AoOs that they just keep provoking). That's up to you though. You can also keep stunning fist down the road, on top of the flowing options. Just take it as a feat(as shown in my build).
Keep in mind if you go MoMS, you lose Flurry and the normal bonus feats. There is nothing wrong with that, I'm just leaving that as a reminder :P Keep in mind also, that MoMS doesn't combine with Flowing, and it swaps ALL of your normal bonus feats for Styles(or parts o fthe style chain if you have the initial style).
The Snake Style dodge does only work once per turn, but you will rarely use it between barkskin, mage armor/shield, ki points to boost, etc.
If you have any questions, please PM me! I'd love to help. I'm spreading all the Monk love and System mastery that I can :)
No no, I mean he almost never attacks at all. He would be a monk who took the vow of peace, and entirely focuses on distracting enemies, disabling them and what not, while avoiding all of their attacks. The idea is then to pick up the steal and disarm feats so that I can constantly be taking peoples stuff during combat... I would replace all the VS and Dimensional feats with steal or disarm feats, and I would want to focus on boosting my AC again as high as possible.
Though, yeah. I should probably stick with flowing. The reason I considered MoMS is because then I could use crane style, snake style, and mantis style all together to both be hard to hit and able to constantly disable people effectively with stunning fist, but I now see those don't always work together very solidly, and they make my need for feats even more tight. Hmm..... I would probably also forgo stunning fist altogether, because that's technically an attack. How important do you actually think it is to pick up the wizard and druid parts... If I want to focus more on stealing and evasion it seems I could skip those, and just go all out AC, and combat maneuver feats, the Druid you said adds some spells and cleric domains, what do all those do exactly for your build?
I have to admit, I've learned so much! Feats I never new about! Those Dimensional Feats are Crazy! I'll probably use those with an NPC in one my campaigns. And I never noticed that Agile magic enhancement. So cool! :D
PM you? What's that?
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That's a very neat idea... vow of peace too... interesting. I like where you're going with this :)
Well it'll be hard to stun and all the other techniques as they do your actual unarmed strike damage... I forget how vow of peace works though. The Wizard part is super important as it gives you access to mage armor and shield. Those are AC bonuses you greatly need. There are some other nice perks in there as well. The urban druid is so that later you can get wand of strong jaw and access to the charm domain. You can use the dazing touch in combination with the conductive weapon property on your AoMF. That part might not be necessary if you're going with the vow of peace. Also, another feat you should pick up is touch of serenity. That ability delivers no damage and basically soothes the target for so many rounds. It seems more your style.
Pm is private message
Actiually, I might forgo the flowing Monk Archtype altogether for MoMS if I don't intend on ever striking opponents for damage to often. A huge part of being a flowing monk is making AoOs, and I don't need my flurry of blows if I'm focusing purely on desables, and I can keep my stunning fist feat If I don't get the flowing archetype.
This would be for a purely disabling, stealing, and untouchable Monk, who pretty much just doesn't do actiual damage at all.
What happens when you run into something you cannot disable, steal from, trip, etc.?
What happens when you run into something you cannot disable, steal from, trip, etc.?Actiually, I might forgo the flowing Monk Archtype altogether for MoMS if I don't intend on ever striking opponents for damage to often. A huge part of being a flowing monk is making AoOs, and I don't need my flurry of blows if I'm focusing purely on desables, and I can keep my stunning fist feat If I don't get the flowing archetype.
This would be for a purely disabling, stealing, and untouchable Monk, who pretty much just doesn't do actiual damage at all.
Lol, that's when I just get super obnoxious and get in their face drawing all the attention to my untouchable self while my allies get in their damage. Yeah, in those situations I'm pretty much useless, but I'm still as evasive as ever and can have a great time drawing enemy fire away from my allies.
Hmm, if you want to go straight monk and be an absolute monster in combat, might I suggest taking the Nimble Guardian archetype? (Either by being a Catfolk or a Human with Racial Heritage?)
At 7th level you can become a Dire Tiger. This basically means that you have 5 attacks when pouncing, 4 of which are claws. With Weapon Focus (Claws) and Feral Combat Training (Claws) you can basically treat all of them as unarmed strikes for the purpose of feats (so stack those dragon style/tiger style stuff onto them)
And you can apply Improved Natural Attack onto them (thus getting around the unarmed strike restriction), at 20th level you're doing 6d8 per hit with those.
With multiattack, you can use them and your iterative unarmed strike in a single (awesome) full attack sequence (just choose an archetype that gives up flurry, hey, you can stack Master of Many Styles on top of Nimble Guardian, brilliant!).
prototype00
Lol, that's when I just get super obnoxious and get in their face drawing all the attention to my untouchable self while my allies get in their damage. Yeah, in those situations I'm pretty much useless, but I'm still as evasive as ever and can have a great time drawing enemy fire away from my allies.What happens when you run into something you cannot disable, steal from, trip, etc.?Actiually, I might forgo the flowing Monk Archtype altogether for MoMS if I don't intend on ever striking opponents for damage to often. A huge part of being a flowing monk is making AoOs, and I don't need my flurry of blows if I'm focusing purely on desables, and I can keep my stunning fist feat If I don't get the flowing archetype.
This would be for a purely disabling, stealing, and untouchable Monk, who pretty much just doesn't do actiual damage at all.
So basically, you can hurl abuse at them and if they ignore your character you have nothing else to contribute to the party's efforts against them? I'm not trying to be snarky here, just point out a serious weakness.
That's defninitly a serious weakness, so yeah, against certain monsters i'll be mostly useless, but most monsters that lack any items to pick pocket are not quite intelligent enough to ignore the annoying bug dancing right in front of them. And, this character is just meant to be one of those characters, perfect in some cases, useless in others. On a thematic note, he as person wouldn't engage such monsters. If he's fighting them at all its probably out of some coercion or something. He'd just avoid them all together and move on.
I'm not saying I wouldn't be completely useless, but that's also how I'm intending to build the guy thematically, and I expect those instances to be rare... so yeah, just hope my team has got other options.
I might just keep a Kama with me for good measure, and pick up weapon finesse along the way. ;)
That's defninitly a serious weakness, so yeah, against certain monsters i'll be mostly useless, but most monsters that lack any items to pick pocket are not quite intelligent enough to ignore the annoying bug dancing right in front of them.
Er...not seeing your logic there. Dragons, for example, do not have pockets but are far from stupid. Some demons, devils, etc. can have natural weapons and are very clever.
And, this character is just meant to be one of those characters, perfect in some cases, useless in others. On a thematic note, he as person wouldn't engage such monsters. If he's fighting them at all its probably out of some coercion or something. He'd just avoid them all together and move on.
And if the rest of the party or the monsters don't feel the same way? Some encounters are unavoidable.
I'm not saying I wouldn't be completely useless, but that's also how I'm intending to build the guy thematically, and I expect those instances to be rare... so yeah, just hope my team has got other options.
"Expect the unexpected" is a good motto for adventurers.
I might just keep a Kama with me for good measure, and pick up weapon finesse along the way. ;)
A back-up option is ALWAYS a good idea.