I really really like Hellknights.
I really really like Ragathiel (and the moral concept of vengeance in general).
Trying to make a Paladin/Hellknight of Ragathiel. Some issues (obviously) arise.
Would Ragathiel allow/approve of such a thing? His main antagonists are devils, and even while Hellknights might be able to venerate/appreciate Ragathiel, will Ragathiel be able to reciprocate? I remember reading one of AM HELLKNIGHT's posts about a Hellknight of Ragathiel, but I don't think it is official cannon (at least not that I can find). What are some other people's thoughts on this? Any idea of which orders would be best for this? My thought is the Scourge. Could it work, and if so how? From the perspective of player, GM, and unattached outsider?
Secondary, the build itself. I was looking at the Warrior of the Holy Light archetype, along with the Oath of Vengeance. These work together both mechanically and thematically I think. No need for spells, since I'd be going right into the Hellknight class, and the extra Lay on Hands from WotHL works well with the Vengeance ability to convert Lay on Hands to Smite Evil, particularly since I will be low on those due to going straight into Hellknight.
Thirdly, what about race? This is probably the least important of the considerations, but still something that has some bearing on both the theme and the mechanics. My first thought was an angel blooded aasimar, but I feel that this is stretching the bounds of what is feasible/reasonable, particularly given such a difficult concept to begin with. Similarly so I am both interested in and dubious about a tiefling (again harking back to AM HELLKNIGHT's post), as it would present many of the same difficulties, with the addition of less mechanical aptitude. The default choice is of course human, which I have no real issue with, but I like to use the most interesting thing available, and humans rarely fit that bill. But again, like I said, this concept is interesting enough as is, so it's not of overmuch concern.
Thank you in advance for any thoughts you might have.
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Well, first off, even in Golarion, only Sacred Servant archetype Paladins need a deity. Full stop. They get their power not so much from a God as their own righteousness and adherence to a code. So...Ragathiel's approval only matters if you meet him and get to ask. You could easily revere him and gain power from that even without his approval per se.
Secondly, I don't think he'd actively prohibit even his Clerics and others he has authority over from becoming Hellknights...though it'd be seriously unusual. So I think you're alright there two ways.
Thirdly, on race, there is the Demonspawn Tiefling (+2 Str, +2 Chr, -2 Int) if you do want to go Tiefling...might be interesting having them reject their heritage so utterly. But I'd probably go human. You don't need a weird race to be interesting.
I did not know that. Both the Divine Bond and the Holy Champion class abilities for the paladin make direct references to the paladins god, so I had always assumed that one was required, though now that I look it never actually mentions such. I'm assuming this is extrapolated from the clerics ability to substitute a divine concept for a diety? Or is it solely from the lack of such a requirement within the paladin class?
Regardless though, I personally disapprove of that particular decision, and do not plan on playing as such. But it is interesting to note.
Demonspawn tiefling was indeed something I had considered, as it helps alleviate the mechanical difficulties of a tiefling, but I don't feel I am a good enough roleplayer to do that particular theme justice. I'm not a chaotic individual, and am not quite bright enough to wrap my mind around it =P (probably why I'm so enticed by the Hellknight class). If I did tiefling, I'd probably be devil blooded or standard.
Thanks for your thoughts.
While I do not presume to be amazing at anything at all, my point was that I am not good at roleplaying chaotic alignments, rather than that I'm not good at roleplaying.
I always assumed that Paladins get their powers the same way Peter Pan can fly. In fact that's why they Fall, is because their belief in themselves gets shaken too much, or they start thinking and getting in their own heads too much.
Sure. Hell, I would make that my big BBEG for a campaign. A Chaotic Evil Paladin/Anti-Paladin multiclass, who refuses to see or accept that he isn't a Paladin anymore, so he's just massively dangerous on every level.
Those are some interesting ideas.
I too really like the GodClaw, and it's probably my second choice after Scourge. My only qualm is that since I'd also be venerating Ragathiel, I'd want to choose a domain that is in both, which limits me to Law and Nobility, which are fairly underwhelming.
I looked at Oath Against Fiends, but it's abilities are too dependent on paladin level, which will only be ten at most, so it's not an optimal decision for this.
Leadership isn't allowed.
I disagree. For Touch of Law, if a roll of 11 would result in a significant amount of success, then the check or whatever is easy enough that it's not worth the standard action required to generate it. And for the Staff or Order, that merely replicates an ability that I would already have, and for a limited duration at that. So while being able to see through a bit of dirt might be only occasionally and situationally useful, it's better than being not useful at all, and should I go with human, low light vision will be very useful. Maybe if I end up going aasimar it might be worth it for God Claw, but even then it's a toss-up.