| 3 people marked this as a favorite. |
Our group likes hanging around in town, getting involved in city life and politics. I think many low level groups also spend a great deal of time in their local town.
One thing we really lack in our games though is miniatures for the regular run of the mill towns folk. Mini's for tavern brawls, assassins going after the king, that lovely tavern wench being kidnapped in the middle of the marketplace, etc. are sorely lacking.
I would suggest a Builders Series set to fill this lack of regular townsfolk. I think every game can be enhanced by this.
My suggestion would be something along the following lines. I added where I think a repaint might be usable and made miniatures we'd want multiple of common and miniatures where we'd only want a few rare.
Boy (Common, Small)
> A small sized, unarmed young man in raggy clothes and a bit dirty.
Girl (Common, Small)
> A small sized, unarmed young woman in a raggy dress and a bit dirty.
Peasant (Common, Medium)
> A regular male commoner in simple clothes. Unarmed.
Beggar (Common, Medium)
> A woman in worn dress holding out her hand.
Guard-dog (Common, Medium)
> An actual dog, not a wolf, with a spiked collar
City Guard (Common, Medium)
> A city guardsman. Could be a repaint of the Watch Guard from Heroes and Monsters.
Merchant (Rare, Medium)
> Somewhat weighty man with a scroll and courtiers outfit. Could also double as a lower court noble or innkeeper for a fancy tavern.
Tavern Wench (Rare, Medium)
> A somewhat provocatively dressed serving wench without cups or serving trays so they're usable as other female commoners like merchant daughters, local floozy, PC love interest, etc.
Noblewoman (Rare, Medium)
> A noble woman or princess. Could be a repaint of Queen Ileosa from Legends of Golarion.
Nobleman (Rare, Medium)
> A nobleman. Could be a repaint of Aldern Foxglove from Rise of the Rune Lords.
Princess (Rare, Small)
> A young girl in a fancy, modest white dress. Could double as a nobles daughter, flower-girl or a holy child.
Prince (Rare, Small)
> A young boy in fancy clothes with a crown. Could double as a nobles son or halfling king.
Basically this set includes common and noble, children and adults of both genders, as well as guards with dogs and two additional commoners with common functions.
Other mini's we considered for the series are: Blacksmith, Baker, Butcher, Laundress, Seamstress, Sailors, Porters and elderly of both genders, but those were all pretty specific while the ones listed above have more general usability.
What kind of regular townsfolk do others feel they need in their games?
Merchants (traveling/stall)
All the above, but maybe reskinned to different locales (osiron, cheliax, tianxia etc.)
I'd love to see some non-adventurer minis, but I don't know that a Builder series like that is realistic. It's my understanding that Builder already hasn't been selling well and what you're proposing would largely consist of new sculpts to boot. It might be workable to mix one or two such minis into each "regular" set for a while, though.
Just read we got a goat in the new set. That'd also definitely fit in here as a repaint ^_^ Yay for goats!
I've never understood the desire for this (although based on the regularity of requests, I think it would probably sell).
Apart from bar fights or town invasions or somesuch, how often do you need tactical representations of basically non-combatants?
(Or are people looking for such figures due to having a lot of combats in town, surrounded by bystanders?)
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I've never understood the desire for this (although based on the regularity of requests, I think it would probably sell).
Apart from bar fights or town invasions or somesuch, how often do you need tactical representations of basically non-combatants?
(Or are people looking for such figures due to having a lot of combats in town, surrounded by bystanders?)
Innocent bystanders during town raids.
Ship crew during pirate attacks.Merchant folk in traveling caravans.
Prisoners to be rescued, anywhere.
Bad guys in disguise.
Guests in a academy, temple, or druid's circle.
Hangers-on when visiting royalty or nobility.
Basically, conflict happens in a lot of places that normal people are at. We're all sort of trained as DMs to marginalize NPCs and just say "the townfolk go running" and ignore them, but having actual minis can (not necessarily will) add some interesting variables. Casters may need to watch area-effect spells overlap more. Healers may need to prioritize collateral damage victims. Martials may need to focus on opponents that are going for vulnerable targets. Doors may be opened (a move action) by someone who isn't in the party!
I've never understood the desire for this (although based on the regularity of requests, I think it would probably sell).
Apart from bar fights or town invasions or somesuch, how often do you need tactical representations of basically non-combatants?
(Or are people looking for such figures due to having a lot of combats in town, surrounded by bystanders?)
Innocent bystanders during town raids.
Ship crew during pirate attacks.
Merchant folk in traveling caravans.
Prisoners to be rescued, anywhere.
Bad guys in disguise.
Guests in a academy, temple, or druid's circle.
Hangers-on when visiting royalty or nobility.Basically, conflict happens in a lot of places that normal people are at. We're all sort of trained as DMs to marginalize NPCs and just say "the townfolk go running" and ignore them, but having actual minis can (not necessarily will) add some interesting variables. Casters may need to watch area-effect spells overlap more. Healers may need to prioritize collateral damage victims. Martials may need to focus on opponents that are going for vulnerable targets. Doors may be opened (a move action) by someone who isn't in the party!
Okay - basically the situation I referenced in the parenthetical query? You have reasonably regular battles with lots of innocent bystanders around? I can appreciate the need in that case, I suppose it just doesnt come up a lot in the games we run.
Sometimes people seem to be suggesting they use figures when wandering around town chasing down leads or shopping or something. If you have lots of battles in towns I can understand the desire for such figures.
They're also cool for crowds before you know who the bad guys are.
I dont think we'd be in a tactical situation then (except for pretty rare situations, I suppose). It's a nice thought though - I can imagine townsfolk figures enhancing the feeling of "wolf in sheep's clothing" type encounters.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Here's some "they're not bystanders" scene's with townsfolk:
A PC rogue picking pockets in the marketplace for extra profit. Townsfolk not only indicate potential targets, but they might also spot them picking someone else's gold! (Towns-folk used as targets and spotters based on orientation and distance)
A ball where PC's have to spy on one or more individual noblemen for information, without anyone noticing. (Towns-folk used to indicate the situation and how hard it will be to overhear them based on distance)
A thief steals the money box from a charity at the town fair! The PC's give chase through the crowd! Little do they know, some people in the crowd are also members of the thieves guild and may move to cover the escape (Towns-folk used as obstacles / hidden opponents)
The PC's are infiltrating an elven city to get details on their defences before an upcoming war. They can disguise themselves, but elves have sharp eyesight so they best keep their distance (Towns-folk used in puzzle to get past moving individuals without being made)
A crowd of angry citizens demands the local lord surrender his power to a pretender. The PC's, who work in the lords army, are tasked with dispersing the crowd... without killing them (Towns-folk used as enemies)
Besides this, there are various individuals in most campaigns that are not combatants, but still relevant. The younger sister of the Paladin in the party, the handsome bard that the Sorceress fancies, that boxom beauty at the tavern that loves hearing the exaggerated tales of the Fighter, the merchant that keeps hiring the party to protect his stuff, the vain local nobleman who may be a jerk but who also owns everything in the area.
Having a clear location for these individuals in surprise battles is very relevant, as the PC's don't just have a vested interest in protecting them, they may actually be the target of the attack, so losing track of them means the PC's lose no matter how many bad guys they kill.
All in all it depends on the campaign. A campaign set in the monster infested jungles of Farawaystan, based on slashing your way through tribes of orks and goblins to get to the demons that empower their leaders is unlikely to need many townsfolk.
A rogue based campaign founded on theft and stealth, a politics based campaign where strict social rules like proper forms of address are enforced by the DM or a low level campaign based entirely around the PCs home town of Cityville however...
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
All in all it depends on the campaign. A campaign set in the monster infested jungles of Farawaystan, based on slashing your way through tribes of orks and goblins to get to the demons that empower their leaders is unlikely to need many townsfolk.
A rogue based campaign founded on theft and stealth, a politics based campaign where strict social rules like proper forms of address are enforced by the DM or a low level campaign based entirely around the PCs home town of Cityville however...
Cheers. I think it's also about playstyle. When we do run scenes like the ones you describe we won't generally use a tactical approach. I appreciate the perspective though - its easy to forget there's lots of ways to play (especially if you always play with the same group).
Okay - basically the situation I referenced in the parenthetical query? You have reasonably regular battles with lots of innocent bystanders around? I can appreciate the need in that case, I suppose it just doesnt come up a lot in the games we run.
Sometimes people seem to be suggesting they use figures when wandering around town chasing down leads or shopping or something. If you have lots of battles in towns I can understand the desire for such figures.
You name one situation, I name six. Steve, you're a well-respected member of the community but that's a really dismissive summary of my response.
Here's some townsfolk that these guys make. I only have the scamp as I purchased a few Vampiric and Zombie versions of the townsfolk that they also sell for my Carrion Crown game. They ones I have look really good, so I recommend them.
You name one situation, I name six. Steve, you're a well-respected member of the community but that's a really dismissive summary of my response.Okay - basically the situation I referenced in the parenthetical query? You have reasonably regular battles with lots of innocent bystanders around? I can appreciate the need in that case, I suppose it just doesnt come up a lot in the games we run.
Sometimes people seem to be suggesting they use figures when wandering around town chasing down leads or shopping or something. If you have lots of battles in towns I can understand the desire for such figures.
Hmm. I didn't mean for it to be dismissive, I was trying to show I accepted your point (I was kind of responding to the "basically..." Bit, not each of your examples). What you said made sense to me, that's why my reply was brief. I didn't really have anything to add other than acknowledging I could understand why you'd use such figures. Sorry for giving the wrong impression.
Hmm. I didn't mean for it to be dismissive, I was trying to show I accepted your point (I was kind of responding to the "basically..." Bit, not each of your examples). What you said made sense to me, that's why my reply was brief. I didn't really have anything to add other than acknowledging I could understand why you'd use such figures. Sorry for giving the wrong impression.
Okay, cool. Thanks for the clarification. I wasn't sure if there was still discussing that needed being done. Blah blah, tonal subcontext lacking blah blah the Internet. <Grin>
Bump, bump, bumpety bump!
Multiple merchants, just general townsfolk, farmers, a smith, etc....
Love this idea.
I would absolutely love to see a builder set like this. To be honest, the normal 'unique 12' we have seen in the previous builder sets I don't think is enough different types of townspeople if they only had 12 different types.
I also am not going to get my hopes up too much as Erik has said WizKids wasn't really happy on the sales of the previous builder sets. :(