Jiao-long
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At long last, I've had my first PFS character reach 12th level! You can click my name for a general idea of what's going on with this PC (including what feats I already have, so please don't suggest things I already have or don't qualify for).
Anyway, 12th level for me is my 5th level of Eldritch Knight, which means I get a bonus combat feat. I'm having a little trouble deciding what it should be, though.
Here are my ideas so far:
• Power Attack - Would take my typical damage bonus from +15 to +24, but would take my typical attack bonus from +18 to +15, which feels a little low for this level. I try to typically have an Extended heroism up when expecting trouble, but that's not guaranteed. But even with that, my Power Attack swing would be +17 to hit. Is that acceptable at 12th level?
• Improved Critical - It would be for a longsword; is going from 19-20 to 17-20 worth the feat slot?
• Lunge - For when I'm spending a couple rounds going toe-to-toe with a Large creature and want to then be able to 5ft step back and cast safely.
• Blind-Fight - On the other hand, I can have Extended darkvision running 24 hours a day, and always have see invisibility prepped, so...?
• Vital Strike - For a little damage boost when I'm flying in and making one attack.
Any comments on those ideas, or ideas that I haven't thought of? Thanks!
Jiao-long
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I'm leaning toward Improved Critical, or Power Attack + retrain Dodge to Furious Focus.
I've already retrained two feats and I've died once, so Prestige is getting a little thin. :/
(P.S., if you're worried about a low attack bonus, have you bought that ioun stone for 4k that gives +1 to all attack rolls?)
Not yet; probably getting it on my current shopping trip.
| Under A Bleeding Sun |
I don't know that your to hit is high enough for power attack to be that great. And it looks like you sword and board it, which I think makes it even more questionable. I'd be trying to sure up my to hit, but off hand I'm not thinking of a way to do that.
Edit: nm, shield is from your spell. Still +15 seems low to.me at that level. My level 11 guy has a +21 and he misses a fai amount.
| SPACEBALL12345 |
Well you aren't doing enough damage to gib things in one round at that level, and if society play is anything like the table here then you can't really afford to go below +18 to hit if you want to hit things at CR 12 or higher somewhat reliably. If I had to choose one of the feats you listed, I'd consider improved critical. Could be useful if your final adventure takes you to a high enough level to unlock the capstone EK ability.
Looking at your setup listed, you seem pretty concerned about getting hit. You only have 2 hits on a full attack at 12, maybe consider wind stance? Kind of an out there choice, but if you just don't wanna get hit, its hard to go wrong with miss chances. Could save you a casting of blur if you plan on it being over quickly.
I know you don't want to retrain, but have you considered Acadamae Graduate? You should have a fort save of at least +9, I'm guessing higher with items, so you might be able to reliably get a flank bonus and more attacks on your own(with cloak of resistance +3, you'd fail the save on a 4-7 depending on spell level, not too bad). Retraining something like dodge to that would give you two feats, so you could go power attack AND furious focus, giving you the damage without hurting your chance to hit as much.
| soupturtle |
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Power attack is usually easily worth the penalty, especially in case of a single weapon used two-handed, but your attack bonus is indeed quite low. Let's do some quick damage calculations against AC 27, which is typical for CR12, assuming you're hasted (who isn't?).
Current: 1.1 [crit chance] x (2x0.6+0.35) [attacks at +18/+18/+13] x 19.5 [1d8+15] = 33.2
With power attack: 1.1 x (2x.45+.2) x 28.5 = 34.5
With improved critical instead of PA: 1.2 x (2x0.6+0.35) x 19.5 = 36.3
Power attack and heroism: 1.1 x (2x.55+.3) x 28.5 = 43.9
Improved critical and heroism: 1.2 x (2x0.7+0.45) x 19.5 = 43.3
So in your case, improved critical is going to buy you more damage than power attack, due to your low to-hit. But if you increase your to hit, power attack will win out and be a pretty good deal, especially when you consider it's also very useful against damage reduction. Are you sure you have exhausted the ways you could increase your to-hit? Just from the top of my head you ought have a base attack bonus of +9, a strength bonus of something like +6, weapon focus for +1, boots of speed or casting haste for another +1 and a +3 weapon, for a total of +20. That's before things like an item that gives a luck bonus, casting heroism, UMDing a wand of bless if you see a combat coming, casting a polymorph spell that increases your strength, summoning a monster with bard levels, or anything like that. If you can reliably get to +20 power attack will become the more worthwhile feat.
So my advice would be: get power attack, and try to use your spells and equipment to push your attack bonus up a bit. If the latter isn't possible, get improved critical instead, as you could definitely do with a feat that improves your damage either way.
Jiggy
RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32
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Power attack is usually easily worth the penalty, especially in case of a single weapon used two-handed, but your attack bonus is indeed quite low. Let's do some quick damage calculations against AC 27, which is typical for CR12, assuming you're hasted (who isn't?).
Current: 1.1 [crit chance] x (2x0.6+0.35) [attacks at +18/+18/+13] x 19.5 [1d8+15] = 33.2
With power attack: 1.1 x (2x.45+.2) x 28.5 = 34.5
With improved critical instead of PA: 1.2 x (2x0.6+0.35) x 19.5 = 36.3
Power attack and heroism: 1.1 x (2x.55+.3) x 28.5 = 43.9
Improved critical and heroism: 1.2 x (2x0.7+0.45) x 19.5 = 43.3
Does this math change if I'm not hasted? I don't have the boots, I can't assume an ally will cast it, and casting it myself costs a round.
Are you sure you have exhausted the ways you could increase your to-hit? Just from the top of my head you ought have a base attack bonus of +9, a strength bonus of something like +6, weapon focus for +1, boots of speed or casting haste for another +1 and a +3 weapon, for a total of +20.
My STR bonus is +5, not +6.
I do have Weapon Focus.The +18 I cited does not include haste.
I do have a +3 weapon (via GMW).
That's before things like an item that gives a luck bonus,
Ooooh, what item's that? I have Fate's Favored, so that would be awesome.
casting heroism, UMDing a wand of bless if you see a combat coming, casting a polymorph spell that increases your strength, summoning a monster with bard levels, or anything like that. If you can reliably get to +20 power attack will become the more worthwhile feat.
I do have heroism, but you can't always rely on that, so I prefer not to factor it into my decision-making. I don't really do the polymorphing or summoning.
So my advice would be: get power attack, and try to use your spells and equipment to push your attack bonus up a bit. If the latter isn't possible, get improved critical instead, as you could definitely do with a feat that improves your damage either way.
Sounding like maybe Improved Critical for now, then maybe Power Attack at 13th with some more cash invested into hitting between now and then.
| soupturtle |
If none of your allies casts haste it's worth the round of casting. It almost doubles your damage, since you go from 0.55+0.3=0.85 hits to 2x0.6+0.35=1.55 hits per round, and that's before factoring in what it does for your allies, which will be significant as well. If you insist on making do without it: power attack does even worse without haste compared to improved critical. Also, I tried to show my math in the hope you could adapt it yourself to minor changes in assumptions. ;-)
The +1 luck bonus to attack thing may not actually exist. I was probably thinking of that ioun stone, but that's a competence bonus.
| Slacker2010 |
Sorry, I dont have any good Advice for ya.
What I would like to ask: How was being a Divination Specialized Wizard been? I tried one out in a home game but I felt like I was wasting all my spell slots I got from being Specialized. Can you tell me how you effectively used Divinations spells consistently?
Im not being sarcastic, I simply couldn't do it. I need some tips.
Jiggy
RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32
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Sorry, I dont have any good Advice for ya.
What I would like to ask: How was being a Divination Specialized Wizard been? I tried one out in a home game but I felt like I was wasting all my spell slots I got from being Specialized. Can you tell me how you effectively used Divinations spells consistently?
Im not being sarcastic, I simply couldn't do it. I need some tips.
Not gonna lie, it's a little rough with the spell slots.
True strike can occasionally be useful, especially for a bull rush - send 'em flying!
See invisibility doesn't feel like a wasted slot.
I've used blood biography once or twice, but meh.
Higher level than that, I don't really remember. Which is probably commentary in itself.
On the other hand, being able to:
1) Always act in the surprise round,
2) getting an eventual +3 to initiative,
3) getting to "bank" a d20 roll several times a day,
Can be really, really nice. Being able to cast shield *before* the ambush happens is amazing, and everything changes when you begin your turn with the knowledge that you have a natural 20 that you can put anywhere you want.
| Slacker2010 |
Oh, I loved the Initiative and the Surprise round thing. I got the character to Level 15 in a home game. The idea was always going first and preparing the battlefield. Haste, Stone Call, Sleet storm, Wall of Stone, Solid Fog, Heroism on Melees, and I used magic to neutralize the enemy caster effects. Things like Greater Dispel Magic.
But as I played, I realized that most of my spells were conjuration spells (with exception to haste). I ended up using my Diviners Fortune on melee characters, or our Archer (this was really nasty). I had low AC and didnt want to be in combat so never thought of Truestrike for a bullrush. I never wanted to be that close. Mostly I used my extra 1st level for Anticipate Peril on whoever was opening the door to a room that looked centralized. Maybe that was little metagaming. Used the 2nd on See Invis, but other than that, until True Seeing at level 11, Didnt really use alot of Divination spells.
Oh my 5th level spell was Telepathic Bond.
Still Found the spells underwelming. Wish I had been Conjuration.
| Pirate Rob |
I think Power Attack is the way to go even though you're right to worry about your attack bonus.
The thing to remember is you're not a character that auto uses power attack every time. You'll use it against inanimate objects and easy to hit targets.
Assuming exactly the bonuses listed Power Attack will be profitable on single attacks vs targets up to 30 AC (and full attacks up to 29 AC) Although against targets with 25+ AC Improved Critical will generally be better. More Attack bonus will be more advantageous for power attack than improved critical
Vital Strike isn't very exciting with a d8 weapon damage.
Blind-Fight doesn't seem necessary and you aren't set up to get moonlight stalker either.
Lunge is a okay option although in the situations it shines (when you're having trouble reaching a foe) you can cast some awesome spell.
If you were expecting to continue play into the higher levels improved crit, followed by critical focus and banishing critical could be a fun set of options for you.
| SPACEBALL12345 |
... Retraining something like dodge to that would give you two feats, so you could go power attack AND furious focus, giving you the damage without hurting your chance to hit as much.
Sometimes I'm a very special child. Especially when I try to retrain a combat feat into a regional feat and then give myself an extra feat.