Extra discovery at 1st Lvl?

[Malodeus]

Recently, I had an argument with a player in my gaming group about certain class features such as rogue talents and alchemist discoveries. He tried to argue that an alchemist can gain the 'extra discovery' feat at first Lvl when an alchemist would not have a discovery normally, and that the rogue can do the same with rogue talents.

He seems to think that when you select a class, you gain all of its class features, but they do not activate until you are at their required Lvl, and because of this, the prerequisite for the feats are met.

I disagree and think that you can only take the feats at second level or when you gain a discovery or rogue talent.

Can you take such feats at first level?

[GeneticDrift]

you only have the class features of the levels you have.

[Happler]

FAQ:

When do I count as having a class feature?

Quote:

When do I count as having a class feature?

You have a class feature when your class description tells you you gain that class feature, generally based on your level in that class (and perhaps altered by factors, see below).

If you have an archetype or other rules element that replaces that class feature, you do not have that class feature. For example, if your archetype replaces a rogue's sneak attack, you no longer have the sneak attack class feature (whether a requirement is as general as "sneak attack" or as specific as "sneak attack +1d6," you do not qualify for it).

If you have an archetype or other rules element that replaces part of a scaling class feature, or delays when you get that class feature, you do not have that class feature until you actually gain that class feature.
Example: If you have a fighter archetype that replaces weapon training 1 (but not weapon training 2, 3, and 4), you don't gain the weapon training 2 ability until fighter level 9, which means you don't have the weapon training class ability at all until you reach fighter level 9. Anything with "weapon training" or "weapon training class feature" as a prerequisite is unavailable to you until level 9.
Example: If you have a cleric archetype that replaces channel energy at level 1 (but not later increments of channel energy), you don't gain the channel energy ability until cleric level 3, which means you don't have the channel energy class feature until you reach cleric level 3. Anything with "channel energy" or "channel energy class feature" as a prerequisite is unavailable to you until level 3.
Example: If you have a witch archetype that replaces your hex at level 1 (but not later hexes, major hexes, or grand hexes), you don't gain your first hex ability until witch level 2, which means you don't have the hex class feature until you reach witch level 2. Anything with "hex" or "hex class feature" as a prerequisite is unavailable to you until level 2.

—Pathfinder Design Team, 07/09/13

So, per this, since extra Discovery has the pre-req of the discovery class feature. You cannot take the feat until you gain your first discovery @ level 2.

[Nefreet]

Tell your player, that if it worked his way, a Rogue could grab Advanced Talents at 1st level.

What he can do, if you have Ultimate Campaign, is wait until 2nd level and retrain his 1st level feat into something he couldn't have taken at the time.