Making a Magus

[Gelvin]

I just strated working on a character with the Magus class. I was wondering what feats and spells everyone recommends. I'm going for more offensive and buff spells/feats.

[Cap. Darling]

My magus was a barbarian until level 5 where i retrained him so i dont have low level hands on experiance.
There is a magus guide in here somwere that is quite good.
Depending on your point buy or how you generate stats and what rules you guys use several things can be optimal and several things can be fun.

[Phoenix3270]

Cap. Darling wrote:

My magus was a barbarian until level 5 where i retrained him so i dont have low level hands on experiance.

There is a magus guide in here somwere that is quite good.
Depending on your point buy or how you generate stats and what rules you guys use several things can be optimal and several things can be fun.

Okay, thanks.

[blashimov]

Dervish dance, dex to damage with scimitar.
Intensify spell.
Shocking grasp.
Everything else is whatever seems fun to you. Hexcrafter and bladebound are both excellent archetypes.

[Cap. Darling]

There are other options than dervish Dance, shocking grasp, intensify Spell and magic linage( shocking grasp). But it is true that it seems to be quite common in here.
I think the great strength and fun factor of the magus is all the options that normal martials dosent have. So deciding for one trick and then doing that 60%of the time is pehaps not so fun?

[Lao Haeris]

You better read some guides to get a general concept how they work.

This is a good general guide:
https://docs.google.com/document/pub?id=1DB6sOfbAzFmKVPgcyLWipTVqvWFjfDSv6v _YiGQb5Yw&pli=1

This one focuses on the hexcrafter magus archetype, powerful and with an emphasis on debuffing:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1fSJuL1O4hs15NMk-y4MXbH9D_qt9V7iwhY2y9HD rs74/edit

This one is a step to step guide to show you how spell combat and spellstrike works. Don't skip this. Magus is a complicated class. Make sure you have a general grasp of the rules before you make one.
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1fSJuL1O4hs15NMk-y4MXbH9D_qt9V7iwhY2y9HD rs74/edit

You will find advice about feats, spells and everything you need to know :)

Good luck with your new character.

[Aspasia de Malagant]

Lao Haeris wrote:

You better read some guides to get a general concept how they work.

This is a good general guide:
https://docs.google.com/document/pub?id=1DB6sOfbAzFmKVPgcyLWipTVqvWFjfDSv6v _YiGQb5Yw&pli=1

This one focuses on the hexcrafter magus archetype, powerful and with an emphasis on debuffing:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1fSJuL1O4hs15NMk-y4MXbH9D_qt9V7iwhY2y9HD rs74/edit

This one is a step to step guide to show you how spell combat and spellstrike works. Don't skip this. Magus is a complicated class. Make sure you have a general grasp of the rules before you make one.
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1fSJuL1O4hs15NMk-y4MXbH9D_qt9V7iwhY2y9HD rs74/edit

You will find advice about feats, spells and everything you need to know :)

Good luck with your new character.

Those links seem to be broken or indicate the content has been deleted...

[FrodoOf9Fingers]

I typically decide what kind of playstyle I want to go with. For me, here are some of the builds I like:

1. Trip builds, because it seems Magi can do really well with tripping
2. Frostbite builds, instead of shocking grasp all day, you can make an opponent fatigued, entangled, shaken, sickened, and flatfooted to your attacks, all with one hit!
3. Whip builds: Focusing on area lock down with trips and debuffs, good for lots of dexterity.
4. The classic burst them down build, where shocking grasp is your best friend.

[FrodoOf9Fingers]

For some good magus guides (along with guides for everything else) see this website:

http://zenithgames.blogspot.com/2012/11/the-comprehensive-pathfinder-guides .html

[master_marshmallow]

Magi and Bards both have potential to be the most versatile characters in the game if you choose for them to be.

You really have to decide how you want this character to play in and out of combat.

One could use their feats and magus arcana to pick up all the utility spells off the wizard list and become a skillmonkey magus.

One could take archetypes for it, do the dervish dance thing, and make a DPR machine with no other tricks.

There are a lot of options, dervish dance is a popular one because of the point buy system allowing you to neglect your STR score and still be competent in combat.

If you are looking at general feats and spells to look at, most of the time you will see someone telling you to take Intensified Spell; and apply it to Shocking Grasp.

Other times, you will see them tell you to take Rime Spell and apply it to Frostbite.

Heighten Spell and Preferred Spell are popular choices to get your DPR spell of choice to be Spontaneous so you don't have to prepare it, instead being able to prepare either utility spells that you picked up using your arcanas, or other spells that might have been useful.

Weapon Focus is solid, especially should you end up picking up Spell Perfection at fifteenth level. Power Attack and Furious Focus will also help with damage.

Quicken Spell and Empower Spell are solid feats.

The Dimensional Dervish feat chain actually works beautifully with Spell Combat.

Other good spells to look at are Bladed Dash, Alter Self, Mirror Image, Blur, Displacement, Haste, Fly, Dimension Door, and of course Fireball.

[Rubbrband]

I have played a magus to level 10 through rise of the runelords.

A few notes.

Make sure you read the touch attack guide because it's all very confusing and you will likely nerf yourself like I did.

Traits: I think magic lineage(intensified shocking grasp) is probably better than gifted adept but they are both really good on shocking grasp for a very long time. Too bad you can only pick one. You can always get a intensify metamagic rod and save a trait and feat but it will only work 3x a day.

Dervish dance: this was made for the magus. There is almost no drawback whatsoever as the scimitar is one of the best weapons for the magus. I wish I would have known about it when I made my magus. It does take two feats but the magus isn't very feat intensive especially early on. If you don't have the feats to burn it's no big deal. The magus doesn't lack in damage potential. You can also consider an agile weapon.

Black blade: the black blade magus is not all it's cracked up to be. Slower arcane point progression and one less magus arcana. You can't customize your weapon and you end up trading feats for a generic weapon with some good but not exceptional abilities. It looks a lot better than it really is but I wouldn't go so far to call it a trap.

Swift actions: the magus is very swift action intensive. The magus breaks the game mechanics by being able to attack multiple times and cast a spell in the same turn at 1st level but never seems to be able to get enough swift actions. Abilities like arcane strike, hastened assault, magus weapon enhancement, black blade enhancement, accurate strike, quick runner shirt, casting vanish, and arcane accuracy all take swift actions and that's just off the top of my head. You need to be super selective which powers you take because you can't use all of them so you need to take that into consideration.

[Rubbrband]

I could make a list of all the really good powers and why but there are plenty of places to find that on the internet. The magus isn't the easiest class to plan strategy for so I will give you a breakdown of the best combat strategy I have found. This could probably be it's own thread.

Pre combat: I generally carry around a wand of shield and ping myself with it if I smell the slightest bit of trouble. If you absolute know a combat is coming the magus is really good at spell buffs so bulls strength up or vanish.

1st round: spark up your sword with the swift action and cast a buff spell. I suggest casting mirror early and often. You can use your movement to get a little closer to combat or position yourself in between the baddies and the squishy casters. If the situation arises for you to be able to fireball a large group of baddies take it, remember empower magic arcana is your friend.

2nd round: you are more than ready to charge into combat depending on how combat is developing and who needs help where. If you have a quick runner shirt you can move in and attack with a full round attack and shocking grasp but you won't be able to use any other nifty swift actions. You can also consider casing vanish and moving into mele range.

3rd round: by this time you should be letting it rip. Full round attack actions with shocking grasp consider sparking your sword keen to deliver the shocking grasp through you 15-20 crit range weapon and have fun. Check out the touch attack guide for more info on using shocking grasp.

Retreat: vanish is always a great oh s!@~ button. You can do a full round or single attack and then cast vanish as a swift action get out of trouble. Take a round or two to chug some potions and then get back to work.

[Cap. Darling]

Rubbrband wrote:

...

You can always get a intensify metamagic rod and save a trait and feat but it will only work 3x a day.
...

There is alot of good stuff in this post. But this part is not good advice if you have a rod in one hand and a sword in the other you cannot use Spell-combat.

[Blackstorm]

Cap. Darling wrote:

Rubbrband wrote:

...

You can always get a intensify metamagic rod and save a trait and feat but it will only work 3x a day.
...

There is alot of good stuff in this post. But this part is not good advice if you have a rod in one hand and a sword in the other you cannot use Spell-combat.

This has 2 ways to resolve that issue: tiefling with prehensile tail alternate racial trait or hexcrafter with prehensile hair hex.

[Mathwei ap Niall]

Blackstorm wrote:

Cap. Darling wrote:

Rubbrband wrote:

...

You can always get a intensify metamagic rod and save a trait and feat but it will only work 3x a day.
...

There is alot of good stuff in this post. But this part is not good advice if you have a rod in one hand and a sword in the other you cannot use Spell-combat.

This has 2 ways to resolve that issue: tiefling with prehensile tail alternate racial trait or hexcrafter with prehensile hair hex.

Nope the tiefling tail doesn't let you manipulate things like a hand, only the prehensile has that abbility. That or dip 2 levels into alchemist for the spare arm.

Also, unless you are going for spell perfection route quicken spell is a less then optimal feat choice.

[Rubbrband]

I guess I was wrong about the rods. I don't actually have a rod on this character but was considering getting one. Glad I know that now.

[Rubbrband]

You can play your magus more like a glass cannon and vanish, move in, take a full attack, vanish, and move out. I elected to use shield and mirror image most the time to try and prove the magus isn't a glass cannon.

[Cap. Darling]

Rubbrband wrote:

You can play your magus more like a glass cannon and vanish, move in, take a full attack, vanish, and move out. I elected to use shield and mirror image most the time to try and prove the magus isn't a glass cannon.

Same. My magus is a solid front liner just like the groups barbar. Great staying power and fine fine damage.

[Rubbrband]

Mathwei ap Niall wrote:

Blackstorm wrote:

Cap. Darling wrote:

Rubbrband wrote:

...

You can always get a intensify metamagic rod and save a trait and feat but it will only work 3x a day.
...

There is alot of good stuff in this post. But this part is not good advice if you have a rod in one hand and a sword in the other you cannot use Spell-combat.

This has 2 ways to resolve that issue: tiefling with prehensile tail alternate racial trait or hexcrafter with prehensile hair hex.

Nope the tiefling tail doesn't let you manipulate things like a hand, only the prehensile has that abbility. That or dip 2 levels into alchemist for the spare arm.

Also, unless you are going for spell perfection route quicken spell is a less then optimal feat choice.

You can upgrade your tail with the grasping tail feat. Will that do the trick? It's worth considering as good as metamagic rods are.

[Mathwei ap Niall]

Rubbrband wrote:

Mathwei ap Niall wrote:

Blackstorm wrote:

Cap. Darling wrote:

Rubbrband wrote:

...

You can always get a intensify metamagic rod and save a trait and feat but it will only work 3x a day.
...

There is alot of good stuff in this post. But this part is not good advice if you have a rod in one hand and a sword in the other you cannot use Spell-combat.

This has 2 ways to resolve that issue: tiefling with prehensile tail alternate racial trait or hexcrafter with prehensile hair hex.

Nope the tiefling tail doesn't let you manipulate things like a hand, only the prehensile has that abbility. That or dip 2 levels into alchemist for the spare arm.

Also, unless you are going for spell perfection route quicken spell is a less then optimal feat choice.

You can upgrade your tail with the grasping tail feat. Will that do the trick? It's worth considering as good as metamagic rods are.

Nope, the grasping tail specifically states you cannot manipulate the item you can only move it from your tail to your hand and back.

The only Magus that can have the ability to use a metamagic rod during spellcombat is the hexcrafter with prehensile hair.

[Rubbrband]

Can the spellblade magus use rods effectively?

[Mathwei ap Niall]

Rubbrband wrote:

Can the spellblade magus use rods effectively?

Not while using spellcombat.

Spellcombat requires you to have a weapon your main hand and your offhand free (casting the spell) for the entire round. A rod requires you to have it in your hand for the time you are casting the spell.
So if you have a weapon in one hand and a rod in the other what hand are you using to cast/hold the spell?

[Cap. Darling]

All magi can of cause take Calikang form and grasp 4 meta rods have a hand free and a hand on there chosen weapon. but they will need to cast monster Physice IV for it to work:)

[Simian]

Random off topic question, targeted at this thread since it is the most recent Magus build conversation I found.

I am researching building a Magus and before I looked at the guides I looked at a couple of different options. When I started looking at the guides I expected to see a magus/eldritch knight build and was surprised when I didn't. It seemed obvious to me but I want to know if there is something I'm missing.

Breakdown of Thought Process:
Magus 15-16/EK 4-5
Pros:
1 extra attack / full attack action

Cons:
Lose the ability to gain 2 wizard spells of every spell tier
Lose the ability to never have to make concentration checks to cast defensively
Lose 1 Magus Arcana
Lose 1 6th lvl spell slot
Caster Level hits 19 instead of 20

Optional:
Trade Counterstrike for a combat feat of choice and +1 to reflex saves

So my thought process is that Action Economy > All, so getting an extra attack per round is worth some of the losses, while significant, from the magus ability.

Again, I'm wondering why I have not seen this build called out as hitting a 16 BAB seems like a high priority to a melee damage archetype, I almost didn't see it as an option not to take EK (arcane archer doesn't really make sense since my magus abilities are melee-centric).

Another build I was looking at is Magus 7/Wizard 3/EK 10

This requires a lot more discussion but again you get a BAB of 16 like above. This build heavily favors a dex based magus and gives you an extra feat in light of that but potentially gets burnt for practiced spellcaster. The reason I chose wizard 3 is because I can still hit lvl 6 spells and after checking this would give access to over 600 wizard spells that the magus does not have access to. This comes at a lot of cost, caster level being a significant one (16 with feat). You lose a lot of magus arcana and your arcane pool is crippled. You do get spell critical which is like the magus arcana with less limitations, but you also have to take broad study so you net out at 2 arcana total. You lose 1 4th, 5th and 6th slot (assuming specialist wizard and bonded item counts as 6th level slot). Given your wizard level is going to be 3 you are limited to like 3 specialist schools that aren't as level dependent, I would say void for +2 all saves, admixture to be able to freely change elemental energy types or controller to get telepathy and shared languages with your charms/dominates.

You could also go arcanist, you would need to get a dm ruling if arcane reservoir and arcane pool can stack (I would rule no but it's worth a shot!). You would lose even more spell slots but gain 2 exploits which could be used to get one of the schools above or a choice of a lot of good bloodlines that aren't too level dependent or a few other decent abilities.

The only sorceror I would consider would be the arcane variant bloodline that lets you use int instead of cha.

The biggest cons for this are the caster level hits, the loss of pretty much all magus arcana and arcane pool and the loss of armor. I would have to really dig into the research but I'm guessing that you could buff yourself up to a similar defensive level with your wizard spells. Which is roughly 75 of each school and like 140 from transmutation.

The benefit vs going pure magus is the spell versatility and action economy. You can get 4 attacks / round + spell, additionally if you crit once in the round you get to cast another spell as a swift action (not limited to a touch spell like the magus arcana). If you run a 15-20 crit range then this is likely to happen almost every round. Also, you can make your melee weapon be your bonded object, in short you're upgrading it at half the normal gold cost.

[Simian]

Oh another possible school would be foresight to get the ability to always act in the surprise round, pretty good power but the downside is that you can't take divination as one of your opposed schools. If you were going arcanist this would be a lot more desirable as you don't get the bonus spells/opposed schools.

[Torke Steelpike]

blashimov wrote:

Dervish dance, dex to damage with scimitar.

Intensify spell.
Shocking grasp.
Everything else is whatever seems fun to you. Hexcrafter and bladebound are both excellent archetypes.

this! A thousand times this. Especially if you go elf. You're gonna have a rough first two levels until you can get dervish dance at level 3 but it picks up. I also like going Kensai Magus, yes you get a diminished spell pool but you get a lot of nice bonuses based off your int score plus access to fighter combat feats. Also the Dimensional Tree looks like a lot of fun if your willing to pull the sheer amount of feats into it (Dimensional Agility, dervish, etc.)