I am playing through Second Darkness, and it is the first adventure path I've done. So far it seems pretty good.
Can't say much more.
Rise of the Runelords is quite enjoyable.
I would avoid Kingmaker for now, as it is very open world from what I understand. Open world tends to mean very little rail-roading, and could end up being overwhelming if it isn't something that you and your party are up to.
Keep in mind I haven't read through or looked at Kingmaker at all, so take this with a large grain of salt.
I would avoid Kingmaker for now, as it is very open world from what I understand. Open world tends to mean very little rail-roading, and could end up being overwhelming if it isn't something that you and your party are up to.
Keep in mind I haven't read through or looked at Kingmaker at all, so take this with a large grain of salt.
No no, you are quite on the spot. Ive run parts 1 and 2 of Kingmaker and it really is quite the endeavor. Quite alot of bookkeeping.
Rise of the Runelords.
The anniversary edition is one of the best RPG products on the market and it has an incredibly strong support by fans as well as developers here on this site. It should also take you up to level 18 IIRC.
Once you're done with it you could either play Curse of the Crimson Throne and Second Darkness (both 3.5, though) for a lot of extra lore and then jump to Shattered Star. Shattered Star is unique in that it assumes the three mentioned APs have actually happened while all other APs do not advance the timeline.
Hopefully soon the group I'm in will be starting on an epic journey from 1st to... well, the idea is 20th-level but we'll see how we go :)
I'm trying to get the group to go with Golarion and Pathfinder (Paizo only) primarily because of the ease of it and abundance of materials and other resources. I'm also pushing for the use of an adventure path for the very same reasons.
The thing is that I only know about the adventure paths by reputation alone. I won't be DM'ing but I'd like to be able to present to the group some ideas on what the best adventure paths are and especially what would be a good bstring of AP's to put together.
Any suggestions welcome and appreciated.
Important point of clarification here-
One adventure path is a series of 6 100 page books which covers a whole campaign's worth of content. Start at level 1, usually hit something in the mid to high teens by the end, and results vary by group, but they'll generally take quite a while to get through. I'm GMing a group that's racing through a whole path every 5 months, but we meet two nights a week and run long. The group where I'm a player only gets together for 3 or 4 hours a week, and we seem to be 2 for 2 on taking 4 and a half years to knock each out. Pretty sure the average is somewhere between the two.
Giving the level range each path covers, if you literally wanted to play through one whole path and then carry that same party on into another, that would just be a complete mess, not only in how much work you'd need to upscale the monsters, but because they all tend to have a general story structure built around starting as fairly average people from humble backgrounds and eventually become major figures in the region/world-or-planes traveling heroes and whatnot, and it'd just be jarring to go from that back to helping the local sheriff or helping guard a wagon train.
If you're just looking for a set of APs which reference each other in some way though, that's easy. Go with the ones set in Varisia- Rise of the Runelords, Curse of the Crimson Throne, Second Darkness, Jade Regent, Shattered Star. CotCT and SD are only included for the sake of a couple quick nods so far as I know, but JR is about a big ol' Oregon Trail style road trip escorting a couple minor NPCs from Runelords (who are promoted to Rather Significant Characters in it), and Shattered Star is the closest thing to a full-on sequel to an existing AP there is (again, to Runelords).
If you were just accidentally using "string of APs" to mean "AP" then... sorry for being such a huge pedant.
In any case, unless there's a particular flavor of game you're really looking for, I would strongly suggest grabbing the anniversary edition of Rise of the Runelords. It, more than any other, is very much written as a sort of general introduction to Golarion, with a lot of thematic variety and for lack of a better term, the most solidly generic feel (as opposed to how other APs generally base everything around a very specific theme setting and tone).
And oh yes, if you are looking at the ones on sale this month, very much worth noting that CotCT, Second Darkness, and Legacy of Fire were all written before the switch to Pathfinder rules (as was the original printing of Runelords, but the AE is updated), so your GM will need to do some converting. d20pfsrd has a good chunk of the relevant stat blocks converted which helps, but still.
I would avoid Kingmaker for now, as it is very open world from what I understand.No no, you are quite on the spot. Ive run parts 1 and 2 of Kingmaker and it really is quite the endeavor. Quite alot of bookkeeping.
This.
To put this in perspectiveThe most you have to do in the first book of Second Darkness is keep track of the Golden Goblin, and in the second book it is keeping track of the events that happen on The Island.
In an open world setting there are a lot of different choices, and everything is spread out. Plot-lines are not open and available initially, but instead need the proper initial hook, you need to make sure that Plot-Line A does not become available until the PCs have received the hook from Plot-Character A.
Furthermore you need to make sure that the PCs don't just waltz into a higher level area and get viciously mauled to death by enemies they can neither outrun nor escape in any fashion.
Open world mean random encounters, and random encounters mean you cannot strictly control XP/Wealth. PCs might unlock all the mysteries, and initial plotlines, but by doing so be way more powerful than the low-level plotlines themselves and therefore just blow through them.
It is harder to keep track of, especially if you do not want to spend all your time rewriting the adventure over and over to fit the PCs.
In rail-roady adventure paths the XP is pretty well set around where you should be at this or that point. In open world there are too many variables for you to know all of them, and the PCs derailing the story or plot-line is so possible that sometimes you have to change random variables to make it work.
One possible one is doing Book 1 of Serpent's Skull (Skulls for Smuggler's Shiv), and then chaining that into the Skull and Shackles AP.
The beginning of Smuggler's Shiv has you being shipwrecked and on a dangerous island full of all kinds of beasties. At the end, the party finds their way off, and normally they'd end up in a city and get roped into an Indiana Jones style search for a lost city (not nearly as much fun as it sounds, sadly, but it has its good points).
Instead of that, you chain it into book 1 of Skull and Shackles, so the ship that picks them up at the end of Smuggler's Shiv is the Wormwood. They get pressganged onto the ship from there (because where else do they have to go?), and that AP proceeds as normal.
Ramping up the challenges somewhat to compensate will be necessary, but could be quite a fun adventure that has the first two adventures taking them from the frying pan to the fire, and the rest being a "Well there ain't no way but up from here" deal.
Level progression, could (loosely) go like this:
Levels 1-3: Smuggler's Shiv
Levels 4-7: Wormwood Mutiny
Levels 8-12: Raiders of the Fever Sea
Levels 13-15: Tempest Rising
Levels 16-18: Island of Empty Eyes
Levels 18-20: Price of Infamy
Levels 20-???: From Hell's Heart
Maybe give them Mythic Tiers or something starting from the end of Price of Infamy so progression doesn't halt.
Or perhaps toning down the challenges of Smuggler's Shiv a bit to make it a 1-2 adventure so it'd go like:
Levels 1-2: Smuggler's Shiv
Levels 3-5: Wormwood Mutiny
Levels 6-8: Raiders of the Fever Sea
Levels 9-12: Tempest Rising
Levels 13-15: Island of Empty Eyes
Levels 16-18: Price of Infamy
Levels 19-20: From Hell's Heart
I dunno. Either way could be pretty darn fun.
While I cannot disagree with the suggestion of Rise of the Runelords Anniversary Edition, I do disagree with the mention of Second Darkness. It took our group about 18 months to play through it. The point of fact is it is very railroady and is written for 3.5 so some conversion would need to be done.
Currently I am running Legacy of Fire and it has a bit of Railroadiness to it. It also was written for 3.5.
One possible one is doing Book 1 of Serpent's Skull (Skulls for Smuggler's Shiv), and then chaining that into the Skull and Shackles AP.
The beginning of Smuggler's Shiv has you being shipwrecked and on a dangerous island full of all kinds of beasties. At the end, the party finds their way off, and normally they'd end up in a city and get roped into an Indiana Jones style search for a lost city (not nearly as much fun as it sounds, sadly, but it has its good points).
Instead of that, you chain it into book 1 of Skull and Shackles, so the ship that picks them up at the end of Smuggler's Shiv is the Wormwood. They get pressganged onto the ship from there (because where else do they have to go?), and that AP proceeds as normal.
.
This is a great idea but to make it easier on a newbie you could just cut down the island encounters somewhat and only level maybe once or twice, then get 'rescued'.
Play out the deserted bit for a while, have some easy encounters and you're golden.
Good call Mr. Rynjin
As to railroading, everyone knows you're running an AP, so they will realize that you need to get from a to b to c etc so long as everyone is ok with that you shouldn't have any problems.
As to railroading, everyone knows you're running an AP, so they will realize that you need to get from a to b to c etc so long as everyone is ok with that you shouldn't have any problems.
This is my favorite, since when I make a 1-day quick-build scenario for them they for some reason decide that they should totally not go anywhere near the adventure.
My favorite thing to do?
"You run into a collision wall as you try to leave town, you just stand there, running in place," or in other "What stands before you is beyond the bounds of the current adventure, please come back after a content patch."
The only thing that I might add is that if you want to give you players an into to Golarion; Definately go Rise Of The Runelords (plus it is excellent). If they die or Finish it (I will guess it my group about 50 6 hour sessions to finish an AP) We just finished Kingmaker at about level 16 and 48 games) then try Curse Of The Crimson Throne, if they die or finish that go with Second Darkness. There is a wealth of Varisia/Golarion lore in those 3 APs.
Or pick a different one (I love techy stuff and Egypt so both of the 2014 APs look AMAZING!).
You should try to get a basic synopsis of every AP and present that information to your group. It's possible that a well received theme will trump the quality of the story writing, if it means everyone is more invested.
I haven't played every AP, but here's my best take on various APs: (forumites: please feel free to correct me if necessary and/or add to my statements)
Jade Regent: Fantasy Asian flavored story; help overthrow an evil ruler and protect the dynasty
Curse of the Crimson Throne: Heavy on urban encounters; investigate an evil queen and fight her minions
Skull & Shackles: Pirate adventure on the high seas; get a pirate ship and do piratey things like naval combat
Kingmaker: Sandbox campaign; explore a wide open space, set up a new kingdom, create a government, army, etc.
Legacy of Fire: Fantasy Middle Eastern flavored story; ends with wacky plane-hopping hijinks
Reign of Winter: Fantasy Russian flavored story; fight witches, ends with wacky plane-hopping hijinks
Carrion Crown: Horror based story; fight classic horror-style monsters like undead, werewolves, etc.
Shattered Star: Seven part McGuffin quest?
This link will take you to a Paizo page which lists the APs with a brief summary for each. The page does not (yet) list the second one for 2014: Iron Gods (taking place in Numeria, with a "Thundarr the Barbarian"-style mix of fantasy society and high - but not well-understood - technology).
As others have noted, Rise of the Runelords (RotR) was originally for 3.5, but PF updates were made for the Anniversary Edition (AE) and the Deluxe Collector's Edition.
Curse of the Crimson Throne (CotCT), Second Darkness (SD), and Legacy of Fire (LoF) were also made for 3.5 and have not been officially updated to PF. Like others have mentioned above, unofficial conversions do exist on-line.
One note about SD: there was a hiccup in the writing/development process, which resulted in some oddities. I would suggest considering running the first two books of SD (AP 13 + 14) with a more mercenary party, and then creating new characters with the motivation care about both the fate of the elves and rest of the world for the rest of the AP (AP 14-18). Just make sure that information picked up by the first party somehow gets passed on to the new party.
The AP currently being published is Wrath of the Righteous. WotR uses the Mythic rules, so I would not advise playing it unless the players and GM are already well-versed in the regular rules.
Some APs end at lower levels than others, such as Council of Thieves at character level 13 or so. If this is a deciding factor, then the GM should check the description of an AP's final instalment before any purchase is made. (And it should be the GM - there are some unavoidable spoilers in the individual instalments' product description pages here at Paizo.) Other APs can end at character level 17 or so.
The best player introduction to Golarion is the Inner Sea Primer (Companion line) and the individual AP's Player's Guide. Other Companion line products will offer player-friendly crunch for various classes, races, faiths, etc.
The best GM introduction to Golarion is the Inner Sea World Guide (Campaign Setting line). Once an AP is chosen, the GM can then pick up various Campaign Setting products which support that AP.
As always, lots of advice can be picked up in the AP-specific sections of the forums here. Just beware of spoilers if you are a player! :)
