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Well this is another attempt at a new class. Again this one is unfinished and if anyone has ideas that could help me flesh out some later abilities I'd appreciate the help.
I present to you my newest class
The Archival Scholar V.1
NEW CLASS: THE ARCHIVAL SCHOLAR (BASED ON THE WATCHERS FROM BUFFY THE VAMPIRE SLAYER): Across the world there lies secret knowledge and lost archives full of pages of lore from the distant past. Seeking out these places and secrets are the members of the Grand Archive. Among their goals are the preservation of knowledge for their patron deity is Elios the human god of knowledge and wisdom. They also consider it their sworn duty to seal away knowledge considered to be too dangerous to be allowed in common circulation (things such as rituals to summong the Elder Evils, plagues that would wipe out virtually all life or other catastrophic things). To do their job they train agents in various arts ranging from strange hand to hand styles to secret research techniques to allow them to find and recall information faster. While the Archival Scholars themselves lack any true capacity to use magic they are a very canny foe and are well versed in the ways and weaknesses of the monsters that would threaten the world. Even the human ones.
The Archival Scholar (field agent)
Hit Die: 1D8
Starting Wealth: 3d6 x 10gp (105gp average) Archival Scholars begin play with an empty book and quill, with three ink wells to record their journeys and observations. Part of the rules of membership in the Grand Archive is that each member keep such journals and deliver them to the Archive when one becomes full.
Skill Ranks per level: 6 + Int modifier
Skills: Appraise (Int), Auspex (Wis), Bluff (Cha), Craft: Any (Int), Disguise (Cha), Diplomacy (Cha), Heal (Wis), Knowledge: All (Int), Linguistics (Int), Perception (Wis), Profession: Any (Wis), Sense Motive (Wis), Sleight of Hand (Dex), Spellcraft (Int)
B.A.B.: same as Bard/Cleric/Rogue
Saves: Good Will, Poor Fort & Ref
Weapon and Armor Proficiencies: The Archival Scholars are proficient with all simple weapons plus the sword cane, rapier, hand crossbow, grappling hook and scorpion whip. Archival Scholars are also proficient with light armor, but not shields.
The Oath: Each member of the Grand Archive swears a binding oath that they will keep the deep secrets of the Order even unto death. This Oath grants a +2 on Will saving throws vs compulsion or charm effects that would lead them to betray the Order or reveal its secrets. (Note: As part of the Oath Archival Scholars forswear training in any arcane spell casting class. While there are Wizards who are members of the Archive the Archival Scholars themselves take this Oath as a sign of faith to their god and to their mission to withhold those things that are too dangerous for mortal minds)
Breadth of Knowledge: An Archival Scholar may add half her Scholar level to all Knowledge skill rolls.
Improved Unarmed Strike: As part of their intense training for field work, and to mitigate the chance they may need to do battle with dark forces the Archival Scholars are trained extensively in unarmed combat. Warriors may not be on hand to guard one's self so being prepared is a necessity. Archival Scholars gain Improved Unarmed Strike as a bonus feat at 1st level.
Spell Book Casting: At 2nd level as part of their training Archival Scholars learn much about magic and its inner workings. While not true spell casters they are able to simulate the effects of certain spells by channeling the energy while casting the spell from a spell book. Each spell cast in this fashion takes one full round per level of the spell to cast and there is a price that the Scholar pays for each spell cast in this manner. Because their bodies are not trained to handle the energies that they channel while casting from the book they take sub-dual damage equal to 1d4 + Int modifier per spell level. (It is possible to go unconscious from using this ability too often in one sitting) This requires a Spellcraft check DC 20 + 2 x spell level
Fighting Style: At 3rd level the Archival Scholar has trained further in the secret hand to hand style of the Archive's agents and learned Kirin Style. (Even if they do not otherwise meet the prerequisites for it)
Adaptation to Foes: At 4th level when the Archival Scholar must engage in melee combat, be it with their limited weaponry or hand to hand skills, she may make a Knowledge check to identify her opponent. If the check succeeds she may add her Intelligence modifier as a dodge bonus to AC as long she is wearing light or no armor.
Perfect Disguise/Knowing What to Say: Studying the various cultures of the known world the Archival Scholar knows that there are times then going undercover or using the fine art of Diplomacy may be necessary to obtain permission to enter certain ruins or to enter the home of a scheming Wizard or nobleman who may have a secret or occult tome that could be extremely dangerous in the wrong hands. Beginning at 4th level the Archival Scholar may add their Intelligence modifier to Bluff, Disguise and Diplomacy rolls after using the appropriate Knowledge skill to determine what their target is likely to want to hear.
Recall: Beginning at 6th level the Scholar has begun to emulate the elders of the Archive and learned to recall obscure information with concentrated effort. Once per day per two levels after gaining this ability after failing a Knowledge check a Scholar may make a Concentration check at a DC 25. If successful the Scholar may make another attempt at the Knowledge check.
Fighting Style 2: Beginning at 6th level the Archival Scholar has mastered the initial points of the Kirin Style and now learns the Kirin Strike as a bonus feat, even if they do not otherwise meet the prerequisites.
Fighting Style 3: Beginning at 9th level the Scholar has mastered the secondary aspects of the Kirin Style and has now learned the third step in the fighting style the Kirin Path feat even if she does not meet all the prerequisites for it.
Terribly underpowered. Also, should probably be a bard (or monk) archetype. Needs a solid hook to set it apart from Archivist Bard.
I like the use of IUS and Ki-Rin style.
+2 from the Oath is fiddly b*&~*$#~. Immunity, or at least "unacceptable" level resistance, for a new save vs. compulsions and it just can't be done with charms.
The core problem: "archival scholar" is a (very)low-level concept.
Research points. A person gains a research point for every hour of library research. They can use these points as pluses to knowledge checks, to hit, or to damage. Probably up to +5, possibly only one thing at a time. Exception, they can add +5 to every skill used in a ritual. Spending 25 research points they can tell if spell research is worth the attempt. Normally they would spend time and gold only to find out the spell is not allowed.
Word of Disruption, 5th level, for one round everyone in front of the caster must make a concentration check to cast or perform a ritual, or it's disrupted. (I saw this used in The Dunwich Horror)
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Research points. A person gains a research point for every hour of library research. They can use these points as pluses to knowledge checks, to hit, or to damage. Probably up to +5, possibly only one thing at a time. Exception, they can add +5 to every skill used in a ritual. Spending 25 research points they can tell if spell research is worth the attempt. Normally they would spend time and gold only to find out the spell is not allowed.
Word of Disruption, 5th level, for one round everyone in front of the caster must make a concentration check to cast or perform a ritual, or it's disrupted. (I saw this used in The Dunwich Horror)
I like it. I'll have to fiddle with the progression a bit on a couple things but I love the concept of Research points and what they could do to enhance the Scholar. I might include saves in that list but only one type at a time per round. (I'm more lenient with my players on spell research. If one of them has an idea I'm not going to allow I don't make them spend the money first, I'll just tell them outright that no I really don't want to deal with that spell.)
Word of Disruption is very nice. I'll think of a formula for the DC and include it in the next iteration.
Many thanks man. :)
@Pupsocket: Well the save from the Oath is only a first level ability. I don't know of any class that gets a blanket immunity to something like charm and compulsion effects straight away. I'm not sure what a good save modifier would be at that level but the +2 vs a specific type of compulsion seemed fair when I was writing it. I'll take a second look and see what I can work out.
well you can make the bonus scale with level.
I REALLY like the concept, the idea of it.
However, it really is under-powered... at least at low levels. That 'Spell book casting'...
At 2nd level as part of their training Archival Scholars learn much about magic and its inner workings. While not true spell casters they are able to simulate the effects of certain spells by channeling the energy while casting the spell from a spell book. Each spell cast in this fashion takes one full round per level of the spell to cast and there is a price that the Scholar pays for each spell cast in this manner. Because their bodies are not trained to handle the energies that they channel while casting from the book they take sub-dual damage equal to 1d4 + Int modifier per spell level. (It is possible to go unconscious from using this ability too often in one sitting) This requires a Spellcraft check DC 20 + 2 x spell level
Lets look at level 6...
6 ranks spellcraft3 class ability
2 average hero int
3 skill focus
5 gloves of elvenkind (or some similar item)
2 fox's cunning (read it out of the boox just beforehand)
that's a quick easy +21. Now at a DC 30 you can...
Telleport at will
Magic Jar at will
Break enchantment
wall of stone
mage's private sanctum
etc
etc
Sure your taking 5d4+20 nonlethal damage... but com'on, we all know ways around that!!!
...unless I missed some limitation in my quick reading...
?
...unless I missed some limitation in my quick reading...
?
it also takes one roynd per level of the spell too cast. Also at level 6, 5d4 +20(average 30) should obliterate must of his hp. Even with subdual damage that isnt a minor cost.
it also takes one roynd per level of the spell too cast....unless I missed some limitation in my quick reading...
?
I got the 1 full round/spell level. The spells I listed where excellent NON combat spells. IN combat, yeah this isn't overpowered.
Also at level 6, 5d4 +20(average 30) should obliterate must of his hp. Even with subdual damage that isnt a minor cost.
I meant we all know ways to be immune to nonlethal damage.
Thanks for helping me clarify what I was suggesting. :)
But did I miss something else?
Selected druid/cleric spells would be helpful, both in combat and support of the party. They wouldn't summon anything alien, but all the abjurations would be prime. They are essentially gatekeepers and their spell selection could reflect that.
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it also takes one roynd per level of the spell too cast....unless I missed some limitation in my quick reading...
?
I got the 1 full round/spell level. The spells I listed where excellent NON combat spells. IN combat, yeah this isn't overpowered.
Also at level 6, 5d4 +20(average 30) should obliterate must of his hp. Even with subdual damage that isnt a minor cost.I meant we all know ways to be immune to nonlethal damage.
Thanks for helping me clarify what I was suggesting. :)
But did I miss something else?
I clarified in my copy of the class that the damage from spellbook casting cannot be mitigated and that the scholar cannot take 10 on the check. The whole point of the channeling is that the scholar's body isn't trained to handle the energy the way a normal magic user's is. Using the spellbooks isn't something they enjoy doing. I may also limit the spells usable to a specific list.
I clarified in my copy of the class that the damage from spellbook casting cannot be mitigated and that the scholar cannot take 10 on the check. The whole point of the channeling is that the scholar's body isn't trained to handle the energy the way a normal magic user's is. Using the spellbooks isn't something they enjoy doing. I may also limit the spells usable to a specific list.I'm sorry, where did it say:
damage from spellbook casting cannot be mitigated
Maybe I missed that?
I may also limit the spells usable to a specific list.
Not entirely necessary... What you could do is change what is needed to cast the spell... Change:
This requires a Spellcraft check DC 20 + 2 x spell level
into 'This requires a caster level check DC X + Y x spell level. Your caster level is equal to your level in the Archival Scholar class'
caster levels are MUCH harder to beef up for a couple copper. :)
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I clarified in my copy of the class that the damage from spellbook casting cannot be mitigated and that the scholar cannot take 10 on the check. The whole point of the channeling is that the scholar's body isn't trained to handle the energy the way a normal magic user's is. Using the spellbooks isn't something they enjoy doing. I may also limit the spells usable to a specific list.I'm sorry, where did it say:damage from spellbook casting cannot be mitigatedMaybe I missed that?
I may also limit the spells usable to a specific list.Not entirely necessary... What you could do is change what is needed to cast the spell... Change:
This requires a Spellcraft check DC 20 + 2 x spell levelinto 'This requires a caster level check DC X + Y x spell level. Your caster level is equal to your level in the Archival Scholar class'
caster levels are MUCH harder to beef up for a couple copper. :)
I haven't updated the version here yet. I meant my copy, the one I'm working on currently :) sorry I should have been more clear. The caster level check does make more sense, I just have to figure out the math....i hate math....we had an arrangement. I leave it alone, it leaves me alone. *sigh* OH well once more into the breach lol.
Ok, i'm heading out for a bit and I'll ponder it during that time. If you've nothing when I return in a few hours, I'll toss my 2cp.
p.s. I love the math. I have spread sheets upon spread sheets of my own various 3.75 variations. My PCs used to call it 3.Scott lol.
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Well I made a couple changes, still working on higher level abilities and expanding the higher range of the lower ones. I took Goth Guru's advice and added a Research Point pool ability as well as another little ability I thought would be interesting.
Archival Scholar V.2
NEW CLASS: THE ARCHIVAL SCHOLAR (BASED ON THE WATCHERS FROM BUFFY THE VAMPIRE SLAYER): Across the world there lies secret knowledge and lost archives full of pages of lore from the distant past. Seeking out these places and secrets are the members of the Grand Archive. Among their goals are the preservation of knowledge for their patron deity is Elios the human god of knowledge and wisdom. They also consider it their sworn duty to seal away knowledge considered to be too dangerous to be allowed in common circulation (things such as rituals to summong the Elder Evils, plagues that would wipe out virtually all life or other catastrophic things). To do their job they train agents in various arts ranging from strange hand to hand styles to secret research techniques to allow them to find and recall information faster. While the Archival Scholars themselves lack any true capacity to use magic they are a very canny foe and are well versed in the ways and weaknesses of the monsters that would threaten the world. Even the human ones.
The Archival Scholar (field agent)
Hit Die: 1D8
Starting Wealth: 3d6 x 10gp (105gp average) Archival Scholars begin play with an empty book and quill, with three ink wells to record their journeys and observations. Part of the rules of membership in the Grand Archive is that each member keep such journals and deliver them to the Archive when one becomes full.
Skill Ranks per level: 6 + Int modifier
Skills: Appraise (Int), Auspex (Wis), Bluff (Cha), Craft: Any (Int), Disguise (Cha), Diplomacy (Cha), Heal (Wis), Knowledge: All (Int), Linguistics (Int), Perception (Wis), Profession: Any (Wis), Sense Motive (Wis), Sleight of Hand (Dex), Spellcraft (Int)
B.A.B.: same as Bard/Cleric/Rogue
Saves: Good Will, Poor Fort & Ref
Weapon and Armor Proficiencies: The Archival Scholars are proficient with all simple weapons plus the sword cane, rapier, hand crossbow, grappling hook and scorpion whip. Archival Scholars are also proficient with light armor, but not shields.
The Oath: Each member of the Grand Archive swears a binding oath that they will keep the deep secrets of the Order even unto death. This Oath grants a +2 (+1 per two levels) on Will saving throws vs compulsion or charm effects that would lead them to betray the Order or reveal its secrets. (Note: As part of the Oath Archival Scholars forswear training in any arcane spell casting class. While there are Wizards who are members of the Archive the Archival Scholars themselves take this Oath as a sign of faith to their god and to their mission to withhold those things that are too dangerous for mortal minds)
Breadth of Knowledge: An Archival Scholar may add half her Scholar level to all Knowledge skill rolls.
Research Points: Beginning at 1st level the Archival Scholar gains a research point for every hour of library research and study. These points may be spent to gain a bonus equal to the amount of points spent (max of +5) on one Know check, attack roll, damage roll or saving throw against a single successfully identified target. The Scholar has a maximum number of research points of 10 / two levels.
(level 1-2=10, 3-4=20, etc).
Improved Unarmed Strike: As part of their intense training for field work, and to mitigate the chance they may need to do battle with dark forces the Archival Scholars are trained extensively in unarmed combat. Warriors may not be on hand to guard one's self so being prepared is a necessity. Archival Scholars gain Improved Unarmed Strike as a bonus feat at 1st level.
Spell Book Casting: At 2nd level as part of their training Archival Scholars learn much about magic and its inner workings. While not true spell casters they are able to simulate the effects of certain spells by channeling the energy while casting the spell from a spell book. Each spell cast in this fashion takes one full round per level of the spell to cast and there is a price that the Scholar pays for each spell cast in this manner. Because their bodies are not trained to handle the energies that they channel while casting from the book they take sub-dual damage equal to 1d4 + Int modifier per spell level, this damage may not be mitigated. (It is possible to go unconscious from using this ability too often in one sitting) This requires a caster level check DC 15 + 2 x spell level. You may not take 10 on this check.
Fighting Style: At 3rd level the Archival Scholar has trained further in the secret hand to hand style of the Archive's agents and learned Kirin Style. (Even if they do not otherwise meet the prerequisites for it)
Archival Secrets: At 3rd level and every three levels thereafter the Archival Scholar learns one of the special secret teachings of the Grand Archive. These teaching are closely guarded secrets and it is strictly forbidden to teach them to anyone outside the Archive's Order.
1. Psychometry lvl 1: The Scholar has learned how to glean the secrets of an object's most recent history. By examining an object for a number of round equal to 2 x their Wis modifier the Scholar may make an Int check DC 20 to gain a flash of insight into the recent past. She sees the events through the eyes of the owner of the object and only the last known events that the object was in its owner's hands for.
Adaptation to Foes: At 4th level when the Archival Scholar must engage in melee combat, be it with their limited weaponry or hand to hand skills, she may make a Knowledge check to identify her opponent. If the check succeeds she may add her Intelligence modifier as a dodge bonus to AC as long she is wearing light or no armor.
Perfect Disguise/Knowing What to Say: Studying the various cultures of the known world the Archival Scholar knows that there are times then going undercover or using the fine art of Diplomacy may be necessary to obtain permission to enter certain ruins or to enter the home of a scheming Wizard or nobleman who may have a secret or occult tome that could be extremely dangerous in the wrong hands. Beginning at 4th level the Archival Scholar may add their Intelligence modifier to Bluff, Disguise and Diplomacy rolls after using the appropriate Knowledge skill to determine what their target is likely to want to hear.
Recall: Beginning at 6th level the Scholar has begun to emulate the elders of the Archive and learned to recall obscure information with concentrated effort. Once per day per two levels after gaining this ability after failing a Knowledge check a Scholar may make a Concentration check at a DC 25. If successful the Scholar may make another attempt at the Knowledge check.
Fighting Style 2: Beginning at 6th level the Archival Scholar has mastered the initial points of the Kirin Style and now learns the Kirin Strike as a bonus feat, even if they do not otherwise meet the prerequisites.
Fighting Style 3: Beginning at 9th level the Scholar has mastered the secondary aspects of the Kirin Style and has now learned the third step in the fighting style the Kirin Path feat even if she does not meet all the prerequisites for it.
I like what you did. But thematically this is starting to feel like an archetype for the inquisitor... But i guess they could just be two different 'solders' in the watcher army...
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I like what you did. But thematically this is starting to feel like an archetype for the inquisitor... But i guess they could just be two different 'solders' in the watcher army...
Well like I said they're kinda based off the Watchers from Buffy the Vampire Slayer. Only not so, you know, evil in how they go about things. They may be underhanded now and again to prevent certain things like C'thulu rituals from getting out, but they do try to not go around poisoning people to take away their magic so they can "test" them.
I'm extrapolating a lot based on what I read about the Watchers and how I see this class, and I don't really mean for them to be like the Inquisitors. This is what I mean when I say I'm terrible at classes lol, I am trying to get better though and I won't unless I keep at it. :)
I appreciate the feedback and it's the only way I can take a look and see what needs work.
i love the idea of it. I always enjoyed when Giles got a tough!
Giles used to be a demon summoner nicknamed ripper when he was young. They wouldn't poison people, especially if they could recruit them.
There could be a group of wizards, who compete for resources, called the learned men. They would be loosely based on the "Men of Letters". As friendly enemies, agents of both will often go after the same targets and trade things.
sadly... I know ALL about giles... sad sad little man I am.
I once used the argument, 'yeah, but Angel is a way cooler show'. Last time I was ever picked for sports teams... :'(
I was going to allow research as possible for anyone who can read and write. Since 25 research is necessary for making a blueprint(For a catapult or pistol) it's essential for an engineer.
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I was going to allow research as possible for anyone who can read and write. Since 25 research is necessary for making a blueprint(For a catapult or pistol) it's essential for an engineer.
Research is a thing, but since I'm not allowing guns in the setting that's not an issue lol. Other things could certainly be researched....maybe a bonus based on level. maybe +2 every two or three levels?
You're all set for your setting. Still, lots of people on these boards trade advice for things they can use in their setting. For example, the Pathfinder in the Sky GM could introduce Archival Scholar as someone preventing the ritual that would cause the islands to fall to earth.
I recommend the bonus as something just for your class, while everyone else will have to take it as a feat, and not get the extra bonus.
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Your all set for your setting. Still, lots of people on these boards trade advice for things they can use in their setting. For example, the Pathfinder in the Sky GM could introduce Archival Scholar as someone preventing the ritual that would cause the islands to fall to earth.
I recommend the bonus as something just for your class, while everyone else will have to take it as a feat, and not get the extra bonus.
Ah okay. It's a cool idea, now I just have to work out where it fits in and how to adjust it for level increases. You've been a big help man and I appreciate it.
Since they are not mighty bolt lobbers, I recommend letting them add their level to the amount of research they gain daily, and how much they can hold total. Also, did you give them use magic device? That alone has made many bards not lame.
I think they formed just after Starfall. They are the guardians of the ritual that called down the Starstone.
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Since they are not mighty bolt lobbers, I recommend letting them add their level to the amount of research they gain daily, and how much they can hold total. Also, did you give them use magic device? That alone has made many bards not lame.
I hadn't originally but it does make sense the more I've thought about it. I worked on a couple races to get the thoughts flowing again so I'll be working on this one again this week, so hopefully I'll have something to add soon.
Again man many thanks for the advice and suggestions.