In the concentraion rules:
(...)If the spell interferes with you or distracts you in some other way, the DC is the spell's saving throw DC + the level of the spell you're casting.(...)
So if a caster misses the For save (not the best for a wiz) he has to make a Concentration Checks (DC about 13+tried spell level for a 16 casting score) for every spells in the next minute, unless the Flare is dispeled?
Other spells causing any condition would also have such an effect then, or I'm I missing something?
You only have to make a concentration check for being affected by a spell when the effect occurs while you're attempting to cast. So for example, if you readied an action to cast Flare when you see the enemy Wizard start to cast a spell, and he failed his save, that would force the enemy Wizard to make a concentration check.
If you cast Flare during your normal turn, it would not force a check the next time the Wizard cast a spell*.
*The one caveat to this is if the spell causes ongoing damage, but in that case the concentration check is not for the spell but because the caster is taking damage while he attempts to cast.
(...)
*The one caveat to this is if the spell causes ongoing damage, but in that case the concentration check is not for the spell but because the caster is taking damage while he attempts to cast.
The full text that brought it up is the following:
Spell: If you are affected by a spell while attempting to cast a spell of your own, you must make a concentration check or lose the spell you are casting. If the spell affecting you deals damage, the DC is 10 + the damage taken + the level of the spell you're casting.
If the spell interferes with you or distracts you in some other way, the DC is the spell's saving throw DC + the level of the spell you're casting. For a spell with no saving throw, it's the DC that the spell's saving throw would have if a save were allowed (10 + spell level + caster's ability score).
The "interferes with you or distracts you in some other way," is the non-damaging conditions part I'm intrigued with.
That DC is pretty trivial as well.
My understanding has always been that in order for the other caster's spell to "interfere with you or distract you in some other way", it had to occur while you were actually casting. In other words, I've always believed it was the mechanics for interrupting another spell caster with a readied action (or immediate action) spell cast.
To offer scenarios as an example, we'll have Sorcerer and Wizard having a duel. Sorcerer wins initiative and goes first.
Sorcerer readies an action to cast Flare if the Wizard begins to cast a spell..
Wizard starts to cast a spell.
Sorcerer's readied action triggers and he casts Flare; the Wizard fails his save and is dazzled. Sorcerer's readied action ends.
Wizard continues casting a spell; because he was distracted by Flare, he has to make a concentration check to cast successfully.
Scenario 2
Sorcerer casts Flare. Wizard fails his saving throw and is dazzled. Sorcerer's action ends.
Wizard casts Burning Hands. Even though he was a target of Flare, the effect didn't happen while he was casting, so no concentration check is required.
My understanding has always been that in order for the other caster's spell to "interfere with you or distract you in some other way", it had to occur while you were actually casting. In other words, I've always believed it was the mechanics for interrupting another spell caster with a readied action (or immediate action) spell cast.
(...)
I understand what you mean but they seem to associate the "interfere with you or distract you" with the "If you are affected by a spell while attempting to cast a spell of your own" that is specified seperatly from basic damaging attacks.
But I'll admit that Flare has an Instanteneous Duration so it's not a clear spell-effect.
But what about Bane and/or Doom with minute/level durations? You are clearly "affected by a spell while attempting to cast a spell of your own" ...
I am fairly certain the intent is that it's local to the interrupting action.
Having a disease, while distracting, isn't going to force a caster level check for every spell you cast.
I am fairly certain the intent is that it's local to the interrupting action.
Having a disease, while distracting, isn't going to force a caster level check for every spell you cast.
It's clear that there are only the combat/damage, "while riding" or "under the weather" (maybe including diseases ;-)) situations that involve non-spell situations.
But it's the continuing spell-caused non-damage conditions that seem like an interesting unexpected option.
I like to consider and include various options for the PCs/NPCs situations.
Honelsty, I was looking for some house-ruling base for casting while affected by a condition that affects all combat or skill situations but usually don't affect casting. So I want to figure out all that exists requiring concentration checks.
Yes, and that's why I made the comment about diseases.
'While casting your own' clearly indicates that you must attempt the distraction during the action in which the opponent is casting his spell, aka using a readied action to act on his turn, when he declares he's casting.
If he's casting a spell with a full-round casting time, though, then you could cast it any time during that round and distract him.
'While casting your own' clearly indicates that you must attempt the distraction during the action in which the opponent is casting his spell, aka using a readied action to act on his turn, when he declares he's casting.
(...)
I hate to go into RAW vs RAI argument but other situations use 'While casting your own' in other desciption that don't involve specifically timed conditions:
Grappled or pinned while casting: 10 + grappler's CMB + spell level
Vigorous motion while casting: 10 + spell level
Wind with rain or sleet while casting: 5 + spell level
Entangled while casting: 15 + spell level
The last one is a good exemple: you don't have to ready the throwing of a Tanglefoot bag (and hitting) to have the caster roll a concentration to cast on his turn.
The last one is a good exemple: you don't have to ready the throwing of a Tanglefoot bag (and hitting) to have the caster roll a concentration to cast on his turn.
But that is specifically because the tanglefoot bag inflicts the Entangled condition on the target, which is an ongoing effect specifically called-out by the concentration rules.
Grappled is likewise an ongoing condition. Vigorous motion, while not a condition per se, is a constant that occurs while you're casting the spell - the same thing with wind-blown rain or sleet. In all of those cases, the 'effect' is forcing a concentration check because the 'effect' is occurring while you're attempting to cast.
Flare has an ongoing effect (dazzled) but that effect is not called out as one of the ongoing effects that force a concentration check (nor does the condition itself mention that it forces a check).
(...) In all of those cases, the 'effect' is forcing a concentration check because the 'effect' is occurring while you're attempting to cast.
Flare has an ongoing effect (dazzled) but that effect is not called out as one of the ongoing effects that force a concentration check (nor does the condition itself mention that it forces a check).
I fully agree that only some conditions specify the need of a concentration (that's what got me checking). But it's the part:
(...)(...) while attempting to cast (...) If the spell interferes with you or distracts you in some other way the DC (concentration) is the spell's saving throw DC + the level of the spell you're casting.
(...)
That basicaly brought me to the question: If the caster "endures while casting" a Condition caused by a spell, does that mean he has to roll a concentration?
To me, it make's sense that you have those bumps in the road (not usualy high DCs as mentionned by M(!)EV). I'd probably include the non-spell ones (not sure of the DCs) but that not in the rules.