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A glorious day to all my fellow Pathfinders. I wanted to post here because I have read all the materials and just finished playing my first Pathfinder society game this last Saturday which was a ton of fun (big shout-out to the DFW Venture crew, they rock) and look forward to doing it again.
My primary issue right now is I am confused on when I may purchase equipment in general. If I am reading this correctly, then I am to assume that:
1) The only time equipment (whether from the Chronicle record or Equipment lists from the official books) may be bought is ONLY at the end of the scenario you just played. If you forget to buy equipment here, tough, you are basically screwed for your next play through. If this is so, I may be in trouble as we were tight on time and the crew needed to setup the next gaming session so I was kind of in a pickle as I could have used some help/advice on what items I should purchase. Is there a "grace" or "forgiveness" or "sympathy" check from the GMs on this since it was my first time playing? I don't want any rules broken or bent so if this is not proper then that is how it will be.
2) I used 2PP at the end of my first gaming session to purchase a wand of cure light wounds (50 charges) for my character as all of us found ourselves in very close life or death situations during our first game. However upon realization this morning, I don't think my character (lvl 1 Samurai with 0 in Use Magic Device) can actually use this item on himself can he? If not then I just wasted 2PP. Oh well, lesson learned I suppose.
3) Browsing these forums I've seen quite a few threads from veteran and more advanced players talk about how irritated they are at new level 1 players for not being "boy scout" levels of prepared for their first adventure. While I did my best, apparently it wasn't enough. Of course if I can no longer purchase that equipment as stated in point #1 then I may be causing some frustration again. So I ask you now fellow Pathfinders, what suggestions would you give me for equipment/items to pick up for my next adventure.
Samurai-1: Sword Saint Arch, 527GP currently. I currently own a rangers kit for some everyday survival gear and the wand I purchased with my PP at the end of my first gaming session. I used up all my potions on my first session so I was going to purchase more, until I read that all equipment/items may only be purchased at the end of a session. Whoops. Any suggestions and tips for a new player are greatly appreciated.
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IrishWonda, let’s see if I can shed some light.
1) You can usually make purchases at the beginning of a scenario as well (after the VC briefing and before you have to travel to Mount Shabubu to die trying to recover the ParaCountess' lost underpants or some other nonsense), or any time during a scenario that you are in a settlement large enough to buy what you want. You just need to let the GM know you need to make some purchases, and then mark them on your chronicle.
2) Virtually every character in PFS, by an unspoken social contract, is expected to at least have a wand of CLW of their own. You will find someone in most parties who can burn those charges for you in between combats, whether it be a ranger, paladin, cleric, druid, oracle, or simply someone who has put some points into Use Magic Device. Your 2 PP are NOT wasted.
3) Don’t sweat the nimrods on these boards, most of us are nice to newbies.
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1) The only time equipment (whether from the Chronicle record or Equipment lists from the official books) may be bought is ONLY at the end of the scenario you just played.
Not at all; you can buy stuff whenever your PC is able to. If a scenario starts in a big city (and many of them do), you're quite within your rights to give the GM a list of equipment you wish to purchase (for bonus points, have it written on an index card, with prices) at the start of a session before or just after the briefing. Just make sure to transfer the list of equipment bought onto the chronicle at the end of the session.
2) I used 2PP at the end of my first gaming session to purchase a wand of cure light wounds (50 charges) for my character as all of us found ourselves in very close life or death situations during our first game. However upon realization this morning, I don't think my character (lvl 1 Samurai with 0 in Use Magic Device) can actually use this item on himself can he? If not then I just wasted 2PP. Oh well, lesson learned I suppose.
It isn't a waste at all; in fact, it's an excellent purchase. There will usually be someone in the group who can use the wand on you (e.g. a ranger, paladin, witch, etc.) and it means they don't have to delve into their own resources to keep you at full health.
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1) In theory, yes, you should mark what you want to buy and have the GM approve it before you leave the table. For practical reasons, that almost never happens. Just mark what you want to buy on the chronicle so that future GMs can check it and make sure it's on the level.
2) EVERYONE should buy a wand of cure light wounds ASAP. Even if you can't use it yourself, about half the classes in the game can activate it even without UMD, and they can use it on you. It's quite rare to be in a party who doesn't have someone to activate it. You probably still want to carry a couple of potions for emergency healing in combat, when the guy with your wand may not be able to do it.
3) You should find the thread "How to Survive First Level in PFS" or something like that. It'll give you the rundown on what you should have. Off the top of my head, I would suggest: Alchemist fire to deal with swarms; a cold iron morningstar to cover bludgeoning, piercing, and cold iron for DR; a light source; rope; and an oil of magic weapon
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3) You should find the thread "How to Survive First Level in PFS" or something like that. It'll give you the rundown on what you should have. Off the top of my head, I would suggest: Alchemist fire to deal with swarms; a cold iron morningstar to cover bludgeoning, piercing, and cold iron for DR; a light source; rope; and an oil of magic weapon
Rangers kit takes care of most of that. I will pick up some oil though of magic weapon. Sounds like it would help out my katana a bit. Looks like I just need to pick up some extra potions of cure light wounds and will be good to go for round 2.
Thanks for the replies, and I will definitely try to find that thread. Good to know we can do purchases in towns before we start off on our adventures. Was really feeling that purchasing power was limited in this game if they could only buy supplies at the end of a session.
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Most of the veteran players in our neck of the woods are pretty understanding of Level One characters - especially those run by new players. The fact is, you usually don't get enough money until the time you hit level 2 to be that level of boy scout prepared. So, you do your best to contribute and try not to get killed until then.
You've made a good start with providing your own wand of CLW. It's been said above, but you don't usually need to be able to use it - a lot of the players of healing-capable classes don't take kindly to being responsible for the healing of the entire group, and are perfectly willing to use your wand to heal you if asked.
For your convenience, this is the thread that RainyDayNinja was referring to. Jiggy offers some wonderful advice there, and it's worth reading.
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Related, shameless plugs to two articles written at the GA PFS boards that are related to your questions:
PFS field Survival Guide - the original from where the Paizo one spawned
What can 2 Prestige Points get you?
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Wow, lots of great posts all around. Thanks for the assistance everyone. My final (hopefully) question comes to asking about the price for Potions of Cure Light Wounds. The core rulebook states the cost for "making" these potions, but I can't find what the cost is for "purchasing" them. Is it the same as crafting?
Spell lvl (1) x Casters level (uhh 1 for me I suppose) x 50gp = 50gp/potion? Is that correct?
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@ Irish - yes, level 1 potions are all 50gp. I wouldn't have more than 1 healing potion though. They are pretty bad action-economy wise. Move action to take them out (provokes) and standard action to drink them (provokes).
But it may be the last recourse in combat.
@thejeff - retrain rules are indeed in effect until he plays an adventure at level 2. He may sell back any oh his gear for 100% sell price instead of 50%. However, consumables are still spent if he used them.
50 go should be correct for 1st lvl potions made either by alchemist or clerics making potions at lower lvls.
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Spell lvl (1) x Casters level (uhh 1 for me I suppose) x 50gp = 50gp/potion? Is that correct?
Just for your reference, this is correct, but the caster level would be the minimum caster level for SOMEONE to make the potion. In PFS, all magic items are made by wizards/clerics/druids when possible.
So for a level 1 potion, it would be SL(1) x CL(1) x 50 = 50gp
For a level 2 potion, it would be SL(2) x CL(3) x 50 = 300gp
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Crafting is half the cost of purchasing, so you'd double the crafting cost, but there's an easier way:
There's a table in the Core Rulebook under the Potions section with the cost, but here's the table as part of the PRD. Also note that in PFS you always assume items with caster level were created by wizards or clerics of the lowest possible level.
Level 1 potions from a Cleric or Wizard are 50gp, though, so I wonder if you were looking at the explanation for pricing and thinking that it's the cost of crafting when it's actually the cost of purchase.
edit: Wow. Really? Sniped 4 times?
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Looking at this link, How to Survive First Level, are we sure they have got that armor enhancement cost correct as well as the armor bonus? I'm sure they do as I am a complete newbie but the math doesn't make sense.
He says its a good idea to have a "masterwork" armor equipped which could cost anywhere from 175-350gp to have up to a potential +3 to AC.
But in the rulebook, it says that a "masterwork" item only lessens an armor check penalty by 1. The cost of actually enhancing an armor piece to +1 is its base enhancement squared x 1000gp right?
So to actually get a +1 to my Kikko Armor (what my Samurai is wearing right now) would cost 1*1*1000gp = 1000gp?
I must be missing something. If making my armor masterwork for 175-350gp would give me a +2 or +3 to my AC it definitely sounds worth it. I just need to know how the pricing for enhancing armor and weapons actually works because the core rulebook doesn't seem to have a section showing that or I am blind. Probably the latter.
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It's the purchase of a breastplate or chain shirt that makes the +2 or 3. With only 150 gold to start, you can't afford either of those. You're usually upgrading:
Medium Armour - Hide (+4 AC) to Mwk Breastplate (+6 AC)
Light Armour - Leather (+2 AC) to Mwk Chain Shirt (+4 AC)
Two things about the choice of Mwk at first level:
1) If you're trying to minimize the amount of money you spend over your career, you buy the armour you want to finish your career with as soon as possible. That means masterwork _fill_in_the_blank_ armour at 1st level and then add enchantments to it as you level.
2) You may not think -1ACP means much, but when you're rolling swim checks to avoid drowning, it makes a difference - especially at 1st level when your skill ranks are limited.
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It's the purchase of a breastplate or chain shirt that makes the +2 or 3. With only 150 gold to start, you can't afford either of those. You're usually upgrading:
Medium Armour - Hide (+4 AC) to Mwk Breastplate (+6 AC)
Light Armour - Leather (+2 AC) to Mwk Chain Shirt (+4 AC)Two things about the choice of Mwk at first level:
1) If you're trying to minimize the amount of money you spend over your career, you buy the armour you want to finish your career with as soon as possible. That means masterwork _fill_in_the_blank_ armour at 1st level and then add enchantments to it as you level.
2) You may not think -1ACP means much, but when you're rolling swim checks to avoid drowning, it makes a difference - especially at 1st level when your skill ranks are limited.
Got it. That makes a whole lot more sense. So it may be wise for me to say sell this Kikko armor (15gp woo) and get a Mwk Breastplate instead even though it would only increase my AC by 1, it would give me a -1ACP which brings me back down to my original penalty that the Kikko armor carried. Unless other samurai players recommend always go Heavy armor and save up for a Mwk O-yoroi. Might be saving a while for that one (1,950gp ouch).
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About the purchasing thing, I know the rules say that all buying of equipment must happen during a session, but it doesn't actually work that way. People take home the chronicle sheets, look stuff up in books, and buy what they want. Just be sure to note it on the chronicle sheet, and you'll be set for your next session.
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Got it. That makes a whole lot more sense. So it may be wise for me to say sell this Kikko armor (15gp woo) and get a Mwk Breastplate instead even though it would only increase my AC by 1, it would give me a -1ACP which brings me back down to my original penalty that the Kikko armor carried. Unless other samurai players recommend always go Heavy armor and save up for a Mwk O-yoroi. Might be saving a while for that one (1,950gp ouch).
1. While you are level 1, you are allowed to resell gear back at 100% price, so kikko armor youd get back your 30gp.
2. I would say that for a sword saint, (unless for some reason you have TONS of DEX) it is probably worth it to go heavy armor. You are at the end of the day a frontline fighter since you will not be mounted, so armor is your main way of defense. Full plate will be better than Oi-yoroi unless you have +2 dex modifier, or just want to look "eastern" for flavor.
Even if you have to save for a few levels for full plate, I'd get a breastplate in the meantime (or four-mirror armor for SUPER CHEAP).
About the purchasing thing, I know the rules say that all buying of equipment must happen during a session, but it doesn't actually work that way. People take home the chronicle sheets, look stuff up in books, and buy what they want. Just be sure to note it on the chronicle sheet, and you'll be set for your next session.
Exactly this.
Also, being first level, just keep in mind you are right now limited to the "Always Available" list or whatever purchasable items that have been listed on your chronicle sheets. (With the exception, as you had correctly done so, in using Prestige Points to buy a item)
When you raise your Fame higher (Prestige Awards) you will eventually gain a gold amount you can buy any single one item that is under that amount.
For example, I believe when you hit 5 Fame, you can buy any singular item worth 500 GP or less. And that will increase the more you raise your Fame.
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@Hobbun: Sort of, although the phrasing could be clearer.
The chart is on Page 26 of the Guide to Pathfinder Society Organized Play, at least for v4.3. Version 5.0 is probably going to be out sometime before GenCon in August.
That Fame limit is per item, not for a only a single item purchased.
With sufficient money on hand, and 5 Fame, you could buy any number of PFS-legal magical items that cost 500 gold or less apiece.
If you have any questions on PFS item legality, you would use the information in the Guide cited above, and the Additional Resources page, to determine legal source books and legal items in those source books. Note that PFS only allows Paizo published material as sources.
Remember that Fame is your cumulative total of PP earned, but will not get decreased when you spend PP for whatever purpose. For example, from your post, after your first game, your Samurai currently has 2 Fame and 0 PP after spending two PP for a Wand of Cure Light Wounds.
@IrishWonda: You might want to get a spiked gauntlet, as well. That way you can still get AoOs and threaten, but still have the opportunity to use your special Iaijutsu move...
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Okay here is a question that just came to mind. From some of the posts here people have said it is perfectly reasonable to complete a scenario, take your sheets home, pour over your resources, and then decide what you want to buy. Natural right?
However, the GM needs to know what you bought so.....do I mark it on the Chronicle sheet they have already signed off on? Or do I just wait until we're in a town at the start of our next scenario, tell the GM I need to buy/sell, buy the equipment then, and then add it to the end of my Chronicle sheet from THAT scenario? What if we DON'T start off or interact with a town in the next scenario? Are you screwed out of buying your items/gear?
2nd off-topic but clearly game-related question that has been confusing me. What is a BOON? All I've been able to learn is that they are given out at conventions. I see people keep talking about BOONs; and how they can't play say a kitsune, tengu, or tiefling, etc. without the use of a BOON because they are not legal races.......except they are. They have been listed as officially sanctioned races in Paizo published products. So what exactly are they meaning when they say they can't play as a certain race because they don't have a BOON?
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However, the GM needs to know what you bought so.....do I mark it on the Chronicle sheet they have already signed off on? Or do I just wait until we're in a town at the start of our next scenario, tell the GM I need to buy/sell, buy the equipment then, and then add it to the end of my Chronicle sheet from THAT scenario? What if we DON'T start off or interact with a town in the next scenario? Are you screwed out of buying your items/gear?
I myself go home and write down all my purchases in my last chronicle sheet. There is usually no need for the GM to initial every and each of your purchases. Just make sure they are marked so that if you say "I totally bought a potion of remove blindness" and you are questioned, you can just pull out the sheet and show it.
2nd off-topic but clearly game-related question that has been confusing me. What is a BOON?
Two part answer. A "boon" is the common name for a special chronicle sheet (looks exactly the same as the ones you get after a scenario), but with 0 xp and 0 gold. It has a bonus printed on it that you can then apply to another PFS character you own. For example, there may be a convention boon that allows you to start with 3 traits instead of two, or pick a Tien weapon to gain proficiency with.
The most "famous" convention boons are race boons. They unlock races to be played in PFS. Note that NOT all races published by Paizo are legal off the bat. Until last year, only Core Rulebook races were legal. Last Gencon, Aasimars, Tieflings and Tengus were opened up for everyone (before, you needed a convention boon that let you play them).
Just because something is published by Paizo doesn't make it PFS legal I am afraid. For what is legal and not legal, visit the Additional Resources page. As you can see there (under the Advanced Race Guide section), for example Nagaji, Wayangs and Kitsunes are not currently allowed as races unless you own a boon that allows it.
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Like CRobledo said, most people just take their chronicle sheet home and write their purchases on it. In game, the assumption is that your character is spending time between missions hanging out at the Pathfinder Lodge in a major city (usually Absalom or Magnimar, sometimes Goka), where anything is available for purchase.
A little more clarification on boons: Actually, a boon is something on a chronicle, printed in the center section near the available equipment list, that gives your character an additional bonus of some sort that you wouldn't normally have.
For instance, in an adventure I recently ran, the players fought a dragon. The chronicle sheet for that adventure has a boon on it that gives them a one time bonus in any future scenario where they fight another dragon. Only characters that actually defeated the dragon in this adventure get that boon. If they all died or ran away from the dragon without killing it, or before even getting to the dragon, then the GM would cross that boon off the chronicle sheet, since they didn't earn it.
But besides chronicles for playing adventures, there are additional chronicles that you can get which only have a boon on them, and nothing else. These are like what CRobledo described - 0 XP, 0 gold, just the boon on the chronicle sheet. These are given out, generally as "door prizes" at conventions, and they unlock options for your character that you wouldn't normally have, including some boons that give you the option to play a race that isn't normally allowed in Society play.
@Hobbun: Sort of, although the phrasing could be clearer.
The chart is on Page 26 of the Guide to Pathfinder Society Organized Play, at least for v4.3. Version 5.0 is probably going to be out sometime before GenCon in August.
That Fame limit is per item, not for a only a single item purchased.
With sufficient money on hand, and 5 Fame, you could buy any number of PFS-legal magical items that cost 500 gold or less apiece.
That is what I was trying to say, we are talking about the same thing here. You just said it more clearly than myself. :)
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@CRobledo and Fromper:
Excellent. At least now I won't feel like a complete putz when reading all these topics about how someone's X & Y Boon characters are nowhere as good as they thought they would be and wanted advice from other players yet no one could help them when I am thinking to myself, "WHY NOT!" The resource books are right there, you could make one too!"
Now I know, and knowing is half the battle!
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@CRobledo and Fromper:
Excellent. At least now I won't feel like a complete putz when reading all these topics about how someone's X & Y Boon characters are nowhere as good as they thought they would be and wanted advice from other players yet no one could help them when I am thinking to myself, "WHY NOT!" The resource books are right there, you could make one too!"
Now I know, and knowing is half the battle!
The other half involves sharpened edges and heavy blunt objects. :-)