Ultimate Campaign - Question about buildings


Product Discussion


Hi, there,

after a first glimpse I habe some questions about the buildings in the kingdom section:

1. The Arena gives Stability +4 and Fame +1.
In the old Kingmaker, it also halves the consumption penalty for festival (or now holiday) edicts.
Has this been changed or is this an error?

2. The bureau gives +1 economy, +1 stability, and - 1 Loyality.
It costs 10 BP and needs two lots. Seems a bit expensive for having a penalty in loyality and only +1 in each of the others.
Is this correct or do I miss something?
The mill has also +1 to both economy and stabilty, no penalty, but costs only 6 BP and 1 lot.
And the monastery cost 16 BP, needs 2 lot, but gives only +1 stabilty.

Could you check these?


They've also forgotten to put in both the stats and the picture for the brothel while keeping it in the discount section of the Arena, Black Market, and Theater. Brothel is even mentioned in the Kingdom Events Drug Den, Plague, and Slavers so it's definitely suppose to be in there.

Designer, RPG Superstar Judge

"Brothel" was changed to "Dance Hall" late in editing, but some of the text references were missed. The icon is on page 224, row 1, column 2.


The Everflowing Spring gives no benefits at all.


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Sean K Reynolds wrote:
"Brothel" was changed to "Dance Hall" late in editing, but some of the text references were missed. The icon is on page 224, row 1, column 2.

So the main dance is the horizontal mamba?

Designer, RPG Superstar Judge

Evil Midnight Lurker wrote:
The Everflowing Spring gives no benefits at all.

It provides no benefits to the kingdom-building mechanics, but that doesn't mean it provides no benefits to the people in your settlement.


Sean K Reynolds wrote:
Evil Midnight Lurker wrote:
The Everflowing Spring gives no benefits at all.
It provides no benefits to the kingdom-building mechanics, but that doesn't mean it provides no benefits to the people in your settlement.

Other sources of fresh water actually do provide benefits, though. Productivity, say.

It seems like there should at least be a note stating that it provides no game benefits, otherwise... well, it looks like a typo.

Designer, RPG Superstar Judge

Benefits like the Cistern... which adds Stability +1, costs 6 BP, and fills 1 lot (whereas the Everflowing Spring has no stat bonuses, costs less, and doesn't fill a lot).

My point is, just because we don't explain why something is X instead of Y, or that this option gives X but a similar option doesn't, doesn't mean it's an error.

(It doesn't mean it ISN'T an error, but in this case it isn't.)


Sven Gerkens wrote:

Hi, there,

after a first glimpse I habe some questions about the buildings in the kingdom section:

1. The Arena gives Stability +4 and Fame +1.
In the old Kingmaker, it also halves the consumption penalty for festival (or now holiday) edicts.
Has this been changed or is this an error?

2. The bureau gives +1 economy, +1 stability, and - 1 Loyality.
It costs 10 BP and needs two lots. Seems a bit expensive for having a penalty in loyality and only +1 in each of the others.
Is this correct or do I miss something?
The mill has also +1 to both economy and stabilty, no penalty, but costs only 6 BP and 1 lot.
And the monastery cost 16 BP, needs 2 lot, but gives only +1 stabilty.

Could you check these?

But what about these?

Designer, RPG Superstar Judge

Guys, I'm not going to get into explaining why X is the price it is and gives the rewards it does. I don't have time in the work day (or in my free time) to write 3,000 words on why the 4,000 words on buildings in the book are statted the way they are, just as the Core Rulebook doesn't explain that the wizard and the fighter only get 2 ranks per level even though the wizard is supposed to know a lot more than a fighter, and just as the NFL doesn't explain why a touchdown is worth 6 points rather than 5 or 7.

Sometimes you just have to accept the data you're given. Or, if you don't want to accept that data, change it, that's okay.


With respect, Sean, it doesn't need a 3000 words to say whether or not the omission of that Arena feature in Ultimate Campaign was an intentional decision or an editing error.

Nor was it an unreasonable question. There are three Edict types and there used to be three buildings that modified them. Now two of those buildings - Cathedral and Waterfront - still have that ability and one - Arena - seems to have lost it. It's really not an unreasonable suspicion to wonder if it slipped out in editing or else whether it should perhaps also have been removed from the other two buildings?

Yes, we could change it if we don't like it. But step one to that is finding out whether it was ever intended in the first place?


Sven Gerkens wrote:


2. The bureau gives +1 economy, +1 stability, and - 1 Loyality.
It costs 10 BP and needs two lots. Seems a bit expensive for having a penalty in loyality and only +1 in each of the others.
Is this correct or do I miss something?
The mill has also +1 to both economy and stabilty, no penalty, but costs only 6 BP and 1 lot.
And the monastery cost 16 BP, needs 2 lot, but gives only +1 stabilty.

Could you check these?

I am not a designer, but these seem pretty simple. The bureau's downside is the Loyalty penalty, the mill's downside is that it has to be built on a waterfront, and the monastery requires two lots and doesn't give the Economy boost the other two have.

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