Settle this disagreement


Rules Questions


I know ultimately the DM's decision is final but i still wanted clarification.

I have a monk/druid gestalt character.

Can you use flurry of blows then secondary attacks?

like turn into a bear, flurry of blows, then bite?

if i can not, is there a way to do so thru feats?

I know of feral combat training, but i was told that would only let me use natural attacks in my flurry of blows, not in addition to.

how are these monk/druids using wildshape then getting massive amounts of attacks?!


No you can't. Flurry of blows is its own Full-round action. There is a different full-round action (Full-Round Attack) that lets you use iterative attacks and/or natural attacks in a round. You can't do both actions in a round. There aren't feats that let you do this either. Feral combat training as you said lets you use your natural weapons in a flurry of blows, but you can never take both your FoB attacks and natural attacks in the same round.


What Tarantula said.


damn, so whats the point of me taking feral combat training and all that?


Under Natural Attacks
"You can make attacks with natural weapons in combination with attacks made with a melee weapon and unarmed strikes, so long as a different limb is used for each attack."

Under Flurry of Blows
Starting at 1st level, a monk can make a flurry of blows as a full-attack action. When doing so he may make one additional attack using any combination of unarmed strikes or attacks with a special monk weapon (kama, nunchaku, quarterstaff, sai, shuriken, and siangham) as if using the Two-Weapon Fighting feat (even if the monk does not meet the prerequisites for the feat).

Natural attack can be used in combination with unarmed strike or with melee weapons. Flurry of blows uses unarmed strikes and melee weapons. The action used doesn't matter as long as you are making more than one attack. Flurry of blows is two attacks or more it counts as attacks.

Now there could another reason why you can't, I don't know what it is but it's not because FOB is it's own Full Round Action.


w01fe01 wrote:
damn, so whats the point of me taking feral combat training and all that?

So you can Flurry with your Natural Attacks. You just can't Flurry with a combination of Unarmed Strikes AND Natural Attacks in order to get extra.

@Voska: You conveniently missed this part of the Flurry of Blows description.

"A monk with natural weapons cannot use such weapons as part of a flurry of blows, nor can he make natural attacks in addition to his flurry of blows attacks."


@voska66 all i see is that its apparently possible to combine natural attacks in my flurry of blows attack (bite, claw, etc) but not that i can use flurry of blows along with other attacks.

weird, i remember seeing posts where people would turn into a lion and do like 8 attacks, was wicked


Pathfinder Starfinder Society Subscriber

This feat was designed with non-gestalt characters in mind. It would be most worthwhile if your natural weapon attack does more damage than your unarmed attack. If the unarmed attack does more damage, then there is not much point in taking this feat.


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w01fe01 wrote:
damn, so whats the point of me taking feral combat training and all that?

So you can take a form with a single HUGE nasty attack (T-Rex perhaps? There's other megafauna options like that) and then flurry with it.

"Oh, a T-Rex has this awesome bite but it can only attack with it once."
"My Monk T-Rex can attack with it 5 times."
*Head asplode*


There actually is one way that you can kind of get around the rule. First, you want to take a form of monk that does not give your flurry of blows (I know sounds weird but stay with me). Next, you take two-weapon fighting which will simulate flurry of blows. Now you can two-weapon fight with your unarmed strikes first and then make attacks with your natural weapons as secondary attacks.

You will have to run the numbers to see if it is worth it. It may be better to just go with flurry of blows and forget the natural weapons.

I don't know if you know this, but you can attack with an unarmed strike in any form.


What mplindustries said. And if you don't think feral combat training is worth it, it might still be a good idea to shapeshift into something as large as possible to get huge unarmed attacks.


hmm, maybe i should just go grappling route with bear hugs or something. i was originally told to go monk/druid gestalt for lots of natural attacks, but what you guys are saying is thats not hte case. so outside of situations like industries trex bite comment, not much reason.

Sovereign Court

A straight druid changing into a dire tiger will probably do the many-attacks thing a lot better, and without fiddly rules.


ok so ive been talking to the DM more, and we have come to the conclusion you guys are right, so that prompts a change in direction.

weapn focus bite+feral combat training to abuse certain animals bite attacks that have secondary features (like poison, grab/trip)

now i just need a list of all animals that have bite attacks.


Bite + Grab is good. Improved Grapple is a great choice when you can alter your size and become say, a dire bear or giant anaconda

Grand Lodge

Dragon Style.


why dragonstyle blackblood? ya i was looking at imp grapple malignor. and possibly imp trip as well (thinking dire wolf here)

Grand Lodge

The effects of Dragon Style will effect the chosen natural attack, due to Feral Combat Training.

Dragon Ferocity will add more later.

This is key to increasing damage with the chosen natural weapon during flurry.


w01fe01 wrote:
why dragonstyle blackblood? ya i was looking at imp grapple malignor. and possibly imp trip as well (thinking dire wolf here)

Extra damage on your first unarmed strike (or natural attack via FCT) and later another bonus on unarmed strikes from the dragon ferocity feat.

Sovereign Court

Yeesh. Monk levels and multiple feats to achieve a small bonus to damage? Wouldn't it be more straightforward to not take monk levels at all, and instead just get Power Attack?

Grand Lodge

Dragon Style can up the damage from Power Attack, with the first Natural Attack during Flurry, as it is a Primary Natural Attack that has x1.5 Strength to damage.

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